JBL upgrade journey

How are you adding the RF 750? Going to use the PAC AP14?

 

Actually using this.
https://www.crutchfield.com/S-xhwMM...2y_57BqVwC3a8dGcLixjgMuUOWypBtCsaAgwAEALw_wcB

 

i would also suggest hertz, hybrid audio technologies, or cdt audio if any local shops stock them. cdt gets lots of praise for being somewhat unique high quality options for a reasonable price. hybrid audio is well known for running away with sound quality car audio competitions. hertz has a very similar tone to jl.

the auto-balancing 'key' feature is a double-edged sword. it does correct the audio signal as needed for a full range, or mid-to-high range output for a typical coaxial main speaker with or without a subwoofer setup.

but it has a 3-position fixed crossover that stops at 120hz, and lacks other manual sound-shaping options that would be required for running 'full active' where the amp directly drives dedicated midbass drivers(typically band-passed with a 50-100hz high pass, and a 1-3khz low pass), and tweeters(typically high passed at what is comfortable for the selected tweeter model, from 1khz-3khz).

the issue is that the key amps are designed specifically to only work in those two arrangements, and you're starting to look at setups that expand beyond that functionality.

i was thinking about this more after posting-- being that you already have the PAC module, you can use that to get the signal out of the factory radio quite easily. the main advantage to the FiX or similar is to get the signal out of the radio.

audio control offers the matrix series of amps that include full-functioned DSP's that would get to where you're headed, and use the PAC that you already have. unfortunately though, they only offer the matrix series in a 4, 5, or 6 channel models, where you'd really require a minimum 7 channels for the dash pairs, front door, rear door, and sub. the 6 channel model does have an output that would allow you to maintain another monoblock amp for the sub.

audison does offer an amp/dsp with 8 or more channels as part of their forza or prima models as well.

but that said, personally i very much prefer running a physically separate DSP to control everything, and run more standard amps. it's the typical "all-in-one" idea. if anything were to fail, or have an issue, the amp must be entirely replaced, which also kills the DSP. but running a physically-separate DSP, and amp, if either part fails, it's easily replaced with another more common off-the-shelf model.

it's the old "tv/dvd-combo" problem. where the combo unit is cheaper at the initial purchase, but if either part fails, you're left with half the functionality, and need to add more gear to work around it, costing more in the long run.

i had demo'd that set a while back, it was part of what sent me down the alternatives...

try to demo both the brands ultra high end, as well as the same brands mid-grade options as well-- many times, the higher end options bulk up their price tags with more unique materials, or special appearance parts, most of which don't actually do much for the sound quality.

 

As mentioned…

Kicker 46CSC674 (6 1/2” Coax speakers) $60


https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/kicker-46csc674-6-1-2”-coax-speakers-60.840022/#post-30065488"

 

Soundman98, (or other knowledgeable people)

Thanks for the input!

I agree on the all-in-one approach. I am old enough to have hooked up a vcr/dvd player to a tv/dvd/vcr with a failed component!

I have been pleasantly pleased with the components I have tried in my truck, and I am really enjoying the journey. I also have other vehicles that could use the “second-string” components in.

Originally, I was seriously considering selling the truck due to the sound quality (yeah, it’s that important to me). But… the upgrade path is quite rewarding/addicting/entertaining.

Given the multiple upgrade paths available (electronics/sound, suspension, tires, lighting, appearance, etc) I am TRYING to diversify my expenditures on the truck (and house).

I have reached out to JL audio for input and I am playing with their Tun software. (Yes, being thorough)

What are your thoughts (obviously depending on in-person trials) of the following options? (Or a mix)

1. DSP
JL Fix-86 $500
JL TwK-88 $550
Alpine PXE-C60-60 $400
Audio control DM-810 $750
Audio control DM-608 $650
Audison bit Nove DRC $700

2.Front channel 6 1/2 component
Audiofrog?
Alpine R2-S65C $350
Alpine R2-S652 $400 (paying for x-over?)
Alpine
Focal 165FSE $600 (popular)
Focal ES 165K2 $750
Focal Performance 165AS3 $600 (3-way)
Hertz CK 165 F $400
Hertz CPK 165 PRO $500
JBL Stadium 62F $450
JL C3-650 $500
Infinity Kappa 603CF $400
Morel Virtus 62 $700
Morel Virtus 603 (3-way) $800
Morel Maximo 603 MKII $500 (3-way)
Others?

(Plan/would like to give each component Its own Active channel)

3. Amplification
Keep Alpine R2-A60F (100x4) $450
-Replace with PXE-C80-88 $800
(50x6+150x2) includes DSP
-or add RA90S $600
(75x4+150x2) no DSP


Audio control

$599 D4.800 AudioControl D-4.800 4/3/2 Channel High Power 800 Watts Car Audio Amplifier W/DSP & Matrixing, Premium High-Fidelity

D4.800 $700
(125x4) with DSP and 2ch pass-through

Audio Control D6.1200 $900
(125x6) with DSP
(Maybe overpowered but 6-ch)

Geez! Lots of amp options!

personally…
-Kind of like Alpine sound, durability, value
-JL Audio very expensive for features
-Audio Control mostly dated options, fear new line will be released as soon as I buy.
- Audison (will hear soon)

 

Man your skill levels are way above mine!

If I am following, you kept all of the original speakers that you replaced the stock ones with, but then did all the extra's you listed in your original post to get all the additional improvements?

The dash tweeters is probably where I would start. I see the GX328s are also 2ohm. Any challenges on wiring them in? I read about the need to trim a bit, but I worry more on the wiring.

 

@RxYoda I just realized the GX328s are coaxial speakers, not dedicated tweeters. How did that sound after just replacing those? Never saw anyone else do this before.

Also, reading reviews on Amazon people are mentioning trimming of the tweeter area and some suggested using "Red Wolf Wiring Harness" to plug into the factory wiring.

Can you expand on the trimming (any pics)? And did you use the red wolf harness or did you make your own connections?

And yet another edit: Did you have to remove the pillars to remove the grill covers for the tweeters? I had read that they have to be removed, but now I am reading some others posts that also used the GX328s and they say they did not have to remove the pillars.

 

the big thing here is going to be finding a software that works for you. every brand of audio company has their own flavor of DSP, even some that aren't even technically known brands, and spans a massive variation in features, complete-ness, and cost. and none or most of them might be horrific for you.

as a distantly-related example. i spent most of high school with my "binder", of anything and everything car audio that i could locate in the early internet era. whenever i was bored in class, i'd pull it out and read/re-read the specifications and features of every single car audio device i could print off, saving years-old crutchfield catalogs... because of that, i was extremely well acquainted with the features and functionality of headunits built by brands like alpine, jvc, kenwood, or pioneer.

years later when i finally had a job and enough loose change to start buying all the things i drooled over, i spent hands-on time with all those head units i wanted. what i found is that i can't operate an alpine head unit to literally save my own life. the functions and the features exist, but none of it works the way i expect or anticipate, which leads to a horrible and frustrating experience that doesn't alter the music or the functionality, but makes me hate using the head unit, and hate the music it plays. i exclusively run pioneer head units now specifically because their menu structure and feature placement works for how i expect it to work.

in your time looking at DSP's, don't get fixated on the brand so much as the software. if you can, spend time in it, familiarizing yourself with how it works, and what does and doesn't work for you.

another member here uses mosconi gear, and i helped him through a few settings a while back-- they're one of the rare one's that the entire DSP software can be downloaded for free, and contains a model-specific demo mode that allows you to mess around consequence-free within the software. many others require an active connection to the DSP before any settings are allowed to be adjusted. some of those you might need to dig into youtube video reviews of setting them up to get an idea of what they can do and how they perform the same functions.

of course, there's also a 3rd option here. paying a shop to install and tune the DSP, and be entirely hands-off. this is just like any other hobby-- it's very easy to get far into the deep end, well beyond one's preference.

not much to say about most of this besides what i already said. i had demo'd alpines older type-x set around the same time as the jl c7 set. personally, in blind a/b testing, i much preferred the cheaper type-S line, i thought it had a more nuanced natural tone, where the type-r, and type-x lines were more about flamboyance and luxury, with their tones seeming to be more 'party mode' than focusing on sonic purity. so much so, i ended up buying a set of the 6.5" coaxials to use in a work vehicle for a few years.

(Plan/would like to give each component Its own Active channel)

probably a 'cart in front of horse' moment. best to figure out how many channels you need first with your preferred speakers, then work towards the number of channels needed, and what kind of power figures are required.

i'm not personally a big fan of jl audio. they tend to be a front-runner in development, but it tends to cost a lot more to get that new tech.
alpine is just sort of middle of the road. not the worst at anything, but not the absolute best either.

audio control, you can relax a little on. they're very 'toyota', where they appear to move at a glacial pace, but every product they release is extremely well-thought out, and tends to sell for many years unchanged. their accubass processors are largely unchanged from when they started selling them back in the early 2000's. their dealer network is typically very well trained on features and functionality because they have time to deep dive into the features instead of memorizing the latest/greatest shiny new release.

audison-- if audio control is toyota, alpine would be ford, jl would be cadillac, and audison would be maybach. personal preference whether the cost premium is worth it. some will argue for it, some will argue against it.

 

Yes, the pillar has tabs that fit into the speaker grill, if I remember correctly.

Don’t have pics of the trimming. I took the coax, put it face down on a piece of cardboard and made a template, then used a dremel tool and box cutter to trim out about 1/2in on one side.

Crutchfield will give you the harness and instructions for wiring. Same price as Amazon with better customer service. Not sure if a referral will get you a discount but I’ll look.

I also packed sound deadening foam down in the pocket under the dash speakers.

 

Thanks you. 2 last questions (at least I think anyway!)

1. Did you disconnect battery since you were touching the pillars with the airbags? I've red some people do that to be safe. No idea if it is needed or not.

2. Can you link to the connector on crutchfield? They don't appear to sell the GX328s so I can't select them to see what they recommend. They used to sell the

$70 GX302 3-1/2" 75W 2-Way GX Series Coaxial Car Audio Loudspeakers

GX302 but says discontinued.

Or link to Amazon if you bought on amazon. Send by PM if needed I realize on here sometimes amazon links get made generic and just sends you to amazon as "Toyota Tacoma Accessories"

 

I did not disconnect the battery I was no where near the connectors. Not a terrible idea though especially if you dare a little nervous/cautious.

if you enter your vehicle in your profile, they just take care of all of that. Exceptional customer service! And I always get packages early!

This is from Amazon

$10 RED WOLF 2 Pin Car Dash Tweeter Speaker Wiring Harness Adapter Compatible with Toyota Tacoma 2021-2023, Highlander Hybrid 2008-2017 for Aftermarket JBL Dash Tweeters Audio Wire Cable Plug Connector

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PV7P7B5

Don’t worry about asking questions.

 

This is not a bad time to run a power wire to your overhead console for future radar detector, dash cam, etc.

 

When you sound deaden the doors, do you put the sound deadening material on the steel part of the door, the inside of the plastic cover, or both?

 

Best results from the inside door surface of the outer door skin (cover as thoroughly as you can without obstructing linkages etc. then the inside of the door on the interior side (the side you can’t see). Then the outside of the interior (what is under your door panel). Be very careful here to allow clearance for the door panel, handle, push pins, and bolts. I also put material in the back side of the door panel (where there was room. That is probably overkill, but anything worth doing is worth overdoing).

 

Am I crazy? I don't see how these would fit. What's the trick?

Even if I Dremel out the corner nearest the stadio.. the mounting holes don't line up.

 

In the details of the thread (and a few others I found) they all say they had to enlarge the opening with a dremel or sharp box cutter. And then you can use one of the previous mounts to secure one side of the speaker but them use a self tapping screw on the other since the second one doesn't line up.

Once you do the cutting and get it installed, the stock grill cover will reinstall over it without any problem.

Search for this speaker and review this thread. There are a handful of pictures and explanations. One person even said they just secured it with one screw and left the second one usecured. Does offroading and hasn't had any issues even with the jarring. I think I am going to buy a pair of these in the fall with cooler weather and give this a try, but plan to secure both sides!

 

Anyone have reservations about cutting into the dash? I know it can't be seen but I'm always weird about irreversible changes to the car. I'm sure someone here has a different view about it I can gain from.

 

I've done it on another vehicle. As long as you are careful and don't cut into anything needed to attach the new speakers, reinstall the grill cover, or the pillar trim you should be fine. Like you said, it will be covered.

For me, I get more worried about removing the trim pieces and breaking a clip or it not going back together right. On my last vehicle the A pillar trim pieces comes loose occasionally because I messed it up upon removal.

 

Just read through this and have been wanting to upgrade to JBL for the longest. I’m also weird about irreversible changes but have done it a couple other times already.

 

I did it. It was a beast. The vent chute on the right side was in the way for me big time.. created a problem. It's a really difficult area to work in too, you can't get an angle at things, and it's impossible to fit a standard Dremel 4000 down there in any sort of way that would help. Maybe if you had a 90 degree die grinder, that would work better.