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Let's see your FJ case swap

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by TACO828, Oct 11, 2016.

  1. Mar 5, 2024 at 12:36 PM
    #2881
    DiseasedAliens

    DiseasedAliens Member

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    Alright so update from my post a couple back.

    I was cleaning the inside of the case with brakleen and dropped the little red straw inside the transfer case :frusty:. So I had no choice but to tear it apart. I was able to remove the rear cover with the transfer case still on the truck and while I was in there I checked up on the internals. No metal shavings. Synchro keys still in place. However, I think the issue is something else. The planetary gear set appears to have heated up enough to cause discoloration.
    upload_2024-3-5_12-33-16.jpg
    and it looks like the hi-lo shift fork is rubbing on the planet carrier when in hi gear. I think this is causing the oil to wear out and become diluted with fine metal shavings which is causing the synchro issues I was initially worried about.

    Why would the shift form interfere with the planet carrier? It’s installed in the correct orientation and all that. Is the detent spring not strong enough? Should I just make sure it doesn’t slide all the way that direction or something?

    also what’s up with the rear half of the case looking like it’s cracking and falling apart?
    upload_2024-3-5_12-36-3.jpg
     
  2. Mar 5, 2024 at 5:43 PM
    #2882
    gtrotter07

    gtrotter07 Well-Known Member

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    I did a dry fit, so no rtv yet and I can easily disassemble. The shift rods fully seat with the levers and by hand with a "satisfying" engagement. ...and yes I did grind that nub off. Although I have done dumber things before lol. All I can think is the shift collar where the brass synchro is, isn't lining up properly. Kinda like when guys have to go back and forth turning the wheels to get 4wd to engage.

    EDIT: Would it be possible that I flipped the shift collar upside down on install? I don't have a Pic to reference what is right side up.
     
  3. Mar 5, 2024 at 5:55 PM
    #2883
    Littles

    Littles Stupid is as stupid does.

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    My first thought last night was actually that the shift collar might be flipped, but thought to try the non-invasive stuff and check shifters first.

    Here's a picture I have to help:
    20190804_162140.jpg

    Assembly diagram:

    https://www.purefjcruiser.com/docs/.../VF2A Transfer/Transfer Assembly/02000510.pdf
     
  4. Mar 5, 2024 at 5:59 PM
    #2884
    gtrotter07

    gtrotter07 Well-Known Member

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  5. Mar 6, 2024 at 7:23 AM
    #2885
    gtrotter07

    gtrotter07 Well-Known Member

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    @Littles Got it! I had flipped the shift collar. As a side note for those reading this in the future.
    1. Use zip ties to hold those three little keys in while sliding the ring down. 2. Don't wait 6 months between piddling with gears...you will forget.
     
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  6. Mar 6, 2024 at 9:35 AM
    #2886
    Littles

    Littles Stupid is as stupid does.

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    @DiseasedAliens

    Daniel- First off, nice clean looking install on the shifters! I'm well out of college but also did this twice within the last 5 years in my old apartment. So I can definitely appreciate the kitchen mechanic in you. You do what you have to do. You're the first person that I've ever heard of splitting a tcase while it's still in the truck. Not sure I'd do that personally, but if you're bench pressing this thing in every time without a jack, I understand the thought process.

    Reading over your posts...I'm not saying you don't have a problem with your tcase, but I'm not convinced you do based on what you've shared so far. Here are some of my initial thoughts:

    -The coloration (assuming you mean the dark color) on that low range gear that interfaces with the oil pump does not look unusual to me. I can dig up some pics, but it looks pretty consistent with what I saw last time I had my cases apart.
    -The appearance of what looks akin to pottery crazing on the inside of your tcase also does not look unusual to me. I have seen that on all of them I've opened up. Don't loose sleep over it.
    -I would expect things to feel / sound crunchy if you're switching from 2-4 or back under load. Drive train components generally don't like to do that. I realize all you can do is back off the throttle with an auto, but I'm always on the clutch when moving levers and it's buttery smooth every time.

    Those things don't concern me. The things that worry me the most are your comments about the color of the oil, and that you occasionally hear what you refer to as grinding in conjunction with your statement that you think the shift collar is rubbing.

    -The sticks definitely transmit some noise into the cab, but I would describe it more as rattling than grinding. Grinding would worry me.
    Is it grinding or rattling?
    Do you see clear wear marks somewhere that you believe are coming from the shift collar? I saw some arbitrary marks on the gear that could be light reflection, but did not see anything clear in the photos that looked like the shift collar could be hitting something.

    -The lack of metal shavings in the dirty oil could potentially be explained by the location of the magnet behind the plate for the oil pump. That could be collecting metal material you're not seeing.
    When you did the twin stick, did you inspect the magnet behind the oil pump? May not be a bad idea to do so if you believe there is grinding occurring.

    My gut is, you are probably more worried than you need to be, but much of what you've shared so far is subjective in terms of oil color and sounds you're hearing. Trying to gather more information and give you some direction.

    Any of you auto guys out there have thoughts?
     
  7. Mar 6, 2024 at 12:45 PM
    #2887
    DiseasedAliens

    DiseasedAliens Member

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    that part wasn't actually too bad. I removed the front drive flange, the shifter assembly, and then wiggled out the rear half of the case with the gearset and chain. I did it this way mainly due to that one bolt that impacts the transmission mount and the fact i don't have a floor jack, or an impact wrench. So it is A LOT easier to get the flange nuts off with the transmission aiding me.

    It is definitely more of a persistent grinding than a rattling, but like i said it is not consistent and i feel like as the oil heats up the noise diminishes. I think somewhere way back in this thread it was referred to as a "mini bench grinder"

    If you look at the oil pump gear on the planet carrier, the light coloration around the tips of the teeth is clear wear, not a trick of the eye. But i did not see a corresponding wear mark on the shift fork so i'm not sure what that is about.

    and yes the most recent time i pulled it apart, i checked the magnet and it was bad. So there was definitely some grinding occurring.

    There are two things that i think may be causing all this.

    One, the automatic shift assembly may not be trimmed sufficiently and its blocking shift lever for the H/L rail from returning to the H position fully. I'm not sure exactly the effects of it being 1-2mm out of place but it's something i think may be a potential cause.

    And two, When attaching the custom levers to the cut-off ends of the FROR shifter, i drilled some holes and tapped for set screws like other's have in this thread. I did this while it was in the truck and did my best to make sure that none of the shavings found their way into the case. But i also found the FROR supplied boot to have stretched around the levers and thus not sealing them. Some shavings may have fallen down into the case through there before i put a couple rubber hose clamps in the seal that up.

    I just resealed the case this morning and will test drive later today or tomorrow morning and see how it feels.
     
  8. Mar 6, 2024 at 1:55 PM
    #2888
    DiseasedAliens

    DiseasedAliens Member

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    @6 gearT444E said

    Is there a better description of the sound they transmit? Is a constant whirring normal?
     
  9. Mar 6, 2024 at 6:43 PM
    #2889
    DiseasedAliens

    DiseasedAliens Member

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    Update on the test drive.

    it shifts much smoother. Night and day difference. While I had it apart I rebuilt the synchronizer and it definitely feels like it is actually synchronizing now. When it comes to the noise. It is significantly quieter. The noise is still present but I have to completely turn off the music to hear it even at highway speeds. The sticks also seem to rattle less.

    so after the new oil had a chance to work its way into the cracks and crevices the ‘grinding’ significantly reduced and it’s now closer to a light rattle with hints of whirring.

    I’m thinking about this way too damn hard

    That’s the short term. We’ll see the long term results.
     
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2024
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  10. Mar 8, 2024 at 12:14 PM
    #2890
    FishingInSand

    FishingInSand Well-Known Member

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    Yeah I can hear it spinning or something slightly of it's under like 20 in a residential neighborhood, but I seemed to have forgotten the noise I hear driving my manual mustang so it's the new normal and I'm fine with it.

    However, after 2 months now I still can't get rid of a gear oil smell. I had it deep detailed once already but I can't quite get rid of it. The floor hole is sealed with a shifter plate and RTV, even RTV around where the stick shift goes through the plate.

    Anyone deal with something similar?
    PXL_20240120_035212402.MP.jpg
     
  11. Mar 8, 2024 at 12:23 PM
    #2891
    DiseasedAliens

    DiseasedAliens Member

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    I had a gear oil smell problem with the twin sticks. But I see you’re using the stock shifter. For me, it was the boot stretching around the shift lever and oil wicking its way up. When I put a hose clamp on the boot it helped. I also routed the breather to the engine bay with some fuel line. And I used flex tape to seal against the floor better.

    if you’re using the stock shifter I may try putting some grease in the assembly

    and also make sure you connect the stock breather if you haven’t.
     
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  12. Mar 8, 2024 at 12:27 PM
    #2892
    FishingInSand

    FishingInSand Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, I'll extend the breather out as it's just still around the area next to the trans, and add some flex seal since I was hoping the RTV would help with it being an uneven surface.

    Hopefully that helps, gear oil is my most unfavorable fluid now with how it just won't go away no matter what lol
     
  13. Mar 8, 2024 at 12:38 PM
    #2893
    DiseasedAliens

    DiseasedAliens Member

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    Yeah when I was getting the gear oil smell I was not happy about it but there are ways to fix it. I don’t smell it at all now. Thank god
     
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  14. Mar 8, 2024 at 12:47 PM
    #2894
    Ricardo13x

    Ricardo13x YT: @UrbanOpsOffRoad IG: @urban.ops.offroad

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    random stuff. Oh! and converted to non ADD 4x4.
    No oil smells when I did mine back in 04/2021.

    IMG_2137.jpg IMG_2143.jpg
     
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  15. Mar 8, 2024 at 2:03 PM
    #2895
    FishingInSand

    FishingInSand Well-Known Member

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    The flexseal seems to be the common denominator. I knew I had to have done something off because I'm sure I'd have heard about a gear oil smell from others lol
     
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  16. Mar 17, 2024 at 6:18 PM
    #2896
    AlHago

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  17. Mar 21, 2024 at 6:22 PM
    #2897
    fatfurious2

    fatfurious2 IG: great_white_taco

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    This is clean. I just scooped one from ebay for $18. Adding to my pile of parts
     
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  18. Mar 21, 2024 at 10:37 PM
    #2898
    TacoTuesday1

    TacoTuesday1 Well-Known Member

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    wow. Good find. You're making it look easy.

    Picked up an FJ tcase, the required auto I believe
    taco is 6MT. Probably also gonna need
    -ADD delete tube, shaft, and whatever else
    -twinstick shifter and whatever's required to cut, bend, weld that to fit
    -figuring out where to put the twin stick. 6MT interior is a bit different. Behind the shifter is basically a tray with 3 cup holders
    -maybe a non twin stick FJ shifter for temporary initial install
    and anything else I may be missing

    cut could probably be done with hole saw, insulation mat, seam sealer, paint
    not sure how folks are marking the position where the hole must be cut but I'm sure it's not that hard
    maybe sandwich the right size socket in between, up to the underside of the metal, and trace it

    cheap welder might not be strong enough to customize twin stick shaft
    but may be possible to drive with the console removed, to someone who has a stronger welder
     
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2024
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  19. Mar 31, 2024 at 3:41 PM
    #2899
    Operator8

    Operator8 Well-Known Member

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    Well I found this one for $310, had 77k on the FJ. It was in Loveland, but I at least got them to bring it down to Denver.

    IMG_6647.jpg
     
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  20. Mar 31, 2024 at 6:14 PM
    #2900
    Littles

    Littles Stupid is as stupid does.

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    I'd say you did alright :thumbsup:
     
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