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Lets talk tuning...

Discussion in 'Audio & Video' started by Zac of all trades, Jun 10, 2016.

  1. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:42 AM
    #41
    Aw9d

    Aw9d That one guy

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    Honestly your best bet is to use an O-Scope to tune the HU/Amps so you aren't creating distortion. Each setup is different and some of those features on a HU like 'xbass' just create issue.

    For example, my Pioneer HU can go up to max volume, 40, without distortion on the mids/highs. However the sub, set to 0db is distorting at vol 40. Drop the sub DB's down -4 to ensure no clipping. Then move to the amp, figure out how hard you can push it, etc.

    Once you are certain you are not creating any distortion then it's just a factor of making it sound good to you. Everyone's ear's are different. My biggest concern is not frying out equipment due to distortion.
     
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  2. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:42 AM
    #42
    Zac of all trades

    Zac of all trades [OP] FWP Fabrication Vendor

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    How do you like the Image Dynamics Sub?? How many watts are you pushing to it?
     
  3. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:44 AM
    #43
    Zac of all trades

    Zac of all trades [OP] FWP Fabrication Vendor

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    So the RTA is used while you are playing music. You will see the different sound frequencies at the bottom, adjust the appropriate frequencies on your EQ to give more or less on the peaks and pits.
     
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  4. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:45 AM
    #44
    12TRDTacoma

    12TRDTacoma Ocean TRD

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    I mean I could always go and replace the equipment, it is cheap enough for me but I don't want to continue replacing it due to negligence.

    I have never o scoped audio equipment before. I wasn't really aware you could. How do you go and hook that up to your speakers?
     
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  5. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:45 AM
    #45
    rob feature

    rob feature Tacos!

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    At the moment,

    sub LPF = 80 Hz
    Midbass HPF = 100 Hz
    Passive XO @ approximately 4.5 kHz

    Coming soon,

    sub LPF = 70 Hz or less
    Midbass HPF = 90 Hz, LPF 2 kHz
    Tweeter HPF = 2.5 kHz
     
  6. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:47 AM
    #46
    Zac of all trades

    Zac of all trades [OP] FWP Fabrication Vendor

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    I was just playing with it. It has been like that for a few days now. Going to adjust it here in a bit to get rid of the overlays.
     
  7. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:50 AM
    #47
    gkomo

    gkomo Well-Known Member

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    I love the Image Dynamics sub. I bought one back in highschool (2002 timeframe) and loved that one so much I replaced it two weeks ago with the same model (they beefed it up A LOT since then too. The magnet is about twice as big as my old one and the rubber extrusion surround is roughly twice as beefy looking as well). The Alpine is a 500w rms @ 2ohm amp. TBH i'm not sure how voltage relates to watts. If my Bass EQ is set at 0dB and my gain is set at about 30% I don't know how that translates into actual power my sub is receiving.
     
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  8. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:51 AM
    #48
    rob feature

    rob feature Tacos!

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    Well, if you're tuning on the fly like that, you'd want to use pink noise.

    And as far as a flat frequency response goes, have you ever heard a car with a flat FR? It sounds AWFUL
     
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  9. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:52 AM
    #49
    Aw9d

    Aw9d That one guy

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    His company may have won 140 world championships, but that doesn't mean the guy you are talking to knows anything.


    I have my crossovers set as following: (From what I had written down, this may have changed. I haven't messed with my stereo in about a year or so)

    HU Crossover:
    Front 8db slope 80hz
    Rear: no rear speakers
    Sub: 24db slope 63hz

    Focal Crossovers:

    Woofer: 6db slope
    Tweeter: 12db slope
    ----Tweeter -3db drop (Focals have very bright tweeters)

    Sub amp:
    Gain: 1
    No filters enabled
    Set to 80hz.



    As for tuning with an O-Scope it's super, super, super fucking easy to do. Just takes time. You start with your HU (connect to RCA's) Then you connect to the speaker outputs of your amps. You never really need to touch your speakers with it because if you know your amp isn't distorting at any volume your speakers are safe.
     
  10. Jun 10, 2016 at 10:58 AM
    #50
    Zac of all trades

    Zac of all trades [OP] FWP Fabrication Vendor

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    True. He said that they have 3 guys that tune there. He was one, he also said that each person tunes a different method but ultimately tune and get the same results. I am open to methods and opinions though. I will listen and try for myself rather than just take someones word for it.
     
  11. Jun 10, 2016 at 11:00 AM
    #51
    rob feature

    rob feature Tacos!

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    This. It's not mythology at work here. It's physics. Pretty basic stuff too.
     
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  12. Jun 10, 2016 at 11:19 AM
    #52
    Zac of all trades

    Zac of all trades [OP] FWP Fabrication Vendor

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    Has anyone heard anything about reversing speaker wires/RCAs to see if you get a different/better sound? Im pretty sure that i read that somewhere. Im not sure that i like that idea though. I mean why would they indicate + & - on the terminals then....
     
  13. Jun 10, 2016 at 11:21 AM
    #53
    rob feature

    rob feature Tacos!

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    PRS 80 is clean all the way up too. Makes my life easier :D

     
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  14. Jun 10, 2016 at 11:23 AM
    #54
    rob feature

    rob feature Tacos!

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    You can reverse phase with the DSP.

    Are you using any sort of passive crossover anymore or wired straight to the amp?
     
  15. Jun 10, 2016 at 11:30 AM
    #55
    Zac of all trades

    Zac of all trades [OP] FWP Fabrication Vendor

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    Straight wired to the amp.

    Head unit to DSP,
    then DSP to Sub and door speaker amps.

    Headunit set to 0, amp's crossovers are off (set to full)

    I will see about reversing the phase. Gotta learn how to do that...
     
  16. Jun 10, 2016 at 11:36 AM
    #56
    Firef4ly

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    I used multiple videos to figure out how to correctly use an o-scope, but if you are looking for something quick and dirty this video should do it for you.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21E2YM_G21A

    Long story short you need to hook whichever oscilloscope you use up to the positive and negative leads for each channel and check for clipping one channel at a time. From what I see online, people like to use a test cd with tones at 40hz (for bass speakers) and 1000hz (for treble speakers) recorded at 0 decibels and -5 to -8 decibels.
     
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  17. Jun 10, 2016 at 11:42 AM
    #57
    rob feature

    rob feature Tacos!

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    You'll can just sit there and flip the phase on each individual driver while you're listening and see what difference it makes.

    You may want to consider some tweeter protection as well. HAT may be able to recommend something. I'm using a 100 uF non-polar electrolytic capacitor in series...bout a buck fiddy each at Parts Express.
     
  18. Jun 10, 2016 at 12:06 PM
    #58
    12TRDTacoma

    12TRDTacoma Ocean TRD

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    Awesome info! I'll take a look at this shortly! Thank you!

    Im using the passive crossovers which were supplied for the rockfords. They are really nice.
     
  19. Jun 11, 2016 at 6:27 AM
    #59
    rob feature

    rob feature Tacos!

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    I got the 1st gen time-aligned for the first time yesterday.

    I didn't think I'd like losing double DIN, but got used to it in maybe an hour.

    [​IMG]

    For anyone wishing they had more ability for system tweaks, this head unit delivers. Not only will it do time alignment, but also has separate left and right 16 band graphic EQ and a 3-way active crossover with selectable slopes. I noticed a drastic noise reduction from the Kenwood as well. Noise floor is almost nonexistent. The signal is super clean all the way to max volume & gives 4.8v at the top.

    This thing has an autotune feature as well, but I just started with flat everything and set everything manually. Time alignment was set with a tape measure and can be switched from cm to inches in the head unit to avoid conversions. As the head unit only considers one source per channel in standard mode (I'll be using network mode soon), distance measurements were taken halfway between the woofer & tweeter.

    Anyway, there's a reason I'm droning on about all that. As mentioned in the first sentence, this truck has never been time aligned before...never had the capability. The difference is really astounding. Any echo effects are gone. The sub was badly delayed before. But the really cool thing that just happened while I was sitting there is the drivers just disappeared. With just a few turns of the knob, the speaker locations became undetectable. There's still sibilance in the tweeter, but I can't tell where it is now. Sound stage is still lower than I care for, but it's there and it's at least the width of the truck. I'm going to try poking around with the timings to see if I can bring it up a hair. Err if anyone else has a trick for that sort of thing...
     
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  20. Jun 11, 2016 at 8:07 AM
    #60
    6spd

    6spd Well-Known Member

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    I have a pioneer 80prs going to a jl xd600/6, and zed minotaur. Drivers are:

    Fountek 89ex 3.5" widebanders: 500 - 20000hz 12db/oct
    BC 8nld51 8" midbass: 80 - 500 12db/oct
    (2) sd3 10s: 0 - 63hz 6db/oct

    It took me approx 6 months to tune everything to my liking, left and right individual eq settings(cutting the peaks on the right, and raising some dips on the left to get that center image flowing from on top of the dash.). Everything done by ear, no o-scope or multimeter used or needed.

    Side note: the PRS unit can move the listening position so the T/A settings can be reversed from left to right, but will not do so with the eq. That said, one thing with the stock speaker locations of the Tacoma, the steering wheel blocks the driver tweeter location so prohibits the reversal of this setting.

    Tuning is subjective, and my setup will probably not suit another user, and vice versa.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2016

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