Lifted Gen 2 Aligns, but won't hold toe. Thoughts?

I have a 2008 4x4 access cab with persistent toe alignment problems (tire wear) that I cannot figure out. It will align, and all parts look and feel OK, but won't hold toe numbers for more than a few miles of easy driving before the toe is screwed up and it is chewing up tires.

Setup:
4x4 access cab 4.0L 2008, 61,800 miles
ARB Front Bumper
8k winch with synthetic rope
EDIT: LR UCAs, set on "neutral"
OME 886, OME shocks. Trim packer on driver's side.
Remaining suspension components are factory and original

I can take the truck to an alignment shop, and they have no trouble aligning it. Everything comes out within spec. It drives and steers fine, no issues. It's the toe that is always bad when I hear the tires scrubbing and take it in. It does not matter how gently I drive- the toe goes bad almost immediately. Camber and caster are usually still good when I take it back in, but toe will be out by .10 to .23 on each side. Usually negative toe on each side.

I thought about replacing the outer tie rods and lower balljoints because they are cheap and it has had almost 62K miles, more than 40k lifted and stressed like this. Everything seems tight and none of the techs think anything has gone bad, but I can't think of what else to do.

It hasn't been my daily driver for three years, so I can troubleshoot if needed. It's always driven fine, I am just tired of chewing up expensive 255/85r16 tires.

Suggestions?

 

If you are lifted they shouldn't be aligning it to Toyota Spec. What numbers are you getting out of the alignment???

 

Ah, OK. I think they are still trying to bring it to factory settings. Here are my last two attempts (700 miles of gentle on-road driving in between):

#1

Before:
Camber: .2 Left, .7 Right
Caster: 2.6 Left, 2.9 Right
Toe: -.12 Left, -.10 Right
Total Toe: -.22

After:
Camber: .3 Left, .4 Right
Caster: 2.1 Left, 2.3 Right
Toe: .0 Left, .03 Right
Total Toe: .03

#2

Before:
Camber: .2 Left, .2 Right
Caster: 2.1 Left, 2.1 Right
Toe: -.14 Left, .23 Right

After:
Camber: .2 Left, .3 Right
Caster: 2.1 Left, 2.1 Right
Toe: .05 Left, .05 Right


Thanks

 

Order light racing UCAs

 

How are your alignment cam tabs? If those are flat it may be allowing the cams to move and throwing you out of alignment.

Just a thought and something worth checking.

 

That was a mistake in the OP. I do have LR UCAs. I must have had Allpro on the mind last night when I wrote the post.

They are set to "D" or neutral with the square side of the tab facing out.

I'll take a look and get a couple pictures. Do you think they would allow the toe to be negatively affected while the other numbers remained OK?

 

Honestly, I'm not sure. When it comes to alignment I don't know what adjustments change what. However, if they set your alignment properly and then with light driving after a few miles it changes to me it sounds like it could be:
The cam tabs being so flat it doesn't hold the cams in the correct positioning.
The bolts not being properly torqued.
Something else weird is going on.

I don't know what else could change in such a short period of time to cause this.

 

No, if the cams move they will throw everything off, but it looks like it did. The “after #1” to “before #2” had changed all settings.

Otherwise I’d say this has to be an issue with the steering rack/tierods or the tech not tightening the locknuts on the rod ends.

 

OK thanks. There's no (to my mind) excessive play in the tie rods or steering, but there is some. I think the lower balljoints could also be at fault and will jack up the front end tomorrow to double check everything. The locknuts are tight now, and I can feel that the toe is already out again driving it.

I'll also take it in later this week (have a lifetime alignment on this truck) to try again to see what I come up with. It's been doing this for almost 40,000 miles and was even worse before the LR UCAs, I just used to rotate the tires and align every 3k miles while it was a DD and Cooper STs were cheap. Just put some new ST MAXX on it and don't want to chew them up right away for no reason.

Cams:





Tie rod end Lock nuts:





Frame was recently coated from the Frame Rust Recall Campaign. The dealer went a little crazy and coated everything to dripping except the exhaust and drive shafts.

 

Cams look fine

 

Yeah they seem to be in good shape. I'll lift the front end up today to see if there is any other play somewhere in the tie rods, steering rack, or lower balljoints. Could be that the LR UCA balljoint assemblies are sliding in the slots, but I torqued the shit out of them, so that does not seem likely.

 

Lifted the front end and checked play...tie rod end ball joint boots are going back and are starting to leak, so I'll replace the tie rod ends, re-torque the LR UCA balljoints, and have it re-aligned.

If factory spec is not what I should be shooting for with ~2.5" suspension lift, what is desirable?

Thanks

 

I’d request the caster be set at the upper end of spec with camber set to the lower end of spec. Toe is still best to set at factory spec.

 

Have you checked the steering rack mounting bolts and rubber mounts to see if they are loose or the rubber is worn?

 

No, I haven't. I plan to do the tie rod ends this weekend and will check it out then.