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Looking at an 04, question about Frame Rot

Discussion in '1st Gen. Tacomas (1995-2004)' started by BLKRCAT, Jan 7, 2020.

  1. Jan 7, 2020 at 11:14 AM
    #1
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    New here (obviously), been lurking a ton to read up about the frame rot situation on these old first gen Tacos. Writing from Canada and I'm looking for a truck to commute with that would perform great in the winter. Taco seems to fit the bill.

    Lots of great information but one thing that I was curious about that isn't really answered.

    Were there better years for frame rot or was it more or less a blanket issue that effected all years?

    Some trucks that have had Krown or oil spraying every year still seem to rot out just as quick as those that go untreated. It seems that the frame could look great one year and be completely junk the next. Some videos I've seen confirmed this but is that common or isolated?

    What seems to be the failure rate? Lots of research points to failure being a possibility and something to watch and take care of but doesn't really paint a picture of "out of 10 trucks, how many would fail". Not sure if this is something anyone can comment on?

    I'm looking at an 04 on the weekend and it could be promising since the truck was stored indoors for an extended period of time. I'll have it inspected by my mechanic but more or less looking to get some opinions from owners or people who have been in the taco community for an extended period on these specific areas.

    Any help or insight would be really appreciated. Love the look of these trucks and it fits the bill perfectly for reliability, 4x4, ground clearance, fuel mileage, etc.
     
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  2. Jan 7, 2020 at 11:45 AM
    #2
    Wyoming09

    Wyoming09 Well-Known Member

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    They will all fail sooner or later if exposed to Winter Chemicals

    If you have a Good frame and keep after things no reason it will not last as long as the rest of the truck

    It is buying a truck being unaware of the problem that is a problem.

    No one year is better then another
     
  3. Jan 7, 2020 at 12:12 PM
    #3
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the reply. Good to know. My main concern with the frame issue is that it totally seems like even with preventative maintenance the frames seem to still end up failing at a rapid rate. It's hard to know if that's hype or a real issue
     
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  4. Jan 7, 2020 at 12:46 PM
    #4
    MagtechPA

    MagtechPA Thor

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    As long as you're in an area where they use salt on the roads, it's a real issue.

    My Taco has 225k miles but has zero rot on the frame because it came from Portland, OR, where they don't treat the roads with salt. Now that I have it here in PA, it will require vigilant maintenance and treatments with Fluid Film and other products to keep it from succumbing to rust. It's just the nature of the environment.
     
  5. Jan 7, 2020 at 12:50 PM
    #5
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    It's something that we're used to here. Usually it's a good idea to oil spray every fall just before the winter. I know some places also offer spring oil spraying as well. If the frame is in good shape I hope that is enough to keep it going.

    Really jealous of those west coast guys. So many cool cars/trucks you can get out there because stuff lasts way longer.
     
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  6. Jan 7, 2020 at 4:48 PM
    #6
    jbrandt

    jbrandt Made you look

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    Just so this doesn't go on too long... You say an '05 in the thread title, but talk of 1st gens. An '05 is the first year of a 2nd gen. It's essentially a completely different truck, but it does suffer from the same frame rot issues as the 1st gens. I bet 3rd gens have the same issue, they just haven't been around long enough yet to rust in half...

    To answer your question, though, no, there isn't a better or worse year. All the frames are essentially identical. If we're talking about the trucks in the rust belt (not the industrial revolution "rust belt", but the frame rot "rust belt" lol), the frame coating is inadequate for preventing rust form forming. It's not unique to Toyota though. I challenge you to find me a car that lasts 20+ years in those conditions and doesn't rust out.

    It mostly depends on how much the owner drives on the winter roads with the brine chemicals, and how good the person was at treating and preventing rust. It really just comes down to thoroughly washing the chemicals off the frame (inside and out!), and keeping it as dry as possible.

    Just like with human cancer, truck cancer needs to be addressed early. An once of prevention = a pound of cure. Most people gravitate towards seasonal Fluid Film treatments. But that's ONLY if you don't have rust, or if you've removed all the rust. FF just helps prevent new rust from forming because the water/brine can't touch the frame.
     
  7. Jan 7, 2020 at 4:58 PM
    #7
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    sorry! Yes I’m aware that 05 is the gen up. I revised my post but I must have forgot to change the title.

    Really appreciate the insight. Kind of confirms my thoughts and understanding of what to expect.

    it seems that a lot of these frames that were rusting out prematurely seemed to be untreated, in areas that don’t see salt or brine.

    for a daily, ill be washing daily or every other day in the winter and oil spraying annually so that seems like it’ll be a good regiment to making everything last.
    Thanks!
     
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  8. Jan 8, 2020 at 8:55 AM
    #8
    jbrandt

    jbrandt Made you look

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    The other area these frames (and all frames) rust is coastal areas. If anything, those places are worse because they are covered in salty air/water 365 days a year vs. just winder time...

    As long as you start with a rust free frame, all you gotta do is keep the salt off it. Washing and fluid film treatments seam to be the best remedy.

    I live in CA, and I do exactly nothing to my frame, and the most rust I have is a light discoloration from where my tires used to rub the frame and wore the paint off. Other than that, it's just dirt.
     
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  9. Jan 8, 2020 at 12:36 PM
    #9
    jbrandt

    jbrandt Made you look

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    looks fine to me. Have you pinged it with a hammer yet?
     
  10. Jan 8, 2020 at 1:47 PM
    #10
    GQ7227

    GQ7227 mw survivor

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    black woolWax, green IFC, borlaCB, custom Line-X PC drums, skid, nuts, hooks, 1/4 silver frame...
    just a nice hard tap of the finger
    but IDK what's up with it
    i just don't
     
  11. Jan 9, 2020 at 7:31 AM
    #11
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    I'll be checking out the truck on Sunday. Will report back, possibly with some pictures. I know how it can be annoying when a random account pops up asks a question then disappears so I'll follow up!
     
  12. Jan 9, 2020 at 7:38 AM
    #12
    MinookaBlues

    MinookaBlues Well-Known Member

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    Where did you see Tacoma frames rotting out if sprayed with Krown every year? I'm in my 6th Pennsylvania winter and have had my frame sprayed with Krown every year and it is still black and solid.
     
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  13. Jan 9, 2020 at 7:52 AM
    #13
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    https://youtu.be/7e23Ft4vtos?t=50

    this is the video I saw. The guy explains (and it's my understanding) that the frame was krowned every year since he's owned it and when he took the truck in for inspection after he was notified about the recall the frame was fine. Toyota cleaned and coated the frame with their anti corrosion solution and in a dramatically short period of time the frame started to show signs of failure.

    It's unknown if the failure was caused by the nature of the frame and krowning the frame did nothing, or if the failure was caused by toyota and them removing the krown to put their concoction on it.

    Edit:
    My toy is a 91 EF Hatch. It's a Canadian car and the original owner dailied the car until I bought it (i'm the second owner). He had it oil sprayed every year and the thing has an ungodly amount of rustproofing on it. Limited visible rust but underneath the black coating rust can hide. Bodywork is on my list of stuff to do to the car at some point but I'm pretty scared to open that can of worms. Those old Hondas are very prone to rusting out, similar to the situation with these frames. I wouldn't be surprised if the Krown was hiding some of the rust, but I wouldn't expect it to rust out so rapidly. My toy is almost 30 years old and shows similar rot in some small areas as that frame that's WAY thicker metal and much newer.

    Edit Edit: Pics of my project for those interested
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2020
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  14. Jan 9, 2020 at 7:55 AM
    #14
    GQ7227

    GQ7227 mw survivor

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    black woolWax, green IFC, borlaCB, custom Line-X PC drums, skid, nuts, hooks, 1/4 silver frame...
    his garage looks cold as heck!
     
  15. Jan 9, 2020 at 8:00 AM
    #15
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    It looks chilly but you can hear a propane heater in the background. I'm sure where he's standing it's nice and toasty. :canada:
     
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  16. Jan 9, 2020 at 8:01 AM
    #16
    GQ7227

    GQ7227 mw survivor

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    black woolWax, green IFC, borlaCB, custom Line-X PC drums, skid, nuts, hooks, 1/4 silver frame...
    i can see his breathe, that is why i thought its cold as heck!
     
  17. Jan 9, 2020 at 8:02 AM
    #17
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    I think he mentioned he's in northern Ontario. If it's a dry cold it looks cold but doesn't feel too bad. I find when you have a damp cold, the temperature doesn't have to be that low but you really feel it in your bones
     
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  18. Jan 9, 2020 at 8:19 AM
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    MinookaBlues

    MinookaBlues Well-Known Member

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    I have more faith in the Krown Rustproofing than I do in the CRC crap that Toyota sprays on the frame and will continue to have it Krowned every year...I"ll keep an eye on it and check it. One thing in this video is the guy said he was under his vehicle all the time.....and yet he never noticed huge holes in his frame?? He also says at the 9:05 mark that the Krown Does protect it from rusting? Everything I've read about Krown and Fluid Film says they protect against rust. So far after 6 winters my frame is showing NO signs of rust and when I hit it it is still solid... and this is in the salt heavy state of Pennsylvania.
     
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  19. Jan 9, 2020 at 8:26 AM
    #19
    GQ7227

    GQ7227 mw survivor

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    black woolWax, green IFC, borlaCB, custom Line-X PC drums, skid, nuts, hooks, 1/4 silver frame...
    my relative has an '11 single cab that was undercoated by dealer when new on the western fringes of the salt belt, Missouri River area
    it has 44k miles roughly
    the coating has cracked and peeled near the Cat and is rusting already in spots under that rubber coating

    the dealers here have not ever heard of FF or anything similar but their rubbery undercoating i guess?
     
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  20. Jan 9, 2020 at 8:28 AM
    #20
    BLKRCAT

    BLKRCAT [OP] Well-Known Member

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    I also have pretty high faith in Krown. In Ontario we salt and brine a lot during the winter months. My family drives a lot and krown is a common household name.

    The video is strange and has been weighing on my mind since I know how good of a product krown is but the way it's presented in the video the only takeaways I can come up with are, Krown cant penetrate the trouble areas well enough to prevent the frame from rotting from the inside out or Toyota seriously dropped the ball by treating the frame and the whole thing just unravelled at a scary pace or a combination of the two.

    There also could be a possibility that whoever was Krowning his truck didn't do a great job or didn't use enough to fully penetrate in the hard to reach areas.
     
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