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Moog Ball Joint ( Why the hate?)

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by PandaYota, Nov 6, 2023.

  1. Nov 6, 2023 at 9:30 PM
    #1
    PandaYota

    PandaYota [OP] Well-Known Member

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    To the guy saying just get OEM or get Mevotech. I just want to know why? Did you have a Moog Ball Joint fail on you? I’m gonna stop you right there. Did you have a K80827 Moog Ball Joint fail on you? Not an old style. Not a failure due to not using locktite, I’m not talking about a failure of improper install. I’m talking about a failure of the ball joint itself. The point of this post is to understand “factually” why you don’t recommend Moog. Just saying “Look it up, or “I saw a video where someone cut one open and compared it to OEM and Moog had plastic internals” does not count. Dirt King uses Moog Ball Joints “The problem solver kind”, in their $1800 LCA. I called them and they highly recommend them. The only negative things I can find about Moog is other parts that are not the same style Ball Joint, or someone just saying something like, it didn’t fit. This post is for the guys and galls that have Moog Ball Joints and can’t attest to the quality. I am trying to understand what makes OEM better and why. How many miles have you gotten on Moogs. Toyota OEM parts fail, Moog parts fail. I get that, but if y’all are paying $1800 for Dirt King LCA over OEM Toyota LCA then you should pitch in. I’d like to see someone here with over 50,000 miles on a LCA with “Problem Solver” style ball joint.
     
  2. Nov 6, 2023 at 9:38 PM
    #2
    I Liquid I

    I Liquid I Well-Known Member

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    Unsure if you also want to see the good experiences... but at least on my end, I have 4 Tacos (2006, 2006, 2009, 2017) all of them have had a ball joint or tie rod replaced at some point and it has been replaced with a Moog "Problem Solver" grade part. I did have one upper ball joint fail on one, then again, that truck never stopped and grease was probably due by the time it failed, so it was likely my fault.

    So far, over 400k miles on one, 250k plus on others, seems like they have been working fine.
     
    PandaYota[OP] likes this.
  3. Nov 7, 2023 at 4:46 AM
    #3
    PMK

    PMK Well-Known Member

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    Panda Yota, good timing, planning to buy balljoints and other maintenance parts in the next week or two.
    A few weeks ago I asked for opinions regarding which ball joints are worth considering as replacements.
     
  4. Nov 7, 2023 at 6:04 AM
    #4
    Waasheem

    Waasheem The catholic radio bear

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    2015WhiteOR and Too Stroked like this.
  5. Nov 7, 2023 at 10:15 PM
    #5
    Steve_P

    Steve_P Well-Known Member

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    Moog isn't anywhere close to what it was 25 years ago. I don't know anyone over 50 that has worked on cars for 30+ years that will claim that Moog is still high quality like it was.

    It's really difficult to buy any aftermarket parts today that are OE quality, without actually buying an OE part. I won't argue this, but I'm old enough to have watched the race to the bottom.
     
  6. Nov 8, 2023 at 5:57 AM
    #6
    3JOH22A

    3JOH22A Toyota Gigolo

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    Last edited: Nov 8, 2023
    Ricardo13x likes this.
  7. Nov 8, 2023 at 8:25 AM
    #7
    Too Stroked

    Too Stroked Well-Known Member

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    You're confusing the old / original Moog and the new Moog. The old Moog stuff was top shelf and had a well-deserved great reputation. The new Moog has become a shadow of itself living off the reputation of the past - all while ruthlessly cutting costs and quality. Sorry, but I'm all done with the brand.
     
    wi_taco and 2ndhandTacoman like this.
  8. Nov 8, 2023 at 10:20 AM
    #8
    Derk33

    Derk33 Well-Known Member

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    I bought fully loaded moog lower control arms off of Rockauto. With in 2 years the lower bal joint boots had become torn completely in two. When I replaced them the joint was still good but no ball joint will last with a torn boot. I ditched them for mevotech TTX. We’ll see how they hold up.
     
  9. Nov 8, 2023 at 3:57 PM
    #9
    tak1313

    tak1313 Well-Known Member

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    I know Eric O like Mevotech TTX
     
  10. Nov 8, 2023 at 4:09 PM
    #10
    b_r_o

    b_r_o Gnar doggy

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    Who puts locktite on a ball joint stud? Is the castle nut and cotter pin not enough?

    IMO these aftermarket BJs include a zerk fitting because they have shitty boots that leak and they know it. I'd rather have a good quality boot that fits tight and doesn't leak grease anywhere. I've seen other A/M ball joints that advertise a "grease drain hole" .. give me a break, that's just another way for water and dirt to get INTO the joint. If they weren't leaking grease, you wouldn't have to add any. It's not 1975 anymore, I don't want grease oozing out and sticking to everything down there. It attracts dirt and sand and looks backyard. I want my shit clean and dry.

    A zerk is not an upgrade, it's an acknowledgement of poor quality

    The LBJs on my 2nd gen are bone dry after 8 years and 160,000 miles. Moog will never come close to that with or without grease
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2023
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  11. Nov 8, 2023 at 10:02 PM
    #11
    lynlan1819

    lynlan1819 Well-Known Member

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    Nothing beats factory parts,almost every other brand is now Chinesse made.
     
  12. Nov 9, 2023 at 5:18 AM
    #12
    PMK

    PMK Well-Known Member

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    So Moog is now deemed low quality and no longer worthy.
    Mevotech gets mixed remarks and also gets branded as low quality with dust boots that fail early.

    Anyone running, or have experience with the Camburg balljoints. Expensive, but the ad reads good.
     
  13. Nov 9, 2023 at 5:47 AM
    #13
    zguy1

    zguy1 Well-Known Member

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    I can’t speak to the Moog ball joint but have experience with their bearings and tie rod ends on passenger cars. I had two Moog bearings go out over 50k miles while the OEM one lasted over 100k. Same with their tie rod ends. I have always heard good things about Moog and want to like their stuff but experience just doesn’t back it up.
     
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  14. Nov 9, 2023 at 8:18 AM
    #14
    tak1313

    tak1313 Well-Known Member

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    My understanding is the "regular" Mevotech is suspect (with the blue boots), but the TTX line is good (with green boots). Even Eric O has stated the blue boot Mevo s*cks, but he like the TTX line. Even then, I have read complaints about TTX ball joints here and there - but I have read complaints about ALL brands/series here and there.
     
  15. Nov 9, 2023 at 8:33 AM
    #15
    somebody

    somebody GAR-FAB.ca

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    I have had 2 moog ball joints (upper) go bad in less than 20kkm and 1yr. Similarly not long after the moog bushing of the same age are also starting to fail.

    Moog/Rancho/Wagner/Monroe all under the same crap umbrella.
     
  16. Nov 9, 2023 at 8:48 AM
    #16
    tak1313

    tak1313 Well-Known Member

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    If you can get the Sankei part number, you could go that route. Sankei is the OEM supplier of ball joints for Toyota, and although a little more difficult to find, they are sold in the aftermarket market. I believe it's the Sankei 555 line. I would stay away from anyone selling Sankei ball joints on Ebay or Amazon though, as they are more likely to be counterfeit.
     
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  17. Nov 9, 2023 at 10:35 AM
    #17
    Ricardo13x

    Ricardo13x YT: @UrbanOpsOffRoad IG: @urban.ops.offroad

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    Some people want to say they pay more for parts. Kind of like the JDM market nerds back in the day. Anyway, I use the problem solver LCA ball joints and have had 0 issues with them. Don't get me wrong OEM is top notch.
     
  18. Nov 9, 2023 at 3:07 PM
    #18
    JAGCanada

    JAGCanada Well-Known Member

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    I don't have any quantitative data....but here is a picture of my brother-in-laws Moog control arm from his Subaru showing rubber boot seperating. Was installed less than a year. Part was replaced under warranty, but he still had to do the job twice.

    IMG_6572.jpg
     
  19. Nov 9, 2023 at 3:24 PM
    #19
    b_r_o

    b_r_o Gnar doggy

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    Gotta go OEM, there is an updated control arm assembly for that..
     
  20. Nov 10, 2023 at 4:52 AM
    #20
    PMK

    PMK Well-Known Member

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    White, debadged, Mudflaps removed, ICON 2.5 in front, 2.0 in rear, all 4 corners have reservoirs, Spidertrax wheel spacers all around, BAMF bolt on sliders, Avid lightbar, oem transmission cooler converted to power steering cooler, aftermarket transmission cooler eliminating all oem transmission cooler stuff, remote mounted spin on transmission fluid filter TrueTrac rear differential, rear diff housing vented and filtered into left side bed box, URD MAF calibrator, Volant intake scoop into oem airbox, second filter removed, airbox internals smoothed, blended and polished throttle body, NST intake manifold spacer, Wet Okolee set covers, WeatherTech Digital Fit mats, inexpensive JVC single DIN, Scangage, AVS Stepshield door sill protectors, Doug Thorley Long Tube Headers, URD Y pipe with O2 sims.
    So then, regarding ball joints, opinion is oem is best.

    In the past, oem ball joints were not available seperately, only as part of the suspension arm assembly.

    Have oem ball joints now become available as an individual part?

    If oem ball joints are not available individually, and Moog plus others are inferior, what is the current best available choice besides entire assemblies from oem?
     

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