Muti-terrain select. What mode do you use for snow?

Thanks for the free advice

Durtracs and Icon suspension upgrades are in my 2017 future.

 

Deep snow? Huh, good to know then. I will take my Skeptical Snake elsewhere then

 

If you'd be willing to share some more knowledge of off-roading techniques... I'd read it.

I'm sure a lot of others would too. Or even point us in the right direction?

Obviously there is no substitute from experience but I like to read.

 

It is a fairly complex and involved topic. Once you understand a fair bit of it you realize how simple it is. The problem is there is so much small information that it isn't just 3-4 simple steps.

For instance tires. Depending on conditions you might make one tire choice over another. There is no one right answer. One place we used to go off road were old 2 track un-assumed roads. Basically old farm roads that the local governments didn't maintain and technically were legal to run down. Now these could be dirt or they could be swamp. This area had a lot of silt clay. Sticky as hell and slick as shit all at the same time. You needed real chunky tires and lots of wheel spin to clean the mud out of the tires. No crawl control bs here. 4hi and give her hell. Then you hit that one pit on this road that even guys with 44" tires were barely touching bottom. Winch time. Anything less than full mud chunky tires or a waste of time. Now those same tires were hell on road. Loud and hope it doesn't snow. I couldn't climb my almost flat driveway with 1/4" of snow on it unless I was in 4wd. Now add 6-12" of snow and they kicked butt.

So stop to think about this. Some conditions need chunky tires to dig and fling off whatever is getting packed into them. Now hard pack snow that you can't dig and those large rubber patches between the chunky gaps slip and slip. They can't dig for traction. Now a BFG AT would kick butt. But that BFG AT in deep snow can't dig fast enough to pull itself on top of the snow and just spins and digs holes and you get stuck.

Now here is small detail #2. Tire pressures. On road the correct tire pressure keeps maximum tire in contact with the road. Too much and it won't allow the side of the tread to grab and too little and the center may buckle inwards and not touch. Off road is different. When you air down to single digit tire pressures it allows the tire to flex and grab around whatever it rolls over and this constant flexing can help clean the treads out. Also it helps the sidewall flex and like a drag slick it grabs and cushions the force and grip so it doesn't immediately lose traction and spin. So if you are off road and air down you can gain a ton of traction. You can also pop a bead or subject the sidewalls to punctures that the tread might normally take no problem. That is why the better off-road tires have different sidewalls and beadlock wheels help keep the tire on the rims.

So we have barely started and are really still on tires and see how much little stuff there is? We still have yet to talk about technology in our trucks which is where we really started in the thread. That realistically is pages down the road. IMO you need to know the little stuff first.

Now one thing I will throw out there is brakes. You are stuck and don't know what to do. You have one wheel spinning. You try 4wd and still are spinning away. 4wd is a misleading term. With open differentials at both ends you have only 1 or 2 wheel drive. What is an open diff? It allows one tire to spin independently of the other on the same axle. So when you go around a corner one tire makes a larger arc and all happens smoothly. So we put power to the wheels on slippery conditions and one tire spins. 4wd gives is one wheel on each axle spinning. This is assuming no lockers or limited slip differential. So how do we get your open diff truck to behave like a LSD or locker? You apply the brakes. As one (both) tires are gripped by the brake and its spinning is restricted it looks for the mechanical path of least resistance. So it will try to apply force to both wheels instead of just the slipping one since the brakes are making the path of least resistance equal. You are effectively giving yourself a LSD or locker. Now both (all 4) tires are trying to grab and if you have any traction you may just climb out.

Lockers and LSD were invented to do what I described by braking but more effectively and without as much concentration. So going back to technology you have to understand its purpose and what it is trying to do before you can harness its maximum effectively. Crawl control is a super fancy automated wonder technology that does all of the work for you. But you have to be able to understand what exactly it is doing to know if it is the right method to your situation. Crawl control on sand like the videos we have all seen in amazing. But crawl control in deep sticky mud is a waste of time as your tires clog up and become slicks. Understand what is going on and you can have a blast wheeling. Don't understand it and you can be very frustrated and possibly have a ton of broken parts.

Now see how it is a ton of little things that make up the whole knowledge base that is off roading?

 

Thanks for that write up?

Quick question though.

How likely are you to blow a beed on non bead lock wheels at 15 psi on dirt roads with lots of baseball to basketball sized rocks?

Thanks again.

 

Unless traction is an issue I would keep the pressure up or the speed down. Blowing a bead usually happens when side loading a tire that has been aired down. The tire pulls away from the rim and there isn't enough pressure to force it tight to the rim.

Now all that being said 15 psi isn't that low. Keep an eye open and assess the situation as you go. Higher speeds will cause more deflection in the tire as you hit things which could cause rim damage. Low speeds with low pressures are fine once again being conscious of tire deflection and rim damage.

I am no expert, I just know what I have read and what I have seen. One thing people forget when wheeling is stuff happens. This is what happens when someone puts branches in the ruts to get themselves out. The next guy who doesn't know they are there reverses and puts one through his rad. Don't ever assume that because you are careful stuff won't happen to you. I had to get towed a mile through the woods and wait for a friend to drop off a new rad to replace mine which had a hole bigger than my arm through it.





Now these trails barely need any air adjustment unless you go off trail.

 

For twenty-two years part of my works skills included off-road four-wheel driving in the middle of Idaho. (And because of that I owned Toyotas and can't stand GMC junk BTW.)

Exracer2 is spot on about tires, air pressures (and lockers which we never had) and experience. But I don't care how skilled you are, you can't duplicate what MTS will do for you as far as sensing what tire needs a spot of brake and which ones don't.

I'm amazed with this four-wheel system.

SB

 

In your second pic... where you in Muskoka in the fall?... Sure looks like it...!!
Good advice man..

 

Thanks so much for taking the time, I could read this stuff all day.

Also stoked to take this truck in the dirt this weekend for the first time! Hearing people endorse the MTS is exciting

 

Ardbeg Ontario Canada. Northeast of Parry Sound.

 

Since I am new to Toyota I am unsure if there is anything similar to the JEEP Jamborees. Something like that would be the best place to learn a lot in a short period of time.

I suggest finding a local off road club and seeing if they have a coffee night. Meet some people and maybe tag along for a run when they go wheeling. My only suggestion is if possible go ride in someone else's rig at first. Get a feel and then later try it yourself. One of my first wheeling trips was spent winching out other people who weren't skilled and weren't set up right. A couple of guys said sure you guys will be fine. Well I pulled up the rear and pulled guys out all day again and again and again. I was pretty pissy by end of day.

Now myself I won't be wheeling my Taco for quite a few years. But when replacement time is near it may just see a winch and so on and so on. I strongly believe in making yourself the best equipped and not relying on others to bring the gear you didn't. Winches are a huge part of your gear. I even suggest a small winch on a receiver hitch mount for the rear which you can plug in and help yourself out. Doesn't always work as well as a 8-9000lb for one up front but sometimes is handy to pull you a little backwards before you get in too deep. The deeper you get into the sport you spend more and more.

Standard 2" x 20-30' recovery straps are mandatory. I suggest getting a rear tow bar for your trailer hitch with a shackle and having the strap mounted ready to go. Throw the other end in the bed and hopefully you don't need it. It is the worst to need a tug and you can't find anywhere to attach to or it is under the muck and crap you are buried in. Plus your rig may be in a position it could slide or move and you are now under it trying to attach a strap. No one wants to have to watch someone die in front of them. Also if you have a front winch either have a new wireless control or hook up your control cable and have it inside the cab with you. Once again it sucks to do this in the muck or underwater.






AIR - get some. That means a decent 12v compressor like Superwinch offers or a compressed air source like Powertank. If you need to air down you will need to air up for the drive home. Also if you pop a bead you need air and lots of it to reseat a bead. Don't assume the other guy will always help you out. He most likely will once or twice but in the wheeling community if you aren't prepared you will wear out your welcome fast. Now along with air you need an air gauge. Don't argue just have one handy.



So bite off things a nibble at a time. Have a good time. LISTEN to others (and figure out who the clowns are who think they know more than they do). But most of all respect the group. That means be prepared. Be willing to help - you might be the next guy needing it. Have your own gear.

Lastly respect the trails. Don't tear things up, leave garbage or be a nuisance. The long term availability of public lands depends on people leaving things as good or better than they found them.

Good luck.

 

When I looked at your pic again, I thought "I've been there"....Ardbeg..!! Nice area...!! I'm about 45 minutes away from there...

Good advice for the "wheelers".... I don't do it, but like to watch.... Voyeur..??

 

For those who read later, I hear the MTS Mud and Sand (also snow per the manual) setting will work in 4hi. The others are 4lo only. Will confirm tonight.

 

…. 2017 thread… and no MTS will not work in 4hi on any modes in the Tacoma.

 

Tried it today, no dice. I saw a 4 runner do it in a video about atrac but that’s a no go for the 17 OR Tacoma. Bummer.

 

I wonder if there could be a mod to allow MTS mud and sand to work in 4Hi in a Tacoma like 4runner

 

I thought more about this and am happy with how Toyota does it. When you're traveling down the road in 4hi snow your greater risk is losing control, not getting stuck, so the stability controls are the tool you want to use there. If you do lose control and/or get stuck you need a different tool which is 4lo and optionally the active traction tools. Stability and Traction are different tools just like 4hi and 4lo are different tools. 4hi/stability and 4lo/traction pair nicely so Toyota put reasonable limits on when they can be used that line up with most real world situations. If I'm going 45 and that level of traction is the most important factor I have put myself in a bad situation already. It might also damage components or way over apply braking if MTS were used at higher speeds. Similarly I wouldn't use my locker at 25 even if I could. For my driving it's the wrong tool and not worth the risk of damage. Hooning is overrated. When in doubt think it out.

There are probably situations where a mod for 4hi/MTS would be nice but I'm happy with what they've done.