New brakes just as bad as before

If your brakes can lock the tires up, what more can you want? That is the ultimate stopping force needed, to lock the tires. You can lock them up if you try, right? If so, brake force is working correct

 

What pads did you go with?

Did you happen to get grease on the rotors or pads and didn't clean them off?
I always wipe down the rotors, even when new, to make sure there's no chemicals or grease on them to keep them from rusting.

"Wear-in" period is typically an amount of time where the pads and rotors are bed to one another. Where they've worn enough to really have maximum surface area touching eachother. Since you have new rotors and pads, this should not take long but what can take long is getting a proper transfer layer of pad material onto the rotor. Bedding brakes by doing some continuous hard braking helps achieve this. Find a safe, long, remotely flat road and get up to like 60 at least and go down to 10-20mph about 8 times or so. Watch your mirrors to make sure no one sneaks up behind you and you brake check the shit out of them without knowing. Some pads have a special bedding coating on them to help accelerate this process, some just have a shitty mold release compound on them that takes a bit to get off and then braking performance will be better.

 

Lift experts, please chime in about any proportion valve adjustments needed for a 2.5 inch lift

Read about the Autozone brake pad break in procedure in the following link.

https://www.autozone.com/diy/brakes/bedding-brakes

 

In addition to the above posts about pad break in procedures, fluid change, and bleeding,

Here's a link about the load sensing proportioning valve adjustment in the following post.

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...nd-by-pass-valve-lsp-bv.615360/#post-20896445

 

Thank you. I will read the articles and look into the valve, etc. I will update when I have more information.

 

Meh, that's not entirely true.

Let's take the example of a bicycle with cheap-o rim brakes, vs. expensive mountain bike with hydraulic disc brakes.

I can lock up the rear wheel on both of them pretty easily, but I guarantee I can stop better and shorter with the discs. I'm sure there's some complicated physics and brake power/friction curves involved, of which I can't really explain, but maybe you get the idea... It has to do with being able to modulate the brakes at those high friction/force events (panic stop for example).

As far as the rear brakes and the BPV, if the OP lifted it 2.5", the BPV needs to be moved that same amount. There is some adjustment on the thread arm itself, but not 2.5" worth. As seen in the stolen TW pic below, you can either buy or make a bracket that extends the lower arm of the BPV assembly.

When you lift a truck, and don't adjust the BPV accordingly, this essentially tricks the brakes into thinking there is LESS weight over the rear end which reduces the braking force that's applied. If there's more weight, (axle closer to the frame/bed) then more force can be applied to the brakes.

 

For him in his scenario, I assumed when he said that he skidded when hard braking was from the front brakes locking up the wheels. I also assumed this was on road with normal traction. I made lots of assumptions. No abs either, should be pretty plain Jane but I've definitely been incorrect before.
Well shoot, I'm assuming again. I assume no abs as that wasn't mentioned? ABS can introduce further variables. But he skidded, which means he can lock em up. I'm assuming.

 

For sure, I made a lot of assumptions too, lol...

I was just speaking more generally about locking the brakes is not necessarily THE definition for properly working brakes. If the back brakes aren't working as much as they should, that forces the fronts to work harder, and without rear brakes working, now you essentially have the friction coefficient of 2 tires stopping you, not 4 tires. Even in a perfect system, the front brakes supply something like 60-80% of the braking force (on the higher end for a pickup).

IMO, Some easy assumptions to make here are:

1) rear brakes not adjusted for pad wear via use of the e-brake

2) BPV not supplying sufficient power to rear brakes due to 2.5" lift.

1 + 2 = front brakes are working too hard. This could explain the worn out/damaged front brakes/pads, inferior stopping distance. Skidding tires could be explained by only the front tires doing all the friction work.

 

Oh gotcha. Yeah I see what you're getting at. Not too much of specific info from OP to really give him that good of help, but plenty of suggestions and things to look into and verify for him.
Hopefully something covers what he's got going on

 

He's said he's lifted it and never (rarely) uses the e-brake.

While he hasn't said he did not install a bracket on the BPV, he didn't say he did, either. So I'm assuming his BPV is 2.5" too low.

The brake adjustment and the BPV are pretty simple things that should be addressed regardless if that's really the root cause of his complaint.

Once he gets back after testing the brake booster, that'll give us more info to go on, too.

 

Exactly

 

If your old brake fluid was black it's because the the rubber brake lines are sloughing off old rubber.

Mine were all changed with a lift otherwise they would be wayyy overdue.

Have had many pop when getting around this age on lots of makes. You know Toyota has no proprietary rubber plants right?

Not saying aftermarket better, just that rubber lines are rubber lines.

 

I can attest that the rear brakes make a huge difference. Mine are now adjusted correctly and my pedal feel and stopping power feels much better. The rear brakes should self adjust as previously mentioned but if they don’t or stop self adjusting the braking performance degrades over time so it is hard to know it has happened. I use my parking brake every day but obviously time has had an impact on the adjuster wheel and the parking brake usage alone stopped turning the shoe adjustment wheel. Only after I manually adjusted the rears so the shoes have an ever so slight drag on the drum, did I feel the real difference. I couldn’t believe the improvements. I will be taking the rear drums off for a proper cleaning and or replacement of components as needed when I get time.

 

Nice to hear hands on experience from adjusting only that rear drum adjuster and not during a brake job or something. That's good to hear man, that having rear working correctly can affect the performance that much

 

Flush the fluid, it should be replaced every 3-4 years. Brakes will get softer as the fluid absorbs moisture. Also, a proper rear brake adjustment works miracles. You may need a BPV bracket as mentioned above.

Whenever I do new pads, no matter the brand I try to do maybe 10 or so quick brake checks from 50 mph down to 20 thereabouts. Dont stop completely as pad material will bed into the rotor unevenly if you do that. You wanna get em pretty hot, usually I can smell them with the window down. Doing this ensures the pads wear in evenly. Some brands say you dont have to do that, but it never hurts.

 

Ok, so I tested the brake booster and it is working good. The brake fluid looks dark. I will start using the parking brake whenever I park now to see if that will help.

Edit: the pads have definitely been properly worn in as well

 

The 3.5” 1/4” plate would be the correct choice?

 

If you area in a road salt area, the rear adjuster mechanism could have some rust.

While you may not need to replace the rear brake shoes, this video provides information on adjustments and the rear brake shoe parts for reference.

https://youtu.be/IJkVEBYSecs

 

The shoes were replaced not long ago. I’ve been using the parking brake, and already it feels like it is more effective. Or a placebo. Also found a leaf that appeared to be in between the pad and rotor. Could have just been in the wheel but I pulled it out. Truck has been a PA truck for 16 years of its life and 2 years as VA truck. Salty as they come.

 

Good to hear. Have a good weekend.