Now THIS is an engine Toyota needs to take notes on

After a few years of real world reviews I might take look at one. The RAM light duty diesel look real nice but pricey. As far as the GM Canyonero twins are concerned the V6 performance looks ok. GM's past failures with regard to light duty diesels in the consumer market leave room for pause. Maybe they got their act together but at present 'new' GM seems like 'old' GM. I agree with others that Toyota is falling behind the curve and if they don't do something soon with the trucks they will loose market share.

 

Also keep in mind that any turbo'd engine, when running in NA mode, will have less power then just a straight non-turbo'd engine of the same size/make. Add in the turbo piping, intercooler(s), and engine bay piping bends, and the 3.5 probably puts out closer to a 2.8-3.0 NA v6 when not boosted.

btw, the people I know with the F150 are not driving it hard, but still getting v8 fullsized mpgs. Personally, I would expect my mpgs for a turbo'd engine to by about the same as the spooled power displacement, not NA mpg. I would not have been surprised by what others are complaining about, but I've had turbo'd engines before and my expectations are different apparently.

 

Really good discussion here. One thing I would like to add is some say Toyota needs to kick up their game and is falling behind: I agree
Others say that Toyota is reliable and that alone is worth the less mpg: I also agree.
The point I'd like to make is this: ten years ago it was still the best and most reliable engine. But the thing is, 10 years have passed and they can change it. Back then you can say the reliability was worth a few mpgs but they've had time to improve. I think Toyota is capable of making a stronger engine just as reliable. That being said, we just need to wait and see the redesign.

 

For the life of me I can't fathom why Toyota won't bring the D4D stateside. Hell, add a urea system if need be to meet EPA requirements. It can't be a CAFE issue. They have so many credits they could drop a supercharged V10 into the Tundra and it wouldn't dent their CAFE numbers.

 

IMHO, diesel in the US is still a tough sell for the manufacturers. It still has a "large" truck only stigma to it. No, it's not right (wife drives a Jetta TDI fyi, love that car), but it is what it is. a Diesel engine is more expensive going in by 2-3k, recent diesel fuel costs put the $$$ breakeven point even higher, as diesel is 10-20% higher then regular, and the mpg gain is around 20-25% typically. So the math gets tough.

Personally I like the drivability of a good turbo diesel engine much more then gas for daily driving, but would I pay 2-3k more for one..... not sure. We did for the Jetta, but we bought at the bottom of the car market fallout in 09, so the price premium then was much smaller.

 

I think your observation is right on. A diesel engine has IMMEDIATE gut wrenching torque. It won't win many drag races on top end power but at idle speed to ~3,000RPM the torque is incredible. Sometimes DOUBLE what a normal gasoline engine of similar size would create.

This is why I think that turbo diesels are best for passenger cars. Most people, when the light turns green, bury their foot in it and then let off when they reach the desired speed. I know my girlfriend is guilty of this. She doesn't drive over the speed limit but she sure as shit gets to it quickly. We bought her a brand new 2015 Mazda 6 this summer. It's rated for 38mpg highway. She averages 24mpg per tank and it's because she has to put her foot halfway in it to get the acceleration response she remembers from her old V6 SUV. BTW, I can get 40mpg on the highway in that thing. It's awesome!

 

I don't really expect seeing any diesel in a Tacoma, as great as the idea is.

 

A point to keep in mind for everyone, these MPG numbers aren't "engine" numbers, they are the overall truck. If you remember, the F-150 frame is alu. One of the biggest factors when calc MPG's is overall weight

 

I will take POWER over ECONOMY -any day of the week.
Need economy for a long trip-Rent a compact.
Sorry--safety and power is money well spent.
Do the math--how much do you really save.

 

Yea, I admin new tech defiantly helps a lot of things. But I think it's best to stay away from new model years, like the Colorado in 2015. Seems like with all the new systems in the engine there are more moving parts that are just waiting to break after the warranty runs out. If you lease, it would be great, you always have warranty and a dealer program maybe. But to own for the long-haul, isn't it just common sense that something more complicated with more parts will cost more money to keep running?

I'm not too up to speed on the Ecoboost stuff. I know it has been around for a while and is probably pretty mature technology. But when I read the claims that you can get almost 325-400hp out of a 2.7l tiny V6 revving engine like that new Ford....I just wonder how long the engine can keep that up. I'm talking decades here...

 

The MPG might not be, but torque and HP are, no? And nevertheless, the Tacoma is already pretty light. I still think Toyota could compete if they wanted but I don't have anything to back it up-It's just my opinion

Quite a bit, especially when intending to keep the truck for a long period of time. Keep in mind though that that argument only stands when efficiency is being implemented at the COST of power or safety... It is certainly possible for Toyota to make an engine just as reliable and still be efficient. It does not always have to be a trade-off. And as far as power goes, most of us who drive mid size trucks (tacomas) don't need power every day or for massive amounts of towing or we would be in a full sized truck. The power we have is sufficient.

 

I have a1997 Tacoma with a 3.4L V-6. It needs rebuilding, does anyone know the best and cheapest place to buy everything I need to rebuild. Need complete rebuild kit or separate parts. From bearings to all gasket kits, lower and top?

 

I would say that you need to find a thread that is actually relevant to your question, or post up a new thread.

 

I broke up your reply to address each separate topic...

I agree that new technology will show some issues right up front. But it's not just Chevy that experiences that; all automobile manufacturers have this issue for every new vehicle they launch. Once the bugs get worked out, you'll have new technology with reliability provided it's designed and built properly.

First, nobody is pushing their engine to its maximum HP and torque specifications every day they drive their vehicle. In fact, I'd venture to guess that 90% of people never reach the peak advertised numbers mainly because the RPMs at peak power/torque are usually near the redline of the engine. Second, engines designed for high RPMs have been around for a long while. Just look at the small engine Hondas and Toyotas. Heck, my Hyundai Accent runs at 4k RPMs if I'm doing 80mph on the highway. And I'll guarantee that engine will last a good long while. These modern engines designed for high RPMs will last 200k miles provided they're maintained as required.

David

 

the frame is aluminum? i thought they were just gonna start making the body panels Al. i dont mean to discredit u but i dont think they would make the frame from that. even so the Atlas is only supposed to shed 600-700 lbs off the biggest model i believe, which would still put it at quite a bit heavier than a 4x4 DCLB that weighs ~4100lbs

 

It's aluminum body and steel frame I believe. Although aluminum is way weaker than steel, it doesn't rust.....

 

Reference data on this? I have not seen or heard of more than a single case of an engine in an early model 2nd gen that broke loose from it's mounts, and even then it was not severe. I would love to read more if you have some facts. I Google searched and found nothing at all.

 

^I wasn't going to call him out on it but I've not heard of that really happening either.

 

Here is a link to some real-world MPG figures on that 2.7L EcoBoost.

http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/2015-...w-cab-is-capable-o-1640936718/+andrewpcollins

By the way...I love how butt-hurt some people seem to get on this forum when non-Toyota products are mentioned. I think that sort of blind loyalty is what encourages auto makers to not invest in R&D and offer the same stuff every year.

Just thought it would be interesting to discuss some of the newer technologies being incorporated into other trucks on the market...not trying to put down one company or talk up another, nor will I try to defend any particular brand.

 

I agree. Problem is that there are alot of people on this forum that have gone blind to the facts due to Toyota brand loyalty. Personally I find it absurd.

David