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P0141 and p0170 codes and black liquid in exhaust

Discussion in 'Technical Chat' started by Andrew m, Mar 26, 2022.

  1. Mar 26, 2022 at 4:40 PM
    #1
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    The p0141 (O2. Heater circuit bank 1 sensor 2) and p0170 (Fuel trim bank 1) codes are through on my 95 Tacoma. I am also having a black liquid come out of my exhaust. That truck has 145k miles on it so that paired with the black liquid I’m thinking that I’m going to need to replace the cat. That still leaves the heater circuit and fuel trim code being thrown. How can I fix these?
     
  2. Mar 26, 2022 at 4:47 PM
    #2
    b_r_o

    b_r_o Gnar doggy

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    That black liquid is probably just condensation with soot in it, doesn't mean the converter is bad.

    Look for any intake leaks like a rotted vacuum line. Clean the maf sensor, check fuel pressure with a gauge. You could reasonably throw a new sensor at that 02 heater code

    You'll need some troubleshooting skills and a code reader that displays fuel trims to go further
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2022
    Dm93 likes this.
  3. Mar 26, 2022 at 4:49 PM
    #3
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    By any chance do you know what normal fuel trim is so I can check it
     
  4. Mar 26, 2022 at 4:51 PM
    #4
    b_r_o

    b_r_o Gnar doggy

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    Less than 4-5% plus or minus
     
  5. Mar 26, 2022 at 5:09 PM
    #5
    Dm93

    Dm93 Test Don't Guess

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    +/-10% Total (short term + long term) trim is considered normal
    Not sure how much data you can look at on a 95 but coolant temp and mass airflow sensor would be other data you would want to look at.
     
  6. Mar 26, 2022 at 5:19 PM
    #6
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    My mass air flow is reading about .45lb/min at idle and my O2s are both reading 0(V)
     
  7. Mar 26, 2022 at 5:20 PM
    #7
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    Even when I give it gas my o2s b1 s2 is getting 0 volts but sensor ones is getting voltage
     
  8. Mar 26, 2022 at 5:28 PM
    #8
    Dm93

    Dm93 Test Don't Guess

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    Mass airflow is about right if you have a 3.4l, upstream O2 should bounce between about 0.2-0.8v when the truck is in closed loop.
    The downstream sensor reading 0 isn't surprising since the heater isn't working in it, an O2 sensor has to be around 700 degrees before it will function.
     
    TnShooter likes this.
  9. Mar 26, 2022 at 5:33 PM
    #9
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    It’s a 2.7l. It was reading stft b1 as 19.5% and ltft b1 as 23.4%. Could it be running so much fuel because the heater isn’t working right at first start? Thank you guys for your help
     
  10. Mar 26, 2022 at 5:45 PM
    #10
    b_r_o

    b_r_o Gnar doggy

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    Those are really high trims. It's trying to add fuel to correct a lean condition. Or at least what it perceives as a lean condition

    Look for vacuum leaks
    Check fuel pressure
    Maf is also suspect

    The downstream oxygen sensor can sometimes affect fuel calculation. Try unplugging it.
     
  11. Mar 26, 2022 at 5:52 PM
    #11
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    so should I fix the heater circuit then go from there or is it my heater circuit that’s causing the high fuel trim
     
  12. Mar 26, 2022 at 5:53 PM
    #12
    b_r_o

    b_r_o Gnar doggy

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    Heater circuit codes are really common and usually don't affect fuel trims. But I guess it's possible.

    Dm what do you think? Could a heater circuit short into the sensor circuit and give dirty info to the pcm?

    It's probably had the heater circuit code for a while and then something else is causing the lean condition
     
  13. Mar 26, 2022 at 6:00 PM
    #13
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    I have cleaned out my MAF already and erased the codes but it only last a couple days before the were back
     
  14. Mar 26, 2022 at 6:08 PM
    #14
    TnShooter

    TnShooter The TacomaWorld Stray

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    My under is that, Low O2 voltages typically mean there is Lean condition.
    When the ECM sees this, it adds fuel. Which coincides with the high fuel trims.
    But 0v?

    I find it unusual that both are reading 0v.
    I’d check the heater circuit.
     
  15. Mar 26, 2022 at 6:08 PM
    #15
    Dm93

    Dm93 Test Don't Guess

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    I have seen a bad heater on the upstream sensor cause issues but being it's the one on the downstream sensor it shouldn't affect fueling.
    MAF g/s (lb/min x 7.56) should be about equal to engine displacement in liters at a hot unloaded idle (700-800 RPM)
    If there's no obvious vacuum leaks I would really want to check fuel pressure.
    How does it run otherwise, do the fuel trims improve while driving or get worse?
    You can test O2 sensor operation by inducing rich and lean conditions by pulling a vacuum hose off (O2 should go low <0.2v) and then spraying carb cleaner in the intake O2 should go high (>0.7v).
     
    b_r_o[QUOTED] likes this.
  16. Mar 26, 2022 at 6:16 PM
    #16
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    The truck runs good when it is being given gas but is still a little high. It sometimes has a little studder when it is idling. I’m only driving it about 15 miles to school and back so it doesn’t seem that it is getting up to operating temp. I have had the cab off of it not to long ago, could when I was putting the cab back on could I have pinch a wire and cause the heater circuit to fail completely for the downstream sensor?
     
  17. Mar 26, 2022 at 6:20 PM
    #17
    b_r_o

    b_r_o Gnar doggy

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    If it only hiccups at idle but has good power when you're driving around normally it's probably an intake leak

    Check the intake boot between the math sensor and the throttle body really close for cracks . Check all the vacuum lines again and listen for hissing seconds

    Spray some carb cleaner around and see if those fuel trims change
     
    Dm93 likes this.
  18. Mar 26, 2022 at 6:21 PM
    #18
    Dm93

    Dm93 Test Don't Guess

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    It's a possibility, never hurts to double check your work.
    Just to be clear is this a 95 or 97 truck, your profile says 97?
     
  19. Mar 26, 2022 at 6:23 PM
    #19
    Andrew m

    Andrew m [OP] Guaco Taco

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    95 Tacoma 2.7l manual 4x4. I don’t know how to change it on my profile
     
  20. Mar 26, 2022 at 6:28 PM
    #20
    Dm93

    Dm93 Test Don't Guess

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    At the top of the screen click on You>personal deatils then scroll down to vehicle one line description.
     

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