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Philadelphia Police violate rights of open carrier at gunpoint

Discussion in 'Guns & Hunting' started by 08WhiteTRD, Mar 24, 2011.

Page 7 of 12
  1. May 17, 2011 at 12:48 PM
    #121
    Rmodel65

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    http://www.foxbusiness.com/on-air/s...arass-threaten-shoot-man-legally-carrying-gun

    http://articles.philly.com/2011-05-16/news/29548742_1_firearms-license-youtube-clips-gun-rights




    retaliation..........
     
    Rmodel65, May 17, 2011
    #121
  2. May 17, 2011 at 1:19 PM
    #122
    Monkeysuncle

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    Monkeysuncle My Cat's breath Smells like Cat Food

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    So reckless endangerment and disorderly conduct is the charge for knowledge of firearms laws in PA? Sounds like the Department has egg on it's face and want's to make a point or save face by issuing this charge. . But the real point is this guy knew more than the officer, exercised his rights as stated in the Constitution of PA and now has the law on his side, against the department. The fact that he had audio of the event really doesn't mean anything, I could be walking by and witness this and record it, or does that make me guilty of recording a violation of a citizens rights? I don't see this being good for the LEO or department. My opinion here is I know and obey the laws, you, the LEO, are here to enforce them.
     
    Monkeysuncle, May 17, 2011
    #122
  3. May 17, 2011 at 1:24 PM
    #123
    Rmodel65

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    what it is:

     
    Rmodel65, May 17, 2011
    #123
  4. May 17, 2011 at 1:27 PM
    #124
    Monkeysuncle

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    Monkeysuncle My Cat's breath Smells like Cat Food

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    In reality, this dude had balls of steel. A firearm pointed in my direction would make me think long and hard about my next action. When I was pulled over in GA I made it known that I had a firearm and let that Officer decide what the next course of action would be. Makes me wish I could have a camera filming all the time when I am in my truck. Why? Because nobody is perfect.
     
    Monkeysuncle, May 17, 2011
    #124
  5. May 17, 2011 at 1:44 PM
    #125
    764mike

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    764mike Well-Known Member

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    Bottom line. For those who have never been to Phila, most parts of the city are a shithole. If you have a permit to carry, you can open carry. But why would you. It is inviting problems. Conceal it, and deal with the problem as it happens. I lived in Phila and train in Phila all the time with my K9 partner and have never seen anyone open carry their firearm. So it is understandable why the officers didnt know this. Also, they were not properly trained to know this. At the beginning of the incident the Sgt ordered the subject to the ground. He should have complied and didnt. He should have been arrested for not following the officers directions on the spot and not released. Officers are shot and involved in shootings all the time in Phila. The guy was carrying an audio recorder on him when the incident happened. Proof positive he was looking for a scenerio like this to happen.
     
    764mike, May 17, 2011
    #125
  6. May 17, 2011 at 2:15 PM
    #126
    skytower

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    skytower Well-Known Member

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    Proof only of your line of reasoning. If I had a suspicion that something I was legally doing would be called into question, I would record too.
    Try to be a little less closed minded.
     
    skytower, May 17, 2011
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  7. May 17, 2011 at 6:07 PM
    #127
    Rmodel65

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    i live in Ga and have opened carried in Philly....its more comfy....
     
    Rmodel65, May 17, 2011
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  8. May 19, 2011 at 9:40 AM
    #128
    SteelRain

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    SteelRain Veteran Redleg

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    Hmm....old thread that was brought to my attention. I am certainly glad that I live in a Pro Gun state. Based purely of the audio alone and not actually being there. I have to side with the citizen and NOT the Sgt. I doubt that a criminal or somebody about to commit a crime, using a firearm, is going to open carry it. It's like playing a hand of poker. You wouldn't want to show your hand for all to see. I've seen plenty of people open carry while I'm on duty. I've been eating lunch during a one of the rare times I get to actually sit down and a guy has walked in the restaurant with a gun on his hip. Yes I notice and yes I watch him for a second. After that I go about my business and watch my entire surroundings as I usually do while on duty. I usully think to myself..."dude..pick a better gun to carry than that $150 Hi-Point in your $10 holster". LoL!!
     
    SteelRain, May 19, 2011
    #128
  9. May 20, 2011 at 7:25 AM
    #129
    river rat 69

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    river rat 69 Well-Known Member

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    If you have CWP, Police are on the same side you are. Dont be a ass if asked for some ID from L.E.. ITS HIS OR HER JOB TO CHECK YOU OUT. Im glad they do!! What happened to being nice to police they already have lots of assholes to deal with y be one more!! JMHO Jim
     
    river rat 69, May 20, 2011
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  10. May 20, 2011 at 7:27 AM
    #130
    chris4x4

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    chris4x4 With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. Moderator

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    The issue with the audio clips, is the LEO never asked for ID., but rather pointed his gun at the guy FIRST.
     
    chris4x4, May 20, 2011
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  11. May 20, 2011 at 7:59 AM
    #131
    river rat 69

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    river rat 69 Well-Known Member

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    Big city L.E. See it all (kids who kill for nothing, etc.) I understand y they are quick with a gun and i see it. I know that L.E. CAN MESS UP LIKE ALL PEOPLE DO! I still see them as trying to do a hard job not many would want. I like sitting at the hunt camp fire and hearing my L.E. pals stories Some will make you LYAO others will make you cry. Jim
     
    river rat 69, May 20, 2011
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  12. May 20, 2011 at 12:33 PM
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    Rmodel65

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    no actually its not his job to check you out...his job is to obey the bill of rights protections against warrant-less searches and seizures...he is stopping and checking because hes fishing and wants to arrest you....he can engage in any consensual convo he wants but the person should be free to walk away unless he has reasonable suspicion of a crime...
     
    Rmodel65, May 20, 2011
    #132
  13. May 20, 2011 at 2:31 PM
    #133
    chris4x4

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    chris4x4 With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. Moderator

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    Out of all the cops I know, I have never heard of them aproaching a person with a holstered weapon with their side arm drawn and aimed. Unless, the person matches a description of a felonious suspect, or is commited in an act of crime.
     
    chris4x4, May 20, 2011
    #133
  14. May 20, 2011 at 2:56 PM
    #134
    paintdiddy

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    paintdiddy Machine gun shits

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    Isn't your state a carry state? It's normal to see that.this pecker head kinda tricked the cops to do what they did.
     
    paintdiddy, May 20, 2011
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  15. May 20, 2011 at 2:59 PM
    #135
    chris4x4

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    chris4x4 With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. Moderator

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    Yeah, but the cops should have known people can be permitted and allowed to carry.
     
    chris4x4, May 20, 2011
    #135
  16. May 20, 2011 at 3:10 PM
    #136
    paintdiddy

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    paintdiddy Machine gun shits

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    Yes they should(since it's a major one) but does everyone know every rule for their job?
     
    paintdiddy, May 20, 2011
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  17. May 20, 2011 at 3:11 PM
    #137
    chris4x4

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    chris4x4 With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine. Moderator

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    Welll....Its kinda an important one.....
     
    chris4x4, May 20, 2011
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  18. May 20, 2011 at 3:22 PM
    #138
    TacoTabe

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    TacoTabe Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. But this kind of thing happens. I got a memo one day reminding everyone that there is no "three step rule" in Florida. (Depending on where you keep your gun inside your vehicle, it is considered to be 'concealed'-meaning you need a permit; or it is 'securely encased' meaning you can have it as long as you're 18)

    Many cops believe (incorrectly) that there is a 'three step' rule, which dictates that there has to be 3 distinct actions/movements made in order to use the weapon, for it to be considered securely encased. (ie. 1. remove from glove box; 2. load magazine; 3. chamber round)

    This is not the case at all, and yet a few cops didnt know this. It happens.
     
    TacoTabe, May 20, 2011
    #138
  19. May 20, 2011 at 3:28 PM
    #139
    TacoTabe

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    TacoTabe Well-Known Member

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    Also, to the point of knowing every rule/law- I'd ask you to consider this:

    A lawyer spends 3 YEARS in school studying laws, and then once he/she decides what kind of law they wish to practice, additional time study said law, in order to become an expert.

    Example: I went to the University of Florida, where they have one of the best tax law programs in the nation. The tax law certificate is one year of study on top of the 3 required for a law degree- so it takes 4 years of study to be an expert.

    Police academies last 5-12 months, depending on the state/department...

    Lawyers spend 3-5 years learning the law. Cops get about 6 months.

    And you want cops to know every law in their state? Get real.

    By this logic, you should be really impressed by the cops who manage to know most criminal laws in their state within the time they're in the academy, or you should be seriously dissapointed in the lack of intelligence of the attorney's who take 3 years to learn the same laws, but charge you $350 an hour to represent you...
     
    TacoTabe, May 20, 2011
    #139
  20. May 21, 2011 at 12:29 PM
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    Packman73

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    Basically the police are now warning people that OC that they(open carriers) will have their rights infringed upon.
     
    Packman73, May 21, 2011
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