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RCLT HD 2.75" - Travel Numbers and Notes

Discussion in 'Long Travel Suspension' started by Tacoma1192, Jul 13, 2022.

  1. Jul 13, 2022 at 3:38 PM
    #1
    Tacoma1192

    Tacoma1192 [OP] GD MOTORSPORTS

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    I had a customer bring his truck to me for an RCLT install. I have posted comments for the past while about the kit "limiting" travel. So while I had the truck in the shop, I took the time to take measurements and do a write-up to see how this actual measures and cycles. For reference, my personal truck has a Baja Kits +2" kit on it. With an 8" off the shelf king shock, it cycles 12.0" wheel travel bump to strap. Motion Ratio of 1.5 to 1. It uses the full stroke of the shock without moving the shock mount or factory bump stop.


    In normal fashion, I am posting this, and I am headed out on vacation for 4 - 5 days so I won't respond until I get back.. so enjoy the shit show that will unfold.


    RCLT wheel travel calculations:

    Working CV angle:

    Rcv safe working angle: 22.3

    Hub Height from ground 13.5 (measured from the bottom edge of the center hole in the end of the CV stub shaft. This is how I continued to measure the rest of the thread because it is a consistent point on the tape measure)

    Hub Height from the ground at 0.0 degrees: 20”
    Half cv travel at 22.3 degrees from 0.0: 6.5”
    Useable hub travel cv bind droop to bump bind 13”

    RCLT 1.HEIC.jpg
    RCLT 2.HEIC.jpg
    RCLT 3.HEIC.jpg
    RCLT 4.HEIC.jpg

    Shock measurements

    Shock length: extended: 24”
    Collapsed 16.875"
    7.125” total travel
    *these are the “all pro LT spec shocks”

    Droop: safe Working CV angle right before bind
    Shock length 23.25” top of top hat to center of bolt
    Hub 13.5” from ground

    Bump: Factory bump stop mount bind (metal to metal)
    Shock length 17.5”
    Hub 24.625” from ground

    Shock travel: 5.75”
    Wheel travel 11.125”
    Motion ratio: 1.9 to 1

    Remaining shock travel 1.375”
    Shock shaft showing at bump 0.625”
    Shock shaft remaining at droop 0.75”

    In theory, move the shock up 0.75" so that the shock runs out of travel at the same time the CV binds at droop. Then move the bump stop up so that you can utilize the full shock stroke. 7.250 multiplied by the motion ration of 1.9 = 13.775" wheel travel.

    RCLT 5.HEIC.jpg RCLT 6.HEIC.jpg RCLT 7.HEIC.jpg RCLT 8.HEIC.jpg RCLT 9.HEIC.jpg


    Outter heim tie rod end:
    Usable angle: 29.5
    Droop angle from center 12.2
    Bump angle 27.3

    Remaining: 2.2 working angle degrees
    Angle change per inch of travel: 3.1
    Uptravel left until bind: 0.70”

    Theoretically, 59 degrees of useable tie rod angle at 3.1 degrees per 1 inch of travel, results in 19” of useable outter tie rod heim travel.

    RCLT 10.HEIC.jpg RCLT 11.HEIC.jpg RCLT 12.HEIC.jpg RCLT 13.HEIC.jpg RCLT 14.HEIC.jpg RCLT 15.HEIC.jpg RCLT 16.HEIC.jpg

    Summary:

    Working CV angle only allows for 13” of total wheel travel. A 7.125” shock allows for 13.50” of travel. The outter tie rod heim allows for 19” of travel IF it was set in the spindle at the correct angle. Where as the current mounted angle only allows for 11.825” of wheel travel. This is measured from tie rod bind at bump, including steering lock to lock, to cv bind at droop (as the cv binds before the outter tie rod end).


    This means the tie rod end angle on the spindle is the limiting factor in the suspension travel. This falls short of Marlins advertised claim of 12.5” (without steering lock to lock, it does cycle 12.5). However a redesign of the spindle with the tie rod end binding at the same time as cv bind at droop would eliminate this limitation. The next step for the installer would be to cut the factory bump stop out and move it higher. That way, the installer would be able to set the bump at cv bind (uptravel) then build a new shock mount. This would result in 13”wheel travel while maintaining safe working CV and steering angles.


    As the kit is designed currently, 11.825” is all the wheel travel possible based on my calculations of working angles. However, to achieve this, the factory bump stop needs to be moved. If you choose not to move the bump stop, this kit results in 8.75” of travel. 13.5” height from ground at droop to 22 3/16” bump. *This assumes the factory bump stop compresses down to 7/8" total height.

    RCLT 17.HEIC.jpg RCLT 18.HEIC.jpg RCLT 19.HEIC.jpg RCLT 20.HEIC.jpg


    Factory bump stop removed

    At this point, I cut out the factory bump stop to eliminate that from the equation to prove out my measurements and calculations. Without the coil over, I reassembled and cycled up to bind on the outter tie rod end, and steered lock to lock to ensure no binding. The tie rod angle is 29.5 degrees in relation to the bolt. Once I got there, here are the measurements:

    Final travel measurements:

    Hub travel: droop is still at 13.5” bump is at 25.375”. Resulting in 11.875” of hub travel. Collapsed shock length is now at 17”. With these coilovers, the collapsed length is 16 7/8”, which works out perfectly.

    This is 0.02” over my prior calculations before I cut the bump stop out. Proving my somewhat janky measuring and angles were pretty close.

    With this shock, I am only going to cut and move the bump stop as the shock runs out of stoke - at the same time the tie rod end binds.

    If a standard 8” coilover is used, obviously the shock measurements would change. The 8” standard coilover from king is 24” extended and 16” collapsed eyelet to eyelet. The top hat to convert to the Toyota coil bucket adds 1/2” to these lengths making it 24.5” extended and 16.5” collapsed. Which based on my measurements, at cv bind on droop and the outter tie rod bind at bump, the shock length is 23 1/4” extended and 17” collapsed. Making an off the shelf king shock work. Unfortunately this is only using 6 1/4” of shock stoke. Meaning, If the outter tie rod mount on the spindle was modified, and the upper shock mount moved up, the kit should be able to cycle all 13” of travel within the working range of the CV angles with RCVs. A machined inner cup on an OEM CV could result in more travel.

    RCLT 21.HEIC.jpg RCLT 22.HEIC.jpg RCLT 23.HEIC.jpg RCLT 24.HEIC.jpg RCLT 25.HEIC.jpg RCLT 26.HEIC.jpg RCLT 27.HEIC.jpg RCLT 28.HEIC.jpg

    Notes:
    This truck does have the JD Fab Lower Pivot as well. I set the LCA as far back as I could to help return it back to "center". I do not know how far this may have moved the LCA Forward compared to OEM mounts. This could change travel numbers as the CV is not traveling straight up and down perpendicular to the ground.

    I am not saying this is a good or bad LT kit. Simply feedback and my observations as an installer. I do love the horizontal uniballs, spindle design and obvious strength and given, without budget restrictions, I would feel comfortable using a bump stop off the upper control arm with an engine cage. Which ideally is the way to bump stop IFS - but just my opinion.
     
  2. Jul 13, 2022 at 4:09 PM
    #2
    JoeCOVA

    JoeCOVA Well-Known Member

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    Dude! Awesome writeup
     
  3. Jul 13, 2022 at 4:29 PM
    #3
    hardline_taco

    hardline_taco Member

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    Awesome write up! Oh and that jack!!
     
    skeletron and Tacoma1192[OP] like this.
  4. Jul 13, 2022 at 4:43 PM
    #4
    betterbuckleup

    betterbuckleup Well-Known Member

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  5. Jul 13, 2022 at 5:27 PM
    #5
    Tac05

    Tac05 Unknown Member

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    Super informative, thank you for this write up!
     
  6. Jul 13, 2022 at 6:30 PM
    #6
    Chadr7858

    Chadr7858 Well-Known Member

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    All the mods; all the problems
    I love math it never lies!
     
  7. Jul 13, 2022 at 8:24 PM
    #7
    Dirtyblacktaco

    Dirtyblacktaco New Member

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    Let’s say we don’t have 10k to spend on this kit. What do you think is comparable for half or 3/4 of the price?
    I’ve been saving for this kit but open to other options. thanks for your advice
     
    dk_crew, Slashaar and BlessdApparel1 like this.
  8. Jul 14, 2022 at 1:16 AM
    #8
    WormSquirts

    WormSquirts Armageddon

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    Thanks for taking the time to write it all out. Been watching this kit for years, and curious how they failed to fix the obvious mistakes in all of their endless r&d and "testing".

    Definitely much better value kits out there pulling better travel numbers on stock spindles. Obviously the strength is there with this kit, which is cool.

    Wondering if the higher shock compression ratio of 1.9:1 lends itself to better articulation when crawling compared to more typical 1.5:1. Most ifs kits don't articulate super well and leave a lot of up travel on the table when slowly articulating I find.
     
    Dayman Karate likes this.
  9. Jul 14, 2022 at 6:34 AM
    #9
    Dayman Karate

    Dayman Karate Fighter of the night man, champion of the sun

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    Mostly reg ass vehicles for once
    https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/daymans-karate-class-but-you-wont-learn-nothin-4-link-lt-and-previous-iterations.755134/
    FWIW lots of folks including myself have enjoyed the JD kits. I’ve got the +2.25 version and measure 12.5” at the hub with a stock bump stop in and strapped right before the coil slaps the UCA. No bind in the 934 CV. Excellent customer service and support. No smoke and mirrors.
     
  10. Jul 14, 2022 at 7:46 AM
    #10
    Dayman Karate

    Dayman Karate Fighter of the night man, champion of the sun

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    https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/daymans-karate-class-but-you-wont-learn-nothin-4-link-lt-and-previous-iterations.755134/
    Coils make for shitty sway bars haha
     
  11. Jul 14, 2022 at 8:01 AM
    #11
    BlessdApparel1

    BlessdApparel1 Overland Warehouse Online

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    @pelfreybuilt Aluminum Front Bumper @Dirtking 2.5 Long Travel @bajadesignsofficial Fog Pocket Kit, S1’s, A Pillar Squadrons @bajadesignsofficial 20” S 8 @cbioffroadfab Bedrails @mountain_hatch Tailgate Attachment @dirtylyfewheels 17” Roadkill Race Beadlocks @falkentire Wildpeak A/T’s @yakimaracks RTT @nickdeyatnight Rocksliders And Custom Rear Swingout Bumper @shibui_tank On Board Air @calicowboywhiskey Whiskey @phalcon_trailers Dualzone Fridge @fabzonearmor Skids @Allpro Offroad Bed Stiffners And Gas Tank Skid @archivegarage Rear shock location @Iconvehicledynamics RXT Leafs Pack @4xinnovations hangars and shackle flip @Radflo Custom 2.0 resis with finned 2.5 Res and adjuster
    I think the strength of this kit is awesome, as well as the ground clearance gained, BUT for the cost out the door for the complete “loaded” version of the kit, personally I wouldn’t run it.

    I run a @Dirt King Fab kit on my truck, and have wheeled it hard. And it’s has held up insanely good to the beating and the customer service has been phenomenal.
    Not to mention your into the kit a few thousand less.
    Just my opinion but let’s be honest, the point of this kit was an ifs upgrade to withstand the rocks and run bigger tires without all the cutting etc.

    but with the total cost of this kit, and the travel numbers, why wouldn’t someone just go SAS?

    You would honestly probably still save some cash.

    just my opinion.
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2022
    Tacoma1192[OP] and Dirt King Fab like this.
  12. Jul 14, 2022 at 8:07 AM
    #12
    BlessdApparel1

    BlessdApparel1 Overland Warehouse Online

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    @pelfreybuilt Aluminum Front Bumper @Dirtking 2.5 Long Travel @bajadesignsofficial Fog Pocket Kit, S1’s, A Pillar Squadrons @bajadesignsofficial 20” S 8 @cbioffroadfab Bedrails @mountain_hatch Tailgate Attachment @dirtylyfewheels 17” Roadkill Race Beadlocks @falkentire Wildpeak A/T’s @yakimaracks RTT @nickdeyatnight Rocksliders And Custom Rear Swingout Bumper @shibui_tank On Board Air @calicowboywhiskey Whiskey @phalcon_trailers Dualzone Fridge @fabzonearmor Skids @Allpro Offroad Bed Stiffners And Gas Tank Skid @archivegarage Rear shock location @Iconvehicledynamics RXT Leafs Pack @4xinnovations hangars and shackle flip @Radflo Custom 2.0 resis with finned 2.5 Res and adjuster
    THIS!
     
  13. Jul 14, 2022 at 8:09 AM
    #13
    Bagg3r1

    Bagg3r1 Member

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    Man, how are you getting 12" of travel out of your +2 baja kit with factory bump stop? I have the same kit and was only achieving 8.5" of travel with their 8" coil over. I ordered the BTF fabrication LT to replace it. Not calling you a liar on numbers, just wondering if mine wasn't set up correctly.
     
  14. Jul 14, 2022 at 9:23 AM
    #14
    dib

    dib Well-Known Member

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    Feel like my Camburg LT setup is still competitive after that write up. Really appreciate seeing all those details next to
    photos.
     
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  15. Jul 14, 2022 at 9:48 AM
    #15
    Crinale

    Crinale Member

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    :( stock :(
    He didn't say anything about stock bump stops, lol. Considering how built his truck is, including tubbed front wheel wells for fitting 40s, I would guess he has custom bump stops and straps

    Great info on the RCLT kit! I had wondered about how it looks when really broken down by the numbers
     
  16. Jul 14, 2022 at 9:53 AM
    #16
    Airdog

    Airdog did your Mom

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    “It uses the full stroke of the shock without moving the shock mount or factory bump stop.”
    Last sentence of the first paragraph.
     
  17. Jul 14, 2022 at 9:57 AM
    #17
    desertjunkie760

    desertjunkie760 @DesertJunkie760 (IG)

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    Great write up and thanks for taking the additional time to obtain the numbers! Only 8.75" of travel is crazy for the price of the kit but if you're going this route moving the bump stop wouldn't be that much more work to get a better return on investment. This does solidify the speculation that you're going to have very limited travel with this kit if you're not willing to severely cut the inner fenders, firewall, etc in order to gain all of the usable up travel.
     
  18. Jul 14, 2022 at 9:59 AM
    #18
    Dayman Karate

    Dayman Karate Fighter of the night man, champion of the sun

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    https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/daymans-karate-class-but-you-wont-learn-nothin-4-link-lt-and-previous-iterations.755134/
    I don’t know any crawler who would want more bump over droop. Nobody wants to belly out crawling or have to deal with a big tire in the inner fender more than they already have to.
     
  19. Jul 14, 2022 at 10:00 AM
    #19
    JoeCOVA

    JoeCOVA Well-Known Member

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    But not as many likes on the gram
     
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  20. Jul 14, 2022 at 10:01 AM
    #20
    Dayman Karate

    Dayman Karate Fighter of the night man, champion of the sun

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    https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/daymans-karate-class-but-you-wont-learn-nothin-4-link-lt-and-previous-iterations.755134/
    That’s hilarious and should be addressed, but he’s talking about @Tacoma1192 truck.
     

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