Real world towing experience

I think Ford did a great job of defining: "hunting", a cyclic repetition of gear shifts between adjacent gear ratios with corresponding changes in vehicle speed.

Regarding the issue being solved, if that's true then there is nothing to do. However being aware that it can happen and knowing what to do if it does is still prudent to prevent wear or damage to the transmission. This is what I said in my original post. IF hunting starts happening then downshift.

That being said. My own experience says that while it is a less common occurrence than it used to be, it is still possible, and my 2018 Tacoma can in certain scenarios hunt (as per the Ford definition obove) while pulling my 3000lb boat. In those cases I simply downshift to S4 and all is happy.

 

You misquoted the owner's manual or you are quoting a different version. My 2020 manual says, "To maintain engine braking efficiency and charging system performance when using engine braking, do not use the transmission in D. If in the S mode, the transmission shift range position must be in 5 or lower."

Note also that the next bullet point says basically the same thing for manual transmissions which leads me further to believe that they are talking about braking efficiency and charging system performance while engine braking; not wear and tear on the transmission while towing.

Additionally, in the section specific to S-mode, the manual says, "Shift ranges and their functions: * You can choose from 6 levels of engine braking force. * A lower shift range will provide greater engine braking force than a higher shift range, and the engine speed will also increase."

I think people that have never driven a manual transmission are probably not as well acquainted with engine braking and thus these statements in the manual are easier to misinterpret.

 

Ya I read the same definition. It doesn't mention the frequency of the cycling though. If my transmission was cycling between 2 gears every 2 seconds, I would be concerned, but that was not what I experienced with my 2016 auto towing my 2300lb boat. It would downshift as I started up a hill and then downshift after I crested it. I don't think that is "gear hunting". I think that is proper shifting. With ECT enabled, it shifted similarly to how I shift my manual. I was not worried about my transmission destroying itself.

That said, anyone is welcome to put it S-mode if it pleases them. My only issue is the spread of unsubstantiated claims that you are doing something wrong if you use D when towing.

 

not what my 2016 says.

 

I guess they clarified it; or tried to.

 

Also on the subject of "frequent shift change" (exact language of the TBS) or "gear hunting" if you look here Toyota released a TSB to fix the gear hunting problem. Its clear from the release of the TSB that Toyota considers "Frequent shift change" an issue that at the very least needs fixing.

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/ecu-tsb-update.562550/

 

What you describe as downshifting when starting a hill and upshifting when cresting the hill is not hunting and is nothing to be concerned of. Hunting is constant shifting multiple times a minute which is something to be concerned about.

My truck doesn't hunt often. Only on one particular road that seems to be a perfect combination of conditions. All I'm saying is it's something to be aware of. If the truck isn't hunting, then drive like normal.

 

You if we are using the definition of gear hunting in the ford patent, frequent shift change is not the same. I think the TSB is more about tuning the shift points to be less annoying to people that were complaining about them.

 

Agreed.

 

Don't know about fords, this is a Toyota. Its clear that frequent shifting is considered undesirable by Toyota, else why spend money fixing the issue instead of telling owners its normal for the truck?

 

I assume because enough customers were complaining about it. Note that a TSB is not a recall.

 

Recalls are only for items that are of safety concern, everything else is a TSB or service campaign.

 

See here for recall definition
https://www.recalls.gov/nhtsa.html

 

I don’t think that’s true. I think a recall is for something Toyota thinks is a serious quality defect and a TSB is just information for techs about some common complaints. Personally the only recall I’ve encountered was for defective clutch discs in my Subaru. It was not a safety concern.

 

Serious defects are service campaigns. The word recall get thrown around a lot, but it has a specific definition made by the nhtsa. People call the 2nd gen frame replacement a "recall" but even that was technically a "service campaign" not a recall.

 

No time to read all that now. I will trust you. I don’t know if my clutch was a recall. All I know is that Subaru sent me a letter encouraging me to go to the dealer and get a new clutch. My clutch was exhibiting the behavior so I had it replaced. This was in like 2002.

 

Clutch was most likely a recall, if it caused you to loose power to the wheels if it had some kind of failure that is certainly a safety concern. Just like the 3rd gen fuel pump, a power loss at a bad time can easily cause an accident.

 

The clutch simply had a vibration when engaging due to a defect in a new clutch disk material as I remember. I’m not sure if they considered it a safety concern. My take on it was that they were willing to replace a part that is not under warranty because they acknowledged a quality defect.

 

Yeah, the people towing in s4 or s5 are just... for a lack of a better term... are using belt and suspenders. Unless you are truly seeing shifts back and forth every few seconds, there should be no need to have to use it. It's totally fine for you to use regular drive and have the transmission do powered downshifts when losing speed.

Clutch pads can typically handle a ton of temperature in them. It's only going to start scoring them at temperatures of 220+ degrees Celsius. It would then take a good number of shifts causing those kinds of clutch temps to have your trans sump fluid raise to a temp that burns the oil.

 

Idk, dealer told me never to use the D mode when towing...it puts too much strain on 6th gear. Said S5 is about the most you can use for light towing.