RUDE AWAKENING- Dealership sold me wrecked truck with clean title?

1.) What does " the frame was .3 off " mean? That statement in itself has no meaning. .3mm, .3 inches .3 feet, .3 yards or what ever measurement??? Plus I seriously Doubt that the Toyota Dealer has a framing machine in their shop. Serious!

2.) If the mysterious .3 measurement was on the alignment just a guess. How could they do an alignment if they are missing parts ( Mirror ) or obtain the .3 measurement.

3.) They removed the steering column and didn't tell you why? What does that even have to do with the frame? Dude you aren't asking enough questions from the service department.

4.) Well if it was sold with an " Sold As Is " disclaimer and esp you were given a chance to get the vehicle checked before purchase. And you signed the sold as is paperwork. All I can say is Anything that they do is a gift. You should look at it that way also. It is an expensive lesson. This is Not on the Dealer, but on you.

5.) How would taking out the steering column cheat the Carfax? Do you mean they replaced the Airbag while you were waiting? You don't pull the steering column to replace the airbag. You say you are not jumping to conclusions again, but you are...

I am not trying to be harsh, but it is in fact a harsh world out there.

You bought a used vehicle.
You did not inspect or have it checked by an independent shop.
You signed a " Sold As Is " Statement.

I do hope they work with you. If they don't you shouldn't be too harsh as a good bit of this belongs to you as well.

 

Makes me wanna pull a carfax on my truck

 

the dealer may not have known it was crashed when they sold it- that's a possibility. but they did sell him a crashed truck- and NOW they know how bad the damage was or wasn't. if it's really bad- they can make it right and are in a position to not lose as much as the OP (not that they necessarily have a responsibility to do so- they possibly don't, as I'm sure this happens more than they'd like to admit). they know it happens from time to time. when I've traded trucks, they (the dealer) don't even want to know details other than if it's seen damage over $5k. it's part of the game. if they miss something, and pass it on to the next guy, a good dealer would give a guy a break in some capacity if he came back unhappy. especially on a $30k truck. just my opinion, that's all. maybe split the difference. who knows. the used car biz is tough. it carries risk for both parties. but there are good dealers and bad ones.

 

Thats exactly why they have the as-is forms that OP signed. For him to expect anything, especially any sort of refund or buyback is very doubtful.

Even if it was crashed, as long as the frame was within spec, and the body panels were close enough to be in spec, the dealer did no wrong by selling the truck as certified pre-owned. Most likely, they had some lackey do the inspection who didn't even notice there was repairs done. And since the damage had not been reported to carfax before it was sold OP has no way to prove the dealer knew. For all we know some other shop did the work and the previous owner just brought it in for a trade-in.

 

without having all the info at this point, I can see both sides of it. all assumptions aside, there are dealers out there that would PREFER someone come back with the truck as opposed to having customers running around telling others that they sold a wrecked truck for 30 grand- even if they took a bit of a loss. good luck OP.

 

Did I miss the part where OP stated he got a CPO?

I know I saw the part where he had his purchase contract in the glove box for some reason.

 

Yes it was certified. Had the truck a few days and someone got in it during business hours in front of my shop on the rare occurrence of not locking. Took a couple of pay stubs, the manual... Fkers, my packet, and nothing else. Monitoring credit report and called police.

 

Pretty much what this is boiling down to. We'll see what they do. Even after this is over i'd rather have a different dealership upkeep the truck if I still have it. Wonder if I would have to ask for a refund or if that service carries over.

 

My only question here is if the truck was a Toyota CPO, how can it have been sold "as is"? That thing comes with an extended warranty and was supposed to have met the inspection criteria. But there are plenty of stories out there that the CPO is kind of a joke and many people have bought vehicles that never should have met the certified criteria if it weren't for the shady dealer that certified it.

Best of luck OP, hope it works out for you. I'd also like to echo what others have said and get Toyota USA involved if the dealer isn't willing to make it right.

 

It's under warranty for another few months so its not exactly AS IS.

This article is about exactly this situation: http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/...pre-owned-cars-could-be-on-the-rise/index.htm

I just read an interesting article about "diminished value" which is exactly what this truck suffers from.

"Your one-year-old vehicle is worth $30,000. One day, you're hit by another car, causing $5,000 in damage. Your insurance company pays for the repairs.

Your newly repaired car is still worth, $30,000 right? Wrong. Although your body shop does an excellent job, and your vehicle looks as good as it did before the accident, it's now much less desirable having been in a collision, should you decide to sell it now, or down the road.

Many times a frame or structurally damaged vehicle cannot be sold as a "certified used vehicle." This will impact the vehicle's value by as much as 40%!

This is where diminished value comes in! Your insurance company will be quick to write you a check for the repairs, but you're entitled to diminished value."


Here's a an excerpt from the list of dealer requirements for them to accept a Toyota Certified Pre Owned: (the whole list can be seen by clicking on the link)

Frame check (visual)
Check frame to be sure no damage has been done to frame; no non-factory welds; no cracks; not bent; no evidence of flood damage. See "Explanation of Frame/Unibody Damage" following Mechanical Standards and Process Notes.

They then go on to elaborate more specifically:

"EXPLANATION OF FRAME / UNIBODY DAMAGE
One of the basic principles of the TCUV Process is that only the "best of the best" used Toyotas should be certified. Any indications that there is/was frame or unibody damage, or any sign of structural repairs will automatically exclude the vehicle from the TCUV process. Following are indicators of frame/unibody damage which makes vehicle ineligible for certification:

Structural components can be defined as the major load-bearing and/or passenger-protecting structural components in the vehicle.

The following unibody components are defined as structural:

• Front radiator supports (core support), both upper and lower
• Front and rear side members (frame rails)
• Front and rear wheel house/strut tower assemblies (front fender aprons)
• A, B, C pillar assemblies
• Inner and outer rocker panel assemblies
• Floor pan, floor stiffener, floor tunnel
• Trunk floor assembly
• Front and rear suspension cross members
• Door intrusion beams
• Bumper reinforcement bars"

With a side collision like that I would be astounded if the door intrusion beams were not damaged. Chances are that this car cannot be sold as CPO which means it is of diminished value (Up to 40% they claim in the above article).

It sounds like the true monetary value of the damage to your truck may be well over $10,000. You can't walk away from that, at this point its a matter or principle.

 

They either have to admit they knew it was damaged or that they did not inspect it.... They can't have both.

 

Damn Skippy

 

I also found out that Carfax can be a complete waste of time.My fiance' had bought a used "accident free" car according to carfax.When I tried to trade it in I found out that it had been in a major accident.Either the original dealer fabricated the car fax report or ran it right before the accident was on it.

 

Throwing out some logic... me likey

 

Could be.
And you will need to spend hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars to prove it.

You want to be right? Or you want to be happy?

 

He has a point you know...

 

Car Fax would be the one doing the buy back. Car Fax buy back is only in the event that there has been a rebuilt, salvage, flood, totaled title, etc. reported to the state dmv. Your truck could have been in 10 of the same accidents, but if none of those single accidents is enough for the insurance company to deem it unfixable or "totaled", the title isn't branded and will always be "clean".

From Carfax:

"A "Branded Title" is a passenger motor vehicle ownership or registration document issued by any of the 50 states of the U.S. (or the District of Columbia) or a passenger motor vehicle registration document issued by any province of Canada which was issued with words or symbols signifying that the vehicle was: junked or salvaged; dismantled, rebuilt or reconstructed; flood damaged; fire damaged; hail damaged; bought back by its manufacturer ("Lemon Law" vehicle); odometer exceeds mechanical limits; odometer was not actual mileage; or which was issued with any other symbol or word signifying a similar Brand.

Specifically excluded from the definition of "Branded Title" for the purposes of this Guarantee are: titles originally issued without a Brand but later stamped with a Brand without being reissued; salvage titles issued due to theft; damage disclosure documents and Branded Titles issued in error and later corrected."


A car with a "clean" title doesn't mean it hasn't been damaged before. Just means that an insurance company responsible for the damages hasn't deemed it not fixable and thus hasn't turned over the title to the state (Texas). Like I said, you could be in 100 major accidents and still have a "clean" title.

Like it or not, your truck has a legitimate clean title with an accident on the report. Carfax isn't buying it back.

 

with age comes wisdom. Plus...you soon realize you only have so many days left. I'd rather go fishing.

 

Another good point...It's Fly time in Colorado and my weekends for the forseeable future are booked

 

I bought a used Toyota Certified Tacoma from a Toyota dealer. The paperwork showed it was certified and sold with a warranty, not "as is".