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Sagging Alcan 8-Leaf pack? Opinions wanted

Discussion in 'Suspension' started by Dr. Sleep, Mar 22, 2011.

  1. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:17 PM
    #1
    Dr. Sleep

    Dr. Sleep [OP] Well-Known Member

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    About a year ago, I installed a pair of 8-leaf Alcans on my 2007 Double cab that I bought from Wheelers. Gradually, I've noticed that the rear seems to be sagging. I haven't abused the springs, and only load the bed down occasionally for skiing trips or whatever. When I installed them new, I measured from the center of the wheel directly up to the center of the fender flares (bed empty). Drivers side was: 23" and Passengers side was 23.5". Now, the measurements are (bed empty): drivers side: 21.25" and passenger side: 22". I'll attach some photos, and stock photos for comparison.

    Alcans with empty bed (you can see distance between timbren and frame in photo):

    [​IMG]


    Another shot of sagging/Alcans (empty bed):

    [​IMG]


    shot of stock spring:

    [​IMG]

    another shot stock spring:

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:18 PM
    #2
    crf69

    crf69 scraping my emblems off my plasti-dip

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    ummm yeah
  3. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:29 PM
    #3
    97yota4wd

    97yota4wd Well-Known Member

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    caged, camburg long travel, 50t leafpack (soon to be installed) light rack over cab, 5pt harnesses etc
    wow): im sorry... i heard someone saying you can take it somewhere and they will reheat them and let them cool where they are supposed to be? can someone chim in on this and help out
     
  4. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:33 PM
    #4
    MAXTacoma

    MAXTacoma Well-Known Member

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    I was interested in these as I tow a lot and need a somewhat stiff rear suspension. Sorry your having trouble, but thanks for the info. I dont want to be in your situation in a year. Are you bottoming out now?
     
  5. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:43 PM
    #5
    Dr. Sleep

    Dr. Sleep [OP] Well-Known Member

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    If the bed is empty, I don't bottom out. If I have even a couple hundred pounds of stuff in the bed, I will easily bottom out when going over bump/dip.

    I've contacted Charles at Alcan and Jason at Wheelers, and sent them the pictures you see. Jason asked for some more pictures, which I sent him. We'll see if they can offer any solution. Charles didn't think there was anything wrong with the pictures I sent him. I said a negative arch was normal. But I don't remember any negative arch to my stock springs.

    Perhaps, a single add a leaf in the middle somewhere would solve my problem--creating a 9-leaf pack. :)
     
  6. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:46 PM
    #6
    achirdo

    achirdo I Weld!

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    negative arch on any leafs isnt "normal" unless you have weight in the bed or towinig.
     
  7. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:52 PM
    #7
    Dr. Sleep

    Dr. Sleep [OP] Well-Known Member

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    That's what I thought . . . but Charles at Alcan said it was normal on our trucks. Let me quote the email he sent, "
    Hi Shane You need to go through Wheelers and they well contact me about them. Since you did not send a full side view I do not know how the truck is setting. The springs well have a little reverse arch which does not heart them. "
     
  8. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:56 PM
    #8
    MAXTacoma

    MAXTacoma Well-Known Member

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    I currently have the non-TSB w/ a Toytec 2" AAL. I've had it for about a year also and its starting to lose strenght. I created a thread but still really haven't found a leaf pack that will do what I want it to.

    Here is my thread I created if you have any insight.
    http://www.tacomaworld.com/forum/suspension/145791-body-roll-sloppy-suspension.html
     
  9. Mar 22, 2011 at 12:57 PM
    #9
    rjclemen

    rjclemen Well-Known Member

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    I don't trust anyone who cannot spell four letter words correctly. heart =/= hurt. This guy is obviously a moron.
     
  10. Mar 22, 2011 at 1:00 PM
    #10
    Dr. Sleep

    Dr. Sleep [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Well, Charles at Alcan seems to be a pretty well respected guy. Jason from Wheelers had this to say about him/Alcan:

    "The springs do not have a positive arch like a domestic truck. You can verify this by going to your local Toyota dealer and looking at a stock truck. Charles builds a good leaf pack and we have the least amount of issues in comparison to Deavers or Icons."

    Granted hurt does not = heart ;)
     
  11. Mar 22, 2011 at 1:17 PM
    #11
    rjclemen

    rjclemen Well-Known Member

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    Sorry I have been proof-reading contracts all day. I sometimes wonder how people can function in life on a daily basis.
     
  12. Mar 22, 2011 at 1:41 PM
    #12
    macgyver

    macgyver Well-Known Member

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    I wonder the same thing.

    There are people I work with who have bachelor's degrees and I wonder how they even made it past the 9th grade...much less graduated college.

    Oh wait, they have degrees from a Diploma mill....cough cough *Strayer** cough cough.
     
  13. Mar 23, 2011 at 9:01 AM
    #13
    raycie

    raycie Well-Known Member

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    Ummmm.... Did you install the timbrens?

    When installed, they are supposed to be 1" from the frame (bed unloaded).. So, technically you are not bottoming out, you are using the timbrens to cushion the load. Did this problem start after or before the timbrens? If the timbrens are more than 1" unloaded, you ay need to call timbrens to send you the correct size spacer so they will be 1"... Some go 3/4"....

    Op.. Measure from the top of the leaf springs to the frame... What you got?

    As for your springs... I have no idea, but corrected timbrens may help what you experience as bottoming out...
     
  14. Mar 23, 2011 at 11:14 AM
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    Dr. Sleep

    Dr. Sleep [OP] Well-Known Member

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    ^^^ not sure what the distance is supposed to be between timbrens and frame . . . no where in their literature do they state it should be 3/4" to 1".

    Regardless . . . the leaf springs used to be between 1" and 2" higher than they are now, and they appear to be sagging with some negative arch to them when the bed is completely unloaded. And my truck now has a reverse rake to how it sits.
     
  15. Mar 23, 2011 at 11:52 AM
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    singlefin

    singlefin Well-Known Member

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    Find a local shop that can re-arch the springs that will get you some extra life on them. I had my springs recently re-arched. FWIW it cost me $180 to have them pull the leafs and re-arch them.
     
  16. Mar 23, 2011 at 12:06 PM
    #16
    Dr. Sleep

    Dr. Sleep [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Good idea, but these leaf springs are barely more than a year old. Surely, if it only takes a year for them to sag, if I had them heated and rearched, they'd be sagging again in a year.

    I think my solution will involve 1 or more additional leaves to the leaf pack.
     
  17. Mar 23, 2011 at 2:34 PM
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    raycie

    raycie Well-Known Member

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    Not sure if adding a leaf to an already shot set will last. I know the OME full leaf set has an aal that you can add for heavier loads, but looking at the leafs that you have, not sure where in the pack it would need to be placed...maybe somewhere in the middle...

    As for your timbrens, I haven't received mine in the mail, so don't know what the "actual" instruction say, but everything I've read so far ( even on their website) says 1"...

    From the website....Q. I installed a rear kit on my pickup truck and it's almost touching the axle. The installation instructions indicate that I need a 1" gap. What should I do?
    A. Remove the spacer supplied in the assembly. If you have already done this or if there is no spacer in the kit then take the vehicle out for a test drive. Often with a vehicle having a partial load, or a vehicle having an older suspension, the rubber spring may be in contact with the axle with no adverse ride quality. If ride quality does appear to be poor, contact Timbren Customer Service.
    *
    Q. I installed a rear kit on my pickup truck and there is more than 3 inches of gap between the rubber spring and the axle. Is this OK?
    A. Ideally, you want to adjust the rubber spring to within a gap of about 1 inch. In most cases this can be done with a spacer included in the suspension enhancement system. If you have already installed everything included with the kit, contact the seller of the product (your Timbren Dealer) or Timbren customer service for a quick solution to this issue.
     
  18. Mar 23, 2011 at 2:53 PM
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    Digiratus

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  19. Mar 23, 2011 at 3:07 PM
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    04LTtacoma

    04LTtacoma Well-Known Member

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    Looks like it's time to get a new leaf spring kit!:D
     
  20. Mar 24, 2011 at 8:42 AM
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    Dr. Sleep

    Dr. Sleep [OP] Well-Known Member

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    I hope not. . . . I'll post my solution, once I've got it.
     
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