1. Welcome to Tacoma World!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all Tacoma discussion topics
    • Communicate privately with other Tacoma owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

Soft Brakes (slot rotors & stainless lines)

Discussion in 'Technical Chat' started by WV_Tacoma, Sep 1, 2009.

  1. Sep 1, 2009 at 10:19 AM
    #1
    WV_Tacoma

    WV_Tacoma [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Member:
    #19738
    Messages:
    259
    Gender:
    Male
    Huntington, WV
    Vehicle:
    05 Pre, DBL Cab
    Not enough
    Installed Slotted rotors, Ceramic pads, stainless lines (4).......flushed the brake system with Synt DOT 3 & 4 fluid.

    Installed/bleed/flushed by an extremely good mech (friend) and myself....

    Brakes are still soft feeling...Not like I would expect with all this stuff added.... Virtually no different feel at all with the pedal.......

    You guys have same results?

    Thanks
     
  2. Sep 1, 2009 at 10:22 AM
    #2
    [eric]

    [eric] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2009
    Member:
    #13502
    Messages:
    139
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Eric
    Bend, OR
    Vehicle:
    2005 Tacoma TRD OFF Road
    would love to see pics?
     
  3. Sep 1, 2009 at 10:37 AM
    #3
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2007
    Member:
    #924
    Messages:
    17,767
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Milton Juevos Portimous II
    NJ
    Vehicle:
    '06 TRD Access Cab, v6, 6-speed
    Scaffolding and a painted grill
    Did you adjust the rear drums?

    Also, did you bleed the brakes by sucking fluid with a pump or using the pump-the-pedal technique? The latter takes 2 people to do right but works best.
     
  4. Sep 1, 2009 at 10:57 AM
    #4
    SC4333

    SC4333 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2008
    Member:
    #11412
    Messages:
    2,190
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Grant
    San Antonio, TX
    Vehicle:
    2016 TRD Off-Road 4x4 DCSB - Super White
    SOLD!

    I'll second that. Bleeding hydraulic lines the old fashioned way will usually work the best. Most of the time I'll stick a power bleeder on it to flush the system, then bleed the system manually.

    I wouldn't expect much of a change in feel. Unless you are changing out the master cylinder and calipers, you probably will not notice much of a difference in feel.
     
  5. Sep 1, 2009 at 11:18 AM
    #5
    WV_Tacoma

    WV_Tacoma [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Member:
    #19738
    Messages:
    259
    Gender:
    Male
    Huntington, WV
    Vehicle:
    05 Pre, DBL Cab
    Not enough
    We used pump, he would sit in back, open valve, I would pump the brakes (engine off), he would bleed, I would hold down the pedal after pumping then he would close valve...We did this until fresh fluid came out, he said all the air was out.

    They are adaquate for normal operation, just a bit on the soft side...I was hoping for a firmer brake pedal..

    Pics attached

    DSC00719.jpg
    DSC00722.jpg
    DSC00723.jpg
    DSC00721.jpg
     
  6. Sep 1, 2009 at 11:57 AM
    #6
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2007
    Member:
    #924
    Messages:
    17,767
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Milton Juevos Portimous II
    NJ
    Vehicle:
    '06 TRD Access Cab, v6, 6-speed
    Scaffolding and a painted grill
    Looks good and you used the right technique. Try adjusting the rear drums and see if that helps. There's a slot in the rear of the drum that you'll be able to fit a flat-head screwdriver through. Use that to turn the star spinner inside the drum until the shoes start to drag inside the drum.

    Jack up the truck ahead of time so you can spin the wheel to check drag as you adjust, obviously. :)
     
  7. Sep 1, 2009 at 12:01 PM
    #7
    Janster

    Janster Old & Forgetful

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2007
    Member:
    #1138
    Messages:
    14,255
    Gender:
    Female
    First Name:
    Jandy
    Lancaster, PA
    Vehicle:
    2016 GMC Canyon SLT w/ LineX and....
    Check for leaks..... especially around where the stainless lines were installed.

    Did you use new crush washers?

    If you find a leak, obviously...you have to fix it and bleed the brakes again.
     
  8. Sep 1, 2009 at 2:12 PM
    #8
    WV_Tacoma

    WV_Tacoma [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Member:
    #19738
    Messages:
    259
    Gender:
    Male
    Huntington, WV
    Vehicle:
    05 Pre, DBL Cab
    Not enough
    Ran my hand down the lines, no leaks. Fluid is full to the line.

    I thought the drums were self adjusting?

    Anyone here got this same set up? Are your brakes soft? I mean they don't hit the floor but....500$ for looks isn't worth it for me...

    I tow a 5k trailer so guess if they don't warp like the others they are worth it...

    I just want to make sure they are as good as everyone else's with this set up!
     
  9. Sep 1, 2009 at 2:20 PM
    #9
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2007
    Member:
    #924
    Messages:
    17,767
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Milton Juevos Portimous II
    NJ
    Vehicle:
    '06 TRD Access Cab, v6, 6-speed
    Scaffolding and a painted grill
    Self-adjusting isn't always, and it's rarely as good as manually doing it.

    Your problem is a common complaint on the late model Tacomas.
     
  10. Sep 1, 2009 at 6:54 PM
    #10
    WV_Tacoma

    WV_Tacoma [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Member:
    #19738
    Messages:
    259
    Gender:
    Male
    Huntington, WV
    Vehicle:
    05 Pre, DBL Cab
    Not enough
    Thats kind of what I was looking for, common problem...Don't want to waste my time dicking with it if it is normal....

    I jammed the brakes 3 times, 3 baselines before putting all this on. didn't measure it yet, marked it with paint. all 3 with-in 8'....pretty close...I will attempt to see if all this helped with stopping.....Seat of the pants but all I have.....

    I think Chris (silver taco) has it right. If I am not mistaken, he don't believe in all this hype about shit....CIA, Muffler bearings, 5 extra cow power(i can really tell), Power band in a box, etc..etc....lol
     
  11. Sep 1, 2009 at 7:08 PM
    #11
    jandrews

    jandrews Carolina Alliance Southwest Region Ambassador

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2009
    Member:
    #18122
    Messages:
    12,180
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    '09 FourDubDee TRD OR
    A-TRUCK, Fat Kid in the Bed, Custom Pinstriping, Ported and Polished Muffler Bearing, Hi-Performance Bed Mat
    They feel squishy, but they damn sure work.

    I was heading to work the other day when a guy blew a red light right in front of me. I was about 40 feet from the intersection, so was he, and I had the green, but he was going fast enough I could tell he wasn't stopping.

    I put the brake pedal into the floorboard and the ABS kicked in. I was doing about 40 mph. CHIRP-CHIRP-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D-D.

    Stopped me a few feet shy of the intersection as he blew threw. I <3 my Taco.
     
  12. Sep 1, 2009 at 7:22 PM
    #12
    WV_Tacoma

    WV_Tacoma [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Member:
    #19738
    Messages:
    259
    Gender:
    Male
    Huntington, WV
    Vehicle:
    05 Pre, DBL Cab
    Not enough
    agreed....mine did the same when I tested them...Never left a mark BFG 275 16"s..... The power assist is like power steering, makes it plush(girlie)... I had an Acura NSX with no power steering....Not girlie, slightly hard at low speeds...But damn was it awsome.... Not downing the Taco brakes...Just thought the lines/rotors/ceramic would stiffen the shit out of them... :-(
     
  13. Sep 3, 2009 at 8:32 PM
    #13
    WV_Tacoma

    WV_Tacoma [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Member:
    #19738
    Messages:
    259
    Gender:
    Male
    Huntington, WV
    Vehicle:
    05 Pre, DBL Cab
    Not enough
    Now after pressing the brakes at the stop light and holding them,,,they go down just past the gas pedal about 1.5" ???????????????

    Are yours this soft? Check yours if you can when you stop completely.

    thanks
     
  14. Sep 3, 2009 at 9:38 PM
    #14
    Zombie Runner

    Zombie Runner Are these black helicopters for me?

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2008
    Member:
    #5246
    Messages:
    15,036
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Kevin
    Wichita Falls, TX
    Vehicle:
    Tundra, double cab.
    LED interior lights, stubby antenna, Pioneer in dash screen, good driver mod.

    ill agree with this. I had some dumbass old lady cut right in front of me and then 2 more lanes of on coming traffic...my foot was on the floor with the brake pedel and the anti-lock brakes did their work!

    I then proceeded to follow the woman and laid on my horn till she pulled over and chewed her ass out...haha
     
  15. Sep 4, 2009 at 4:08 AM
    #15
    Janster

    Janster Old & Forgetful

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2007
    Member:
    #1138
    Messages:
    14,255
    Gender:
    Female
    First Name:
    Jandy
    Lancaster, PA
    Vehicle:
    2016 GMC Canyon SLT w/ LineX and....
    Not exactly sure what you're saying here.... but.... There's no relation between the gas & the brake pedals, so there's really no reason why it can't go past the gas pedal.

    Unless you just didn't word something properly.

    If you're completely stopped and the pedal keeps moving downward...then you've definately got a leak somewhere.
     
  16. Sep 5, 2009 at 8:35 PM
    #16
    WV_Tacoma

    WV_Tacoma [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Member:
    #19738
    Messages:
    259
    Gender:
    Male
    Huntington, WV
    Vehicle:
    05 Pre, DBL Cab
    Not enough
    Talked to a guy today, he said............SS braided brake lines=very min feel for a normal driver...but they look nice.......And could last a long time...

    Brake pads=ceramics=longer life pads, cleaner operating dust. No noticeable breaking stopping power to measure

    Slotted Rotors-Will keep the pads cooler/rotor cooler, making the pads and Rotors last longer.....................

    So I should not feel anything from 4 ss brake lines/ slotted rotors /ceramice pads....

    The thing I should feel is while pulling my travel trailer 6k#, the rotors/pads will be better with respect to warping, excessive wear!!!! So guess I cna quit looking for the reason!!!

    Thanks guys
     
  17. Sep 6, 2009 at 1:39 PM
    #17
    gfiber

    gfiber Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2009
    Member:
    #20680
    Messages:
    138
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Gary
    Seattle, WA
    Vehicle:
    Silver TRD Sport
    TRD sport pkg, Towing Pkg
    When I learned to do brakes..to bleed I would pump the brake pedal about 7 or 8 times then keep pressure on it. The partner would open the bleeder and the pedal would drop to the floor. Keeping pressure on the pedal until the bleeder was closed. Do it again, in between keeping an eye on the brake fluid in the master cylinder.

    If you pump the pedal with the bleeder open you WILL draw air back into the lines.
    Another way is to place a bottle with some brake fluid in it and attach a clear plastic hose to the bleeder nipple. Now you can pump to your hearts content as the bottom of the hose is in brake fluid no air can get in that way. This method works pretty well for a one person job.

    Always start bleeding at the farthest point from the Master Cylinder. Right rear, Left rear, Right front and finally Left front. ABS system my also enter into the picture harboring some air bubbles. Spongy pedal still sounds like air in the lines to me. The brake pedal should be very solid without the engine running, no vacuum assist, except for some travel as the shoes apply pressure to the rotors and drums..

    For adjusting drum brakes I learned to tighten the adjusters until it takes two hands to move the tire/wheel, called two hand drag. Then using a brake spoon back off the adjustment 15 clicks. Worked every time for me and drum brakes. Probably best to check with Toyota for their specs too.

    Self adjusting drum brakes only work as you stop when backing up. If your still moving in reverse and place the vehicle into drive, no adjustment is done. Go to a nice empy parking lot when your done and back up at about 10 MPH then press hard on the brakes. Do that about 10 times and if there is any adjustment to be had and the adjusters are working they will do their job.

    Will be interesting to know if you hear brake squeal from the harder pads.

    Hope this helps

    Gary K8IZ
     
  18. Sep 7, 2009 at 8:24 PM
    #18
    WV_Tacoma

    WV_Tacoma [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2009
    Member:
    #19738
    Messages:
    259
    Gender:
    Male
    Huntington, WV
    Vehicle:
    05 Pre, DBL Cab
    Not enough
    "Will be interesting to know if you hear brake squeal from the harder pads."

    Hope this helps

    Gary K8IZ[/QUOTE]


    No brake noise what so ever.....Even jamming the brakes at 55-3x to measure braking performance............100' average...........Same as before all the work.

    Thanks guys for the braking advice and help........
     
  19. Sep 7, 2009 at 8:53 PM
    #19
    coma09

    coma09 Senior Member. Hey, what's That supposed to mean?

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2009
    Member:
    #18751
    Messages:
    210
    Gender:
    Male
    BC Canada
    Vehicle:
    2013 taco access cab 4x4
    Putco led map light bulbs, bed mat, Xiang trifecta tonneau, blackout front emblem, paint tow hoop, led bed light strip, scan gauge II, debadge, buff paint, oem fog light kit, 1000w inverter, Viair 300P compressor, Contura V dash switches, chop last L bend from exhaust, remove charcoal air filter, extinguisher, mag light, Ss side steps, kayak rack, tailgate security, bed mat security
    Pontiac Vibe ... swapped out with drilled and slotted rotors - also ceramic pads (premium brand).

    Didn't flush fluid (vehicle was only a few months old)
    Didn't swap rubber lines for SS.

    Difference in feel was HUGE. Initial bite was very solid, and little fade. Worth every cent. Rotors were not high end of what was available in drilled rotors. Pads were best available.

    Contrast:

    87 Vette had worn pads, so I used the cheapest pads I could find to replace. Braking was nearly ineffective after. Purged/bled fluid - no change.
    Bought stock pads from dealer - and voila... back to normal.

    I agree with the poster who suggested checking rears are adjusted properly.
    However if you didn't touch them, and braking hasn't improved ... I'd suspect the front pad material.

    Soft pedal feel though is usually air in the line. On an older vehicle I'd also suspect master cylinder.

    So soft pedal? or the grab/bite not as hard as you expected?

    air in line, or pads.


    One other suspect would be the SS lines. If they are smaller ID than stock rubbers, the restricted flow may offset the other gains you made. Simple (well simple for me to suggest - lol!) but put the rubber lines on and retest.

    Lot of variables changed during your install.
     
To Top