SOLVED! Post 2853 Leaking Injectors, Dealer Techs Rock! Extended Cranking after Engine Swap 3.4L 5vz

Thank you for this clarification Bamatoy, we were just getting ready to obsess over this mystery, and I just logged on to ask exactly that question - ya beat me to it! Damn, didn't realize you're a mind reader on top of being a brilliant mechanic!?!!??!

 

Fwiw bama, i didnt bail on the industry because of that one particular experiance-
I left mainly for the benefits and security of the state job.
I would rather work on cars than do my job honestly but the benefits keep me there. Id really like to get a class a cdl and become a fleet mechanic for ohio dept of transportation although it would be a cut in pay that is my goal for the next 4 years.

 

I love doing this job. I actually left a job that not only paid me $45k a year at the time, but had the potential of making over 6 figures. I just didn't like the job. I love diagnosing and fixing vehicles. I always have. I've been turning wrenches since I was 13 with my step-father. So that means right at 33 years. I love it.

 

no greater satisfaction then to bring something back from the dead and make it work again. its the challenge of solving the riddle of whats wrong with it.

 

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Me too,
I do alot of side work out of my shop for a local used car dealer and a towing company/service station that specializes in light repair. I love timing belts so the service station usually just brings them to me, charges the customer what he does then pays me what I need. Keeps me pretty busy between the two of them and funds my expensive hobbies.
I knew life would be easier with a lift, after buying one I quickly realized I needed two- one for my projects and one for other peoples stuff I work on.
Ive had to turn down alot of jobs because of my lift being tied up with a week or month long project of my own.
I prefer buying vehicles in need of major repair and selling them vs working on sombodys stuff but I still do it. Just pisses me off when someone comes back and says something like "Ever since you put a water pump on my car there has been a squeak coming from the right rear tire."
I did a brake job and rear diff axle seals on an 05 sienna awd. Brought in for a noise in the rear- Couldnt hear nothing over the sound of the rear brakes- it was 1/2 quart low on the rear diff because the vent had seized up causing excess pressure in the diff housing causing a blown axle seal, was totally missing the driver side inner rear pad - caliper piston was eaten up by the rotor and the caliper had to be replaced. The lady was pissed because it was going to add another $100 to the bill, it would have to spend an extra 3 days in my shop because none of the local parts chains had one readily available and it was her only vehicle...Get it all back together and a noise is still present- told her the diff probably had a bad bearing- "Well how much is that!?!?" I told her I found one used for $1300, you would have thought I was the one that messed her van up. I get tired of dealing with that stuff more than anything..
Vehicle had 160k on it, still with the original timing belt..Advised her it needed changed or she might be looking at a new engine probably sooner than later- in one ear and out the other...
I know the snap on and cornwell guys by name, have thousands invested in tools. I could go back to a dealership and probably not miss a beat aside from running the newer diagnostic computers- last i used were a mt2500 and gm tech 2, fooled around on my buddys solus a few times but thats about it.
Warranty work was another issue that sucked in the dealership- back then it was 36k or 3 years- now most vehicles come with a 10 year 100k powertrain warranty which pays at a percentage of what your normal wage is- ill pass on the dealership thing

 

Bill,

You are a credit to your trade. I'm the type of person that always seeks to do a job on my own rather than pay someone to do it. If I need specialty tools, I look at it as Id rather spend the money to buy the specialty tools rather than pay $100+/hr for someone else to do it. But iif I have to bite the bullet and go to a shop, its a guy like you who I dont mind paying for your time and expertise.

I think we are both describing different ends of the spectrum of the auto repair industry. If every (or most) shops were run like the way you run your business or the dealerships you worked at, there would be much much less complaints about dealers amongst the public. However, unfortunately, that isnt the case.

I still feel that in general, the average joe would be better served educating himself on the task at hand, using the money he would pay on labor to buy the necessary tools, and doing the job himself rather than spinning the dealer roulette wheel.

With all that being said, personally, I have a lot of respect for guys like you who take pride in their work, value their honor and integrity, and realize that their work is a reflection of their character. I didnt mean to lump you in personally with my blanket condemnation of dealers & dealer techs. Anyway, I'll let the thread get back on topic, but thank you Bill for all the help you provide here on TW - like I said, you've helped me on more than one occasion in the past and its been much appreciated.

 

My last paid gig wrenching full time was in 1983 and I was getting paid $5/hr working on IH gasoline school buses with 345 motors. For me, engineering is a better gig...

 

Thanks for the kind words, and yes, I do agree that if someone is willing to learn or try, that they should. A lot of the key is, as you mentioned, tools. Some times certain jobs will cost you $400-$500 in tools, if you don't already have them. I have over $100k in tools right now that I have collected over the years.

One thing I have learned, that I am trying to express, falls within your spectrum of us looked from different end of the industry. I am not saying that all dealerships have the best, most perfect techs. What I AM saying though, it that there are many more legitimate dealers and techs than the bad ones. One thing you have to take into consideration is a simple, known fact of ANY service industry: On average a satisfied customer will tell an average of .1 people about their experience. That means that out of ten people, ONE might say something to ONE person. On the other end of the spectrum a person who had a BAD experience, in today's world, will tell an average of 100 people. (Taking into account social media) Every time you go to a restaurant and enjoy your mean, and feel good, do you go around on Facebook and tell all of your friends? I am betting not. People have a tendency to lack praise of others, but will happily condemn them. So your end of the spectrum is skewed in your direction based on typical human tendencies.

At my last dealership we would send out surveys to our customers so that we can calculate our "customer satisfaction index" or CSI score. Of all the customers who sent them back in and were happy, all they did was submit the survey, and that was it. However those few who were unhappy about it would blast the dealership on Facebook, Twitter, etc. What does that tell you?

Take this into thought: In the past 10 years, how many times did you receive unsatisfactory service (Car repair, restaurant, sales, etc) and of those times, how many times and people did you tell? Now in the past 10 years, how many restaurants, sales stores, etc did you visit, and things were done as you expected, and how many of THOSE times did you say something positive? If you really think about it, my information is accurate. Nobody says ANYTHING if things were done fine, but one small thing out of place and people will take to the social media and blast a company.

 

http://www.fuel-testers.com/list_e10_engine_damage.html Just skimmed that article about ethanol in fuel - really starting to wonder if this was a big portion of the cause of our issue in '07 and now also.

http://pure-gas.org/?stateprov=OR This one lists ethanol free stations in US and Canada. I was thinking we had some strange set up in Oregon as far as what was added or missing from our fuel, but didn't know details. Now reading this, seems like the "strange" part I've heard about was ethanol, and it's common across the country? Anyone know about this? Thoughts on whether fuel containing 10% ethanol could have contributed to the sorry state we're in now w/Taco? That article certainly mentioned things like engine damage, clogged injectors, piston problems. Also, I'm clueless about fuel in general, in terms of the ethanol thing, plus 87 vs. 89 vs. 91. I think husband said Taco's manual instructs using 87 only. But I've read/heard stuff about avoiding the cheap stuff (87) cuz it could lead to our pathetic current state. Anybody have fuel insight?

Happy Weekend guys!

 

All good points. Personally, I try to make an effort to spread the word about good service to my friends and family when i encounter it. But youre right, its much more likely that someone will make a stink about a poor exprerience than a good one.

 

Ethanol is crap that the enviro-do-gooders have made (nearly) mandatory to have in gas across the nation. Everyone knows its largely snake oil, but now no one in Congress has the balls to change anything for fear of the agricultural (corn) lobby.

 

Ethanol in fuel is highly supported by the CORN lobby, and the bill was passed when W Bush was president. As for saving oil, there are some analysis I have seen, to include the total energy cost of ethanol, to include the energy to make the fertilizer, the farm equipment and other infrastructure costs, Ethanol INCREASES oil usage. Win-win for the oil and agriculture industries. We all have stories of destroyed motors from ethanol, it works just fine in modern vehicles. Don't blame the ethanol issue on the green folks...

 

So what do you do, to avoid destroying your motor? You guys think it's worth seeking out gas stations that have ethanol free fuel? And how does the 87 vs 89 vs 91 figure into this?

 

I have been putting the ethanol fuel in my 1st gen with no problems in the engine, or cleanliness of the injectors. I do however put in a bottle of STP injector cleaner every 4 or 5 tanks.

 

Thanks Bamatoy! We'd been using the Chevron Techron fuel injection cleaner, mostly just cuz that's what Costco sells.....you think the STP is a better product? And do you pour in the STP when tank is nearly empty, then go fill up?

 

I use STP because in my years I have learned that it seems to do the best for keeping injectors cleaned. They have been around for a long time, and make great products. Their carb cleaner was the best around as well. When I get down to about 1/4 tank I will go to the gas station, pour the bottle of STP in, then immediately fill with gas. FULL tank. It mixes real well that way and is able to be most efficient. Don't put it in, THEN drive to the gas station. Put it in immediately before fueling up.

 

Got it, thanks Bamatoy!!

 

Husband just made a pickup truck cookie cutter out of a tin can, and I'm making pickup truck shaped cookies w/frosting to ship to the mechanics!!

 

Cute! I bet they will love it. And I tell you, little things like that go a LONG way with a technician.

 

Flames shooting out of the open hood.

Lucas cleaner,,just because we still have cases in the shop. Every 6 months or around 35K. Runs smooth after about 3 years of it, Plugs are even.