SOLVED! Post 2853 Leaking Injectors, Dealer Techs Rock! Extended Cranking after Engine Swap 3.4L 5vz

Is it really that big of a deal to have it start a little longer when its hot? We don't think so.

Our Suggetion:
Drive the truck. It will start, this isn't going to leave you stranded.

Save your money.

 

Wondering what the fuel pressure was during the last 3 out of truck injector test/cleanings.
Run it like that? While it would be fine for a while, the leaking fuel will be washing oil off the cylinder walls/rings with the potential for premature wear on those cylinders. Something to consider.

 

OK, just had a great long talk with Jayman about the Taco. Thank you so much for spending so much time explaining everything so thoroughly to me!! And thank you to noahpete for doing such an awesome job documenting your findings on the thread the past 10 days! I can't believe you figured this out so quickly, after so many skilled, experienced mechanics combed over the truck for so long!! You should feel extremely proud!! Right before we met you guys, we really were starting to accept that no one would ever be able to figure this out, and that was quite a depressing feeling. Then I called Jayman, and suddenly everything changed

Eric and I have some talking to do tonight about how we want to proceed. Lots of variables to the whole thing, will hopefully have a decision by tomorrow.

But in the meantime, cannot thank noahpete and jayman enough, they seriously rock!!! You guys are the best!! No one has ever done anything this generous for us, we are beyond grateful!!

And thank you to all of our awesome TW buddies for sticking with us through this crazy long journey!!

PS: jayman, PB it is!!

noahpete, still waiting for your cookie order Also, can you be our new mechanic forever? Can you never move anywhere else please? Thank you!

 

Great news, BUT in the spirit of ensuring this is indeed the case, why are you not performing the simple test I have suggested several times? After the truck is warm turn if off and bleed the fuel pressure, this will keep the cylinders dry. Then try to start it.

My two cents.

 

During this whole time were you not getting black smoke on start up ??

Was all this gas ending up in the oil??

 

We never noticed black smoke. Plenty of white in the mornings when cold but never noticed black. I'd say maybe we just missed it, but it would be strange if every single person that's looked over it missed it too, so I'm thinking we just weren't getting black smoke? Not sure Wyoming. What are you thinking?

 

I'm still uneasy with the higher than normal fuel pressure. No question about the excessive drip (and good job with the scope) but wondering if that's the reason they leak on the truck but tested (or replaced) OK on a machine several times. I don't know the pressure used on the test bench.
Another fleeting last minute thought. Could a hard (steel tube) section of the fuel return line gotten crushed during the engine swap, restricted just enough to raise the pressure a bit and cause the injector drip? Questions questions.

Is replacing the injectors going to be a guarantied fix, a money back guarantee?

 

OK, a few questions, to feel more certain that replacing the injectors will definitely be the fix, because if we are sure they will fix it, then we want to replace them with new injectors, probably the Toyota ones. It would make me very uneasy to drive it knowing the injectors are leaking.

@noahpete, in the videos you posted of the injectors, you were simulating what happens right after the engine is shut off, right? And clearly fuel is dripping from the injectors on the videos. So then are we assuming that eventually the injectors stop leaking, right? I’m guessing they stop when they cool off? Or does the fuel pressure drop off over time, and the leaking tapers off in conjunction with it dropping? And then are we assuming the fuel that did already leak evaporates overnight, which allows the truck to start normally the next morning? And would the injectors leaking explain the 0 fuel pressure in the mornings?

It's just so strange that they are passing the tests over and over yet leaking enough to cause a starting problem. And also really strange that they keep having issues after being serviced/replaced over and over. And strange that the injector issues started when the engine was replaced, and have just continued over and over since. I want to just celebrate and stop asking questions, but I’m confused about those things.

Could it be something else is causing the injectors to keep failing over and over, other than the injectors themselves being faulty? I’m just scared of the possibility of getting the new expensive set, then having something cause the new set to do the same thing (leak), because of too much pressure going to them for some reason.

It just doesn’t add up why they keep passing the tests then leaking in the truck. Do we need a different style injectors to keep up with our fuel pressure putting out PSI in excess of spec? Is it even possible to do that? Could something be causing abnormally high fuel pressure, which in turn is causing the injectors to leak? I wonder what the PSI is when they are in the cleaning/testing machines, compared to the PSI being 57 when they are in the truck.

Do you think there's any possibility replacing the injectors might not fix it? Is there any chance the fuel pressure regulator or a damaged fuel line is causing the injectors to leak somehow?

 

Ok here's my solution, I'm just as nervous as you to spend 1200.00 on new injectors. I am going to take the injectors out or my 4runner (same early style silver injectors) and put them in your truck. This should confirm that the injectors are the problem just to be sure. This is going to be a crapload of work and I will need a couple days to do it but I going to do it and once it is done we can tell for sure that's the injectors are or are not the problem

 

*im

 

perhaps they weren't using full pressure when testing the injectors? no sure the process they use but I doubt they hook it to a fuel pump to test them, most likely just use air pressure and that could be less pressure then found during operation.

one thing is for sure, if they leak they need to be replaced and or the fuel pressure on the system is too high and I think tests showed the pressures to be good

with the donated parts you have so far, perhaps there is someone who can donate replacement injectors so this can be confirmed, then the parts can be purchased or returned depending on the results

 

Wow, can't believe you are offering to do this, we appreciate this so much @noahpete! We have spent so much replacing so many parts based on strong suspicions the past 4 months, and it's so kind of you to be willing to go the extra mile and then some to be sure we don't make that mistake this time. You rock man!!!

what's the cookie choice???????

 

If your going to do it do it right right? I'm just as anxious to see if this solves it as much as you or Jason. I would like to prove what I think is the problem w/o gambling, we will see

 

@noahpete

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5e6ftNpGsU

 

I'm not sold on injectors being the issue. Doing the swap with give me great piece of mind. If swap does prove an injector issue, I will be more than happy to let you try mine. If mine work, give me yours and I will be more than happy to use yours as "storage" injectors. Even trade. I'm standing by with great interest.

I will admit you guys have done a huge amount of work and I don't want to labeled as a scheptic. I hope I'm wrong.

KO

 

Would not a phone call to whomever flow tested the injectors be able to find out what pressure was used??

Then not sure just what blend of gas you get out there With the ethanol we have here it is real easy to get rust from any of the steel lines upstream of the fuel filter when things sit for any amount of time.

Does not take very much to cause a injector to leak .

 

Good point Wyoming, about asking the last person that did the injectors what the pressure was. I've talked to him about what's going on and he offered to retest the injectors at no charge (might do just for curiosity's sake later, although clearly they are leaking and that needs to be dealt with now regardless), but I didn't think to ask him if he knows what pressure they are under when being tested. I know they use a heat gun on them.

The truck only sat for 2 weeks, between the engine failure and when it was towed for it's replacement engine way back in early Dec. at the start of the thread. Although it may have sat for another ~week once it arrived there. That royally sucked, we were trying to hurry to make a decision about the engine for the exact reason you mentioned - didn't want anything bad happening from it sitting too long. Yet deciding about replacing your engine is NOT something you can feel good about rushing through.

Ya think we could have a corroded line upstream from the fuel filter? How do you check for that, do you just replace the line if suspicious or what?

I've been a big believer since this all started that the changes in recent years regarding ethanol content in the fuel plays some kind of a part in our story.

 

but didn't the video show them leaking? I never watched them, but weather they are the cause of the hard start is debated however "as I understand it" its a confirmed issue that needs to be fixed so the way I see it, it is something that has to be done first, otherwise all other tests become corrupted based on leaking injectors don't they?

 

Thanks buddy! But we plan to swing for the brand new set of 6 shiny fresh Toyota injectors IF they are definitely the thing that removes the evil excessive cranking demon from the Taco.

Of course we are not putting any pressure whatsoever on noahpete to make that call correctly for us.

But lucky for us he is one determined dude

By the way, how's the fishing? Catch anything yet (besides J & B)???