Space and Science BS Thread

I think they're 2 SpaceX launches tomorrow, 1 from the Cape and 1 from Vandenberg, Vandenberg is RTLS

 

https://twitter.com/emrekelly/status/1488216681109413891?s=21

 

Confirmed:
https://nextspaceflight.com/launches/agency/upcoming/1/?search=

 

Some more from last night’s launch:
https://twitter.com/launchphoto/status/1488351663798771716?s=21

https://twitter.com/launchphoto/status/1488504404324102144?s=21

https://twitter.com/austindesisto/status/1488509977836851208?s=21

Another view of the stage separation and boost back burn:
https://twitter.com/superclusterhq/status/1488502778498535427?s=21

https://twitter.com/nickyxphoto/status/1488560469732433925?s=21

https://twitter.com/launchphoto/status/1488504165676597254?s=21

 

https://twitter.com/nasaspaceflight/status/1488511889000873990?s=21
https://twitter.com/nasa_nerd/status/1488497869275418624?s=21

Some great pics of the crew…

Then the momentary horror they must’ve all felt:
https://twitter.com/nasaspaceflight/status/1488511884240343044?s=21

 

Yeah, we're big SpaceX fanbois science needs in here. Except for @Sterdog, but I think that's just cuz he's curmudgeonly.

 

I've been told the tiles on the leading edge of the wing where Columbia took the strike were never tested for a strike. They dissipate heat fantastically and weigh next to nothing, but apparently can't withstand space debris.

I was still pretty young when it burnt up but guys I work now with were at the Shuttle Landing Facility waiting on the shuttle as my shop was the first group of people to greet the astronauts and supply Bair to them. When the shuttle missed their time window knowing how much fuel they had to spare it was an emotional moment.

I've also been told and I don't know if this is widely known now but post strike the Air Force told Nasa we have satellites capable of taking pictures and Nasa said no thanks we're fine.

 

What could have been done? Could tiles be replaced in space? How could they get them up there in time? Seems like they were effed at launch.

 

If they had taken the pictures that would've/could've shown the risk of a catastrophic anomaly, seems like they couldve landed at Vandenberg or another very long strip. Obviously there is a ton of ground support necessary to meet that vehicle and logistically getting that in place in a few days is near impossible but all those options seem better than having it ignite and disintegrate over hundreds of miles.

I very well could be completely wrong and KSC was the only landing option but its documented the pilot of shuttle was emailed in space and he knew about the strike the day before re-entry.

 

"Into the Black" by Rowland White & Richard Truly covers as much that is known/unclassified about DoD assets taking sat-squared (satellite to satellite) images of Columbia during STS-1 after Truly observed tile loss on the leading edge of the OMS pods. At the end of the book it is mentioned that the DoD offered their assets for STS-107 but NASA passed. NASA (like many individuals) fell into the trap of "its happened many times before with no major ramifications so we're not going to start worrying now".

But like @bagleboy said, what could be done after the fact? Even IF the severity was known within the first few orbits and the orbiter went into survival mode, it'd still only have had ~3wks of consumables. Do you risk the same thing launching another? Then again, launching another wasn't feasible considering the turn around time of an orbiter. The only time two shuttles were imminently ready for launch & moved to launch pads was STS-125 (last Hubble servicing mission).

 

Landing sites made no difference. The orbiter broke up because plasma got into the wing, broke it off resulting in asymmetric lift that caused orbiter tumble at hyper sonic speeds

 

I’ve read they knew about the strike at launch and that they declined further investigation by satellite due to the reason @bagleboy notes.

It’s always pissed me off that the official line is that nothing could be done. We had a fleet of 4 at the time and couldn’t keep 1 on standby? We couldn’t have accessed our Russian partners to see what they might have offered?

Even now, what are we, the Russians and Chinese doing for emergency response?

 

Starship seems the best hope for rapid response. It’s still a dangerous business with fatal consequences at every turn. “Risk is our business” was no overstatement.

 

3 weeks. I wonder if that would have been enough time for them to do a spacewalk, remove a tile from a less critical area, shave it down, and glue it in place. We'll never know.

 

I'd have to do a little more looking into it but I don't think they had EVA suits on 107 since the cargo bay had the spacehab module and I believe it didn't have an airlock (aside from the one connected to the crew quarters of the orbiter).

*edit: even with EVA suits, I'd be highly skeptical of a MacGyver approach working since it was a leading edge of one the highest temp/stress areas. If your life depends on it, you're damn sure going to try. But realistically, I don't think they had the CANADARM on this launch so even if they had suits, how would you translate down to a wing with nothing to stabilize yourself?

 

Did they even have the glue? Or a means of removing a less critical tile intact if there even was such a thing? The shuttle was a leap forward in launch rates but mainly because we got away with unsolved issues rather than solving them. This more than anything is why I like the build it, fly it, break it, and learn rather than assuming you’ve covered all the blank areas with calculations.

 

How much of the station was completed. Was it habitable? No way to dock? Sounding more like there were options, it just wasnt seen as a big deal, until it was.

 

I mean they made a square filter fit a round hole once, im assuming they at least had duct tape, maybe a bit of chewing gum, though you'll have to prechew that. Heat up the space jello until it's brown and then mix with the space toothpaste? I'm just an armchair engineer throwin out ideas for a problem long since past.

 

Apache gun tape of the accident.