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Speaker and sound system upgrade - 2014 ext cab Taco

Discussion in 'Audio & Video' started by Rebele93, Jul 8, 2014.

  1. Nov 7, 2014 at 1:43 PM
    #21
    teamcurtis

    teamcurtis Well-Known Member

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    most amps have a HU in....
    just not the cleanest sound

    I know you really want it to look stock.
    Ill just say this.
    I had a touch screen GPS kenwood headunit in my 06 tundra. Everyone thought it was stock.
     
  2. Nov 7, 2014 at 4:53 PM
    #22
    shaneckc

    shaneckc Fyntünd Designs Vendor

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    Well aside from my 'opinion,' physics says that the Type X is capable of being louder.

    Type R: 18.1mm Xmax, 332cm^2 Sd, 83db
    Type X: 19mm Xmax, 360cm^2 Sd, 82db

    I don't know what kind of tests you're running but I'd deem them to be inconclusive if you're not coming up with the Type X being louder than the Type R. Yes, the Type R is slightly more efficient, which makes an A and B comparison a little more complicated; you'd need a different amplifier or at least to adjust your gain structure, and I'm just going to assume you've tested them in separate boxes that suit each woofers specs.
     
  3. Nov 7, 2014 at 5:38 PM
    #23
    manethon

    manethon TTAS

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    oh here we go.
    Motor topology and Ts parameters are far more important than xmax and the slight difference in cone area.

    im not going to debate this,
    And the so called tests( Burps at specific freq's )- if you know anything about db drag street A and B, or any of the other classes you know that people fight for even .1. The type R was louder in every single application we had But with the way that your last response was you know it all. My statements are purely and 100% based on real world numbers and facts.

    Thanks for your input,
    If you want to argue this further please pm me so we don't flood this post with this.

    But back to the OP
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2014
  4. Nov 7, 2014 at 7:20 PM
    #24
    shaneckc

    shaneckc Fyntünd Designs Vendor

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    All good. Not going to try and argue with someone who tries to deny basic physics. Xmax and Sd are Ts parameters, by the way, and so is Vd.

    Vd = Peak displacement volume. Calculated by Vd = Sd·Xmax

    And if you were that concerned about flooding this post with our own tangent, you could have just PM'ed me to begin with. I'd rather not let someone tell me that I'm wrong and have the last word just because they say so.
     
  5. Nov 7, 2014 at 8:39 PM
    #25
    manethon

    manethon TTAS

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    I meant to say "Other" Ts Parameters for clarification.
     
  6. Nov 8, 2014 at 6:54 AM
    #26
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    ha... I don't understand any of that. I'm just a hack... I'll admit it. I doubt seriously I'll be cranking the bass up to ear-bleed levels. I'm sure I would have been satisfied with either speaker. I'm pretty sure the boys at Alpine know what the F they are doing. ;-)

    Hopefully my 4 channel amp gets here today so that I can start installing things. I'll probably start with the Big-3 upgrade under the hood while I'm waiting for my Amazon shipment today. I'll still have to wait for Radio Shack to open at 10:00. I ordered the wrong size cable ends. Always something.
     
  7. Nov 8, 2014 at 7:04 AM
    #27
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    Thanks... As soon as my budget allows, I may consider a HU upgrade. My wife wants new carpet upstairs(she is very tolerant of my expenditures including the Tacoma purchase, so I like to keep her happy).
    Next in line for truck upgrades will be suspension upgrade and new tires and wheels, so I have to save my pennies.

    I'll be researching posts dealing Head Units which can handle both steering wheel integration, as well as reverse video integration, bluetooth, etc. I have no doubt that I'll find something here, but I'll hold off on my research until I actually have money to spend again. Maybe there will be new models to check out by the time I'm ready to pull the trigger on a HU upgrade.
     
  8. Nov 9, 2014 at 7:32 PM
    #28
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    Project update:

    Saturday I waited for most of the day for Fed Ex, only to find out that they delivered my packages to my neighbor. He brought them by around 4:00, but I was already finished working for the day and was busy watching Tx A&M beat Auburn (Gig Em' Ags!)

    I did however, get my amp wiring run to the battery, and mounted the inline fuse to the side of the engine bay. The hardest part of the install was getting the amp wire through the firewall boot. I ended up poking a hole through the boot with a coathanger and threading it through with my amp wire taped to it. I ran the wires alone with the remote turn on wire under the driver side kickplates in the door frame, and then removed both front seats.

    I loosened up the center console, but did not remove it all of the way. I installed the bass volume knob on the center console near my right knee.

    Today, I started installing my bass amp, capacitor, ground wires, RCA cables, etc. I eventually go both amps attached. I ran the speaker wire from the 4ch amp along the opposite side of the truck and got everything tucked away nice and tidy.

    I decided that since I was running out of daylight, I'd wait to dismantle the dash and hook up the RCA cable(plus adapter) and the speaker wires.

    I came across a couple of issues which would need to be addressed. 1) I ran out of ground wire. Neither Home Depot nor Radio Shack had any decent ground wire that would somewhat match what I was already using. (I solved this by running a shorter ground for the amp on the passenger side, instead of all the way back over to the drivers side and into the ground block.

    The other major issue I I had was that when I went to install the driver-side seat, the mounting clip for my capacitor will not let the seat move forward or backwards. Once I have light again. I'll mess with the capacitor mounting location so that I can get my seat adjustment working again. I seriously considered fixing the bracket with a hammer, but I decided to wait and fix it when I was a bit less angry. I know I should have tested this before screwing everything in, but it's very hard to lift and adjust a truck seat with three broken ribs.

    Hopefully tomorrow after work I can get the seat issue resolved and then do the rest of the Head Unit wiring. Once I have sound to the speakers again, I'll make my amp gain and filter adjustments for the front speakers and then get the passenger seat put back in. Getting close

    Only a few hours of work remain, but I'm really getting anxious to hear my new system and have her back on the road again.

    Install pics will be added after I finish.
     
  9. Nov 10, 2014 at 5:58 AM
    #29
    manethon

    manethon TTAS

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    Ditch the cap, Its not needed.
    Not only will it solve ur cable problem but it will also solve the bracket issue.
    Make sure all your grounding points and big3 is done if your pulling any significant amount of power from your battery.
     
  10. Nov 10, 2014 at 8:51 AM
    #30
    teamcurtis

    teamcurtis Well-Known Member

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    When installing the amp, I would run two pairs of RCA leads behind the headunit anyway. Just leaving them disconnected.

    That way when you decide to put in a new headunit later, you can just plug them in, disconnect the high line at the amp and call it a day.
    You wont have to go back and pull all the trim on the call to run new leads.

    I agree that for a 4 channel amp on a modern car you don't need a cap.
     
    bdahms likes this.
  11. Nov 10, 2014 at 12:46 PM
    #31
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    OK... snow has started falling in Boulder. I went home at lunch (before the snow started) and removed the capacitor and ran a new amp power from the power dist block straight to the sub amp. I reattached the drivers side seat and it mow has the room it needs to move again. Looks like I had already broken one of the capacitor clips while trying to get the seat to move.

    So I have not done the Big-3 yet under the hood. I still need to find the proper size wire and connectors before I can start that, but I can't imaging it will take me more than an hour to complete once I have the right stuff. I was also waiting to see if I'd even need to do the big-3 upgrade until I had power running through the system. Now without the Capacitor in the mix I'm really hoping that I do not have power issues. If no dimming headlights are noticed during bass hits, I'm OK right? Would I need to do the big-3, or is it good to do just to be safe?

    I also got the radio out of the center console enough to access the wiring harness.

    My lunch break was over so I had to head back to the jobby-job. stay tuned.
     
  12. Nov 10, 2014 at 12:50 PM
    #32
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    Good idea, but I've already put all of my trim back together. My RCA cable between the amps is really long and it can be used later and routed through the center console without a lot of trouble.
     
  13. Nov 10, 2014 at 1:47 PM
    #33
    woodygg

    woodygg Well-Known Member

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    that's the significant 'weak link' here... just hard to get past it. such a bummer they don't add low level out to the stock head units.
     
  14. Nov 11, 2014 at 5:55 PM
    #34
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    Today the weather has stayed cold and nasty. Winter is here I guess. It's now 10 degrees outside and snowing. Unfortunately, I don't have a garage, and with the battery disconnected, I can't exactly crank on the trucks heater. I'm writing this as I warm up.

    I'm a real idiot sometimes. I screwed myself over by somehow cutting the wrong set of wires. Be sure to use the White 10-pin connector, not the larger white 28 pin connector like I did. Hopefully I got everything connected as it was before I started hacking away at stuff. So mad. 18 wires to reconnect and solder. It cost me about an hour of time or better to fully correct. I'll have to wait and see if I messed anything up. I also dropped my only flux in the snow somewhere and had to run to Home Depot for more. BS...total BS.

    The only stuff I have remaining before I can power it, test it, and tune it is to attach the remote amp turn on wire to a switched 12V source. I've looked for how to do this from a wire on the back of the stock head unit, but a pretty thorough search here makes me think it will be easiest to wire this to my cigarette lighter power. Plenty of people say just update your head unit....I know. eventually I probably will. Not possible right now.

    I also have to run the speaker wire and the RCA cable from the front of the console passenger side up under the glove box and through the dash to the stereo compartment. Connect wires and cross my fingers before turning the key.
     
  15. Nov 11, 2014 at 7:38 PM
    #35
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    OK, I've now completed all of my install steps except for the remote power to the amps. I got the RCA cable and speaker wire run to the head unit and connected. I'll wait to fully assemble the radio and dash until I have powered evrything up. I'll probably go get an add-a-fuse instead of going to my cigarette lighter. The later option sounds like an easy way to mess up the dash.
     
  16. Nov 11, 2014 at 8:26 PM
    #36
    timothom

    timothom Well-Known Member

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    Bummer about cutting the wrong harness. I had it easy with mine and I got the Metra harness. At least you soldered the stuff back together instead of using splices...ugh.

    If I read this correctly, you were trying to cut into that harness to hook up the high-level speaker feeds off your stock deck to a line-out converter, right?

    And your doing all of this stuff outside in Colorado right now? Wow. It's like 8 degrees outside here in Montana right now....
     
  17. Nov 12, 2014 at 7:53 AM
    #37
    manethon

    manethon TTAS

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    i gave up myself on my project till i find warmer day, between -10 to -25c here
     
  18. Nov 12, 2014 at 11:03 AM
    #38
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    Yep. Stock HU to line out converter.

    Fortunately I was able to get the wires spliced correctly (for the most part) After the initial system power up(no sound yet), It looks like all but the trucks voice control buttons work, but that may have been an issue with my phone not having enough power to do bluetooth.

    It was 1 degree when I got up this morning. My lowered Scion xA with semi slick tires just wouldn't cut it in the snow. I needed my truck working again.

    I hooked in my last remaining line to the fuse box with an add-a-fuse. Had to make a second trip to NAPA to get a longer fuse. After plugging in the add-a-fuse the fuse I pulled out wouldn't fit in the slot on the add-a-fuse (15A Accessory Fuse...the second from the left on the top row.) This is supposed to be the accessory fuse.

    The first fuse I jacked into was wrong (door locks) and since I forgot to disconnect the battery lead before connecting this, I heard (even with the key out) an audible speaker noise, then a crackeling sound, then nothing, but the lights on the amp were on. Blue at first and then orange. Looks like the orange is safety mode. I think I blew an Amp fuse. My bass amp is under the seat and I did not check it, but the light on the other amp is lit up orange.

    I'll check fuses when I get home today and I'll periodically check the battery state throughout the day. (I want to make sure it starts tonight after work)

    Once I've determined if there is a blown fuse, I'll try to get sound to the speakers. I'm not 100% sure that I wired everything correctly in regard to the line out converter. With both amps off before I had the remote wire run, the system was still sending HU power to the fron speakers (rears are now disconnected. Now that the Amps are in safety mode, I get no sound to the speakers at all.

    The amp lights should be turning off when I remove my key, right? They are not. I'm afraid I will drain my battery. Is there a better switched fuse I can connect to?
     
  19. Dec 2, 2014 at 11:00 AM
    #39
    Rebele93

    Rebele93 [OP] Newbie 4 Wheeler

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    I had to stop working on this project for a while due to the cold weather and some travel. I have now spent some additional time on getting things installed and fixed, but there are still a few tasks remaining.

    I determined that the original 4 channel amp I bought was a dud and would not power up. I returned it after doing a bench test to confirm that it was not just a wiring issue. I currently have the replacement 4-chanel amp in hand and I'm ready to install it as soon as I can find the time. It should be a snap to install as I already have all of my wires run. I will replace the main power line to the amp because it got pinched/damaged under the seat bolt.

    After a small amount of troubleshooting, I was able to get the bass amp and sub working. I did get the wiring correct for the line-out converter. Yeah! I discovered that the RCA cables were reversed. (RCA out instead of RCA in) As soon as i got that corrected, the sub started thumping.

    I also figured out my 'add-a-fuse' issue. I found a switched circuit that I could use. The one I used was in the fuse-box in the cab... middle row, all the way to the left.
    This one turns off the amp when the key is removed, on when key is on or on ACC.

    Even without the 4 channel amp in place, the system sounds great and the bass is just terrific. (video to come soon) I love being able to easily tweak the bass knob for each and every song without having to go into my HU audio settings. Currently, if I turn the knob up to 5 or 10% I get the perfect amount of bass. Any more than that is overkill until the Image Dynamics in the doors getting the proper amount of power.

    All that is left is to get the front amp installed and adjusted/EQd, and cable wrapping and cleanup.

    I have not gotten around to doing the Big-3 wiring upgrade under the hood. So far it has been unnecessary. Even without the capacitor, I do not see any light dimming or power issues at all.

    Did I mention how good the system sounds?
     
  20. Dec 2, 2014 at 12:38 PM
    #40
    manethon

    manethon TTAS

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    Glad your happy man,
    Thats the ultimate goal:) congrats!
     
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