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Stainless Steel Brake lines vs longer OEM style replacements

Discussion in 'Technical Chat' started by Enders Taco, Feb 21, 2013.

  1. Feb 21, 2013 at 11:13 AM
    #1
    Enders Taco

    Enders Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    I'm buying a set of AP expo springs and have been told I need to do something with the rear brake lines. My first thought was get some nice SS ones. However, I really didn't know alot about them so I started reading up. I did NOT like what I read.

    1) Hard to inspect for wear
    2) need to be REPLACED every 18-24 months
    3) primary issues are cheap(ly fitted) fittings that allow dirt to get between the metal outer and the Teflon tube inner
    4) commonly fail on sport sedan applications.

    So, I got to thinking. Given where the lines are in my truck, I'm pretty sure if I took something bad enough to damage/destroy my OEM lines from between the top of the axle and the undercarriage of the truck, that it would still damage the SS lines too. I like to wheel. I am not a hard core rock crawler, desert runner or baja racer. I am left thinking that the sensible choice would be to get longer OEM style brake lines instead of the SS ones. Am I missing something? :confused:

    (and yes I searched first. All I found were comments on installation and very few on the tech aspect of benefits) :cool:
     
  2. Feb 21, 2013 at 11:28 AM
    #2
    EDJY

    EDJY Well-Known Member

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    I always found improvement in motorcycles and atvs when I switched to SS lines. I don't know if you can find stock extended length lines, but we all know those work very well and hold up with normal use. Might as well go with the proven method. Car brakes are a little more important than my dirt bikes.
     
  3. Feb 21, 2013 at 11:30 AM
    #3
    Justus

    Justus fucks not given

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    Wasn't aware of them needing to be swapped every 2 years.......where did u find the info at?

    Just curious, because nobody ever gave me a heads up when I bought and had em installed 3yrs ago.....or, 4yrs ago.
     
  4. Feb 21, 2013 at 11:34 AM
    #4
    Nirvana

    Nirvana Long time lurker, first time poster.

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    Icon ext. travel 2.5RR in front, Icon ext. travel 2.0RR in rear, BuiltRight uniball UCAs, Wheelers Superbumps, Goodridge steel braided brake lines, BruteForce front plate bumper, 285/70R16 KM2s on stock wheels.
    I don't know if it's ever really a necessary item rather than a nice to have. A lot of people claim better pedal feel/stiffer brakes since the stainless shouldn't expand as much though I don't think a stock brake line that's still serviceable is going to expand that much since they are engineering for the application. I personally didn't notice a huge difference but for $100 with the Goodridge group buy on here I figured why not.

    As far as the replacement on SS I couldn't tell you yes or no but even rubber lines need replacing at a certain point. Maybe flushing the fluid a little more often to keep less moisture in the lines would help but I'm not sure, never seen anything about a replacement interval like that.

    I was also wondering about this.
     
  5. Feb 21, 2013 at 12:39 PM
    #5
    TherealScuba

    TherealScuba Well-Known Member

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    I've never heard of the SS lines needing to be replaced except from a random failure.

    I've had my rear SS line for about 4 years now. Never had an issue.

    As long as you flush your brakes every 30K like recommended you will be fine.

    Out of the thousands of people I know running them I have never heard any downfalls to them. Most are DOT rated (ours are).
     
  6. Feb 23, 2013 at 8:10 AM
    #6
    Enders Taco

    Enders Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    There wasn't a lot of info it there on them except on car forums. Read one huge post from a NSX guy who posted about a failure. Another Honda guy posted that his wife had a failure, with sporadic mentions of failures on scion, Miata, VW, Porsche, and a variety of other forums. Except for the Honda guy it was all failures at the fittings or the connections. The Honda guy was a line rupture.

    The prescribed remedy is periodic replacement at a shorter service interval than the OEM part. I'd rather not have a random failure with my daughter in the truck, or when I need them on a trail.

    Perhaps I'm over thinking this.
     
  7. Feb 23, 2013 at 8:18 AM
    #7
    BrewDawg

    BrewDawg Active Member

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    dude really? your talking like your on the highway with a plug in the sidewall good god bleed that beautifull ss line and roll proud! change those pads on a regular basis ya
     
  8. Feb 27, 2013 at 5:40 AM
    #8
    Enders Taco

    Enders Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    For others wondering, I checked around for anyone that makes OEM style brake lines in different lengths and was unable to find ANYONE. Factory makes them and ships them. So, instead of trial and error, I just ordered the SS ones.
     
  9. Feb 27, 2013 at 7:08 AM
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    Justus

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    ur gunna be fine....enjoy the truck, and enjoy all the mods, no matter how small some may be.
     
  10. Mar 22, 2013 at 8:40 AM
    #10
    DoorDing

    DoorDing Thank you, Nancy Roman

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    I came across this during a search.

    I've seen some confusion about OEM hose construction pop up in several threads (not necessarily this one). OEM "rubber" brake lines (or hoses) may have a rubber jacket over braided steel. Late model Tacoma hoses don't have a braided steel core, but I suspect there's a semi-rigid plastic tube lining them. They aren't just rubber hose, like a vacuum hose. Typically, braided stainless steel lines are rated to a higher burst pressure than OEM hoses, and some SS hoses have an outer, plastic jacket over the SS; the ones I ordered through ToyTec do.

    A line can fail for a number of reasons, but these seem odd to me:
    1) It's hard to inspect any high pressure hose for wear. Other than obvious damage to the exterior, you won't see anything until there's a bulge or leak, and that's pretty much at the time of failure.
    2) I've never seen that service interval mentioned for any brake hose, OEM or aftermarket. When you consider that a quality SS hose is typically rated to a higher pressure than OEM, this makes no sense to me.
    3) Buy hoses with an outer jacket covering the braided SS layer. I've seen that offered by more than one retailer. Still, I've never heard about a hose failing due to that issue. It sounds more like an urban legend to me.
    4) "Commonly fail"? If that was the case, I believe there'd be a lot of lawsuits. If a failure was investigated, I suspect extremely high brake tempertures, water contaminated fluid, and/or physical damage to the hose would be contributing factors. Those are known causes for failures.

    Ben, I hope you installed your extended brake hoses so you won't be using the OEMs for limit straps. Inspect the hoses for damage during pre/post trail inspections, during any other work under the truck, and change your brake fluid every two years. If you do that, you'll be far ahead of a lot of owners.
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2013
  11. Mar 22, 2013 at 11:26 AM
    #11
    BamaToy1997

    BamaToy1997 ASE Master Tech Vendor

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    ^^^^ I agree with this 100%.

    One of the reasons SS lines are honestly better than factory rubber lines is that the SS lines do not expand under pressure. ANY expansion under pressure means that more fluid is needed to maintain the same amount of braking force. This means more pedal. Now granted, we are talking a small amount, but it is there none the less.
     
  12. Mar 22, 2013 at 1:24 PM
    #12
    BradyT88

    BradyT88 Skinkwerks Rockware & Fabrication!!

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    Hmm... When I did my regear I just used vice grips to pinch off the rubber brake lines and that worked just fine. I would think if they were steel braided inside this would have ruined them...
     
  13. Mar 22, 2013 at 3:21 PM
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    BamaToy1997

    BamaToy1997 ASE Master Tech Vendor

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    I always warn against pinching off any brake line when doing repairs. You can cause internal damage to the rubber, and premature failure. Not that it happens every time mind you, but it is a risk.
     
  14. Mar 22, 2013 at 3:24 PM
    #14
    DoorDing

    DoorDing Thank you, Nancy Roman

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    I just crawled under my 2012 with a NIB magnet and you're right, they don't have ferrous steel in them. I checked the hoses on my Fox shocks and they do. I know some brake hoses have a steel core because I've cut bad ones to speed removal, but at least current Tacomas don't. Thanks for making me check.

    I don't know if Toyota recommends using a pinch clamp on their hoses or not, so I don't know if using Vice Grips damaged yours. I prefer to use a plug or cap to keep the drooling to a minimum, without risk of damage.
     
  15. Mar 22, 2013 at 3:27 PM
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    BradyT88

    BradyT88 Skinkwerks Rockware & Fabrication!!

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    Yeah I especially don't recommend using vice grips to do that. We had a guy blow out a wheel cylinder on the trail and used a c-clamp to pinch it off so he still had brakes once. They aren't so jagged at least.

    For me I will likely be going to longer brake lines anyone so longevity isn't a huge issue for me.
     
  16. Jan 22, 2015 at 10:42 AM
    #16
    DSMJRV

    DSMJRV Well-Known Member

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    Srry for this revival, but if you want a longer stock style line for the rear you can just double them up.. since it has one female end and one male it is really simple to do and will give you tons of room for travel.
     
  17. Jan 22, 2015 at 11:07 AM
    #17
    ONEBAR

    ONEBAR Well-Known Member

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    Its actually 2 female ends. Also at that point you might as well buy SS lines. Not sure how much stock lines are but I doubt you will be saving much money. Also extended lines are only 2-4 inches longer so doubling would be an excessive length.
     
  18. Jan 23, 2015 at 9:53 PM
    #18
    DSMJRV

    DSMJRV Well-Known Member

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    oh yeah 2nd gen, you're right..
     
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