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Still think TITNC3: Return of the Iceberg was peak

Discussion in 'Stocks & Investments' started by kairo, Oct 6, 2020.

  1. Jan 26, 2021 at 7:13 PM
    #2281
    ColtsTRD

    ColtsTRD Well-Known Member

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    PLUG did me very well today!!! :cool:
     
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  2. Jan 26, 2021 at 7:15 PM
    #2282
    slodoug

    slodoug Well-Known Member

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    sold out my OPTT for a few grand, no GME day but green is green.
     
  3. Jan 26, 2021 at 8:14 PM
    #2283
    kairo

    kairo [OP] >_>

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    It will, because the burden of responsibility goes to the bank or broker. They are legally obligated to buy the shares on the open market. That's the squeeze. We hold all the shares, and we literally get to name our price and they're forced to purchase the shares. If we all united as one and said, "$5,000 only" they'd have to do it.
     
  4. Jan 26, 2021 at 8:32 PM
    #2284
    TreeFortRichard

    TreeFortRichard Barcelona Red is the best red...

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    That’s also why it went up so dramatically after hours. You have the combination of the inability to rapidly short short shares, combined with people getting letters in their inbox that say cover your ass buy some shares.
     
  5. Jan 26, 2021 at 8:53 PM
    #2285
    malburg114

    malburg114 Well-Known Member

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    So I’m starting to understand options from reading (I think) but want to run it by someone before I try my hand at it. Not sure if I’ll do amc just using it as a hypothetical.


    The way I read that is If buy a call for $9 at $8.25 that’ll expire on Jan 29. As long as the stock reaches $9.19 before Jan 29 I’ll break even correct? And anything over $9.19 is profit? Or am I missing something.

    it says 100 shares so if I buy 1 of those calls, and the stock goes to 9.20, I make a dollar (9.19 break even, 100 shares. Penny profit equals $1.00)? Just to keep it simple.

    and if it doesn’t, what happens lol

    940C7E8E-C327-4ECF-A46B-C785B54E42E4.jpg
     
  6. Jan 26, 2021 at 9:35 PM
    #2286
    Bishop2Queens6

    Bishop2Queens6 Well-Known Member

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    I sold just enough oil ETFs that I had as an inflation hedge to buy 1 share of GME @$210 just to be a part of the fun for tomorrow.
     
  7. Jan 26, 2021 at 9:35 PM
    #2287
    TreeFortRichard

    TreeFortRichard Barcelona Red is the best red...

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    OK so I just saw this post. One thing to be aware of off the bat is that options only trade during regular market hours. So the price you see for an option is based upon the closing price of the stock on the day and has nothing to do with the after hours prices. That $.19 price you see there is based on the closing price of AMC.
    So because AMC Is $8.23 after hours that call price will go up significantly when the market opens tomorrow. Options begin selling about five minutes after market opens to allow the prices to equilibrate.
    Now for your question/statement. Options are always based on 100 shares unless there’s some crazy split unique special case. So here that nine dollar option is a contract to buy one hundred shares of AMC at $9 a share on or before 1/29. And yes the price would be $.19 per-share times 100 shares or $19. So while the market was open today that contract was $19 plus sometimes you’ll pay a small $.65 fee depending upon your broker for each contract, not per share.

    Here’s where the fun of options come in. You see there that this gives you the earning power of 100 shares. If the stock goes above $9.19 everything for you is cake, or tendies. So if you had purchased 10 of these contracts today it would’ve cost you $19 times 10 or $190 tomorrow these contracts will most certainly be worth at least $1.50 at the open of the market times 10 contracts $1500 hell of a return on 190 bucks.
    For seeing a potential spike in the price of AMC based upon peoples interest I bought 20 of the $5 calls for like $139 each 2 days ago. They are of course going to be worth a shit ton tomorrow and continue to increase in value if there is some kind of a squeeze on AMC.
    The important thing to remember is it’s “by to open” when you’re buying a call and “sell to close” when you’re closing the call.
    Also try not to do what I call chasing the call. Do you have a call you’re interested in that say $.50 and you want to bid on it and it goes up to $.60 and then goes up to $.65 sometimes if you just set your 50 Cent buy price and give it an hour or two it will come back down and you’ll get your call. If it keeps going up sometimes I just chalk it up to missing the train and call it a day. This of course does not apply to special cases like GameStop and AMC ;)

    Oh I realize you were asking what happens on 129. Working off your nine dollar price there are three things that can happen. Number one the stock is under nine dollars since you have the right to buy at nine dollars you’re not going to spend more than the stock is worth so your contract is worthless you lose all of your money you get nothing good day sir. Number two the stock is above nine dollars say it’s $9.50 your contract is now worth $.50 you can either sell to close the contract to someone else and someone else will buy that contract off of you for $.50 or You can exercise the option and purchase 100 shares for nine dollars you would then need $900 to buy the shares and then they would instantly be worth $9.50 each netting you an instant profit in value of $50. Most people do not exercise calls they sell them to someone else because usually you can get like $.53 when the stock is at 9.50 because call options have some thing called time value. However if a stock were undergoing a short squeeze and kept going up $10 dollars $15 $20 $25..,You might want to exercise the call to capture more of that rise that might happen after the expiration date
     
  8. Jan 26, 2021 at 9:53 PM
    #2288
    malburg114

    malburg114 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the taking the time to explain. I get that options are only during hours not post. More using it as an example. Probably buy some regular shares tomorrow of amc and start with a more stable stock for my first option haha
     
  9. Jan 26, 2021 at 10:18 PM
    #2289
    kairo

    kairo [OP] >_>

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    I reset my sell limits. I'm going to start winding down at $500 now and cover my cost basis and then hold for $750+

    Estimates of $1000 - $2500 / share starting to look actually possible

    Basically I have a couple limit orders at $500 and then a 20% trailing stop on the rest. I'll ride it till it goes bust and hopefully get out 20% give or take from that.
     
  10. Jan 26, 2021 at 10:33 PM
    #2290
    kairo

    kairo [OP] >_>

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    First off, don't start with weeklies while you're learning (I know you probably weren't planning on it). It's a fantastic way to lose a lot of money really quickly. I'm trying to digest your post and all that you're asking but it's getting late and I'm a bit tired.

    Not sure how you came up with the 1/29 $9c costing $8.25? --oh, that's the share price-- In your picture that call contract (the right but not the obligation to purchase 100 shares) is priced at $.19. $.19 x 100(shares) = $19 per contract cost.

    There's a lot of underlying math you have to worry about on short dated options too. Intrinsic value will Theta decay (there's a whole group of math that goes by the name 'greeks') on these weekly contracts, especially on high volatility calls.

    upload_2021-1-26_22-31-44.jpg

    You're looking at an extremely high volatility -- 554%!!! I wouldn't touch anything on a weekly with that much volatility unless god himself told me it was going to burst upwards (or it was GME)

    I'll try and explain a bit more tomorrow if I have time, but honestly, take a few hours and watch some videos on youtube where they go through the whole process. It's really cool, and you'll learn a lot of stuff you never thought you'd care about!

    @TreeFortRichard beat me to it. I'm not gonna read his post cause I'm going to bed, but trust what he has to say about it.

    GE 3/5 $11.5c would not be a bad one to try your luck on. It's on sale today for $60 a contract
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2021
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  11. Jan 26, 2021 at 10:37 PM
    #2291
    crazysccrmd

    crazysccrmd Well-Known Member

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    I wish I would've kept my AMC shares I bought at $2ish. I just play around for fun and sold them around $3ish but it sure would be been nice to make that extra money they're worth now.
     
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  12. Jan 26, 2021 at 10:47 PM
    #2292
    theesotericone

    theesotericone Well-Known Member

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    And the $320 options are gonna be live in the AM for GME. The amount of crazy going on here is crazy. lol
     
  13. Jan 27, 2021 at 1:24 AM
    #2293
    chetterthecat

    chetterthecat Well-Known Member

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    The squeeze has begun.
     
  14. Jan 27, 2021 at 2:01 AM
    #2294
    theesotericone

    theesotericone Well-Known Member

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    Which one?
     
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  15. Jan 27, 2021 at 2:10 AM
    #2295
    theesotericone

    theesotericone Well-Known Member

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  16. Jan 27, 2021 at 2:25 AM
    #2296
    chetterthecat

    chetterthecat Well-Known Member

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    And BB.
     
  17. Jan 27, 2021 at 3:23 AM
    #2297
    enforcertaco91

    enforcertaco91 Well-Known Member

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  18. Jan 27, 2021 at 4:08 AM
    #2298
    chetterthecat

    chetterthecat Well-Known Member

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    Are we?
     
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  19. Jan 27, 2021 at 4:21 AM
    #2299
    98tacoma27

    98tacoma27 is going full "SANDWICH" Moderator

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    Some stuff. Not a lot, just some.
    https://www.foxbusiness.com/markets...yale-stock-game-gets-jittery-over-market-move

    BOSTON - Short-seller Andrew Left does not usually smoke. But on Monday he had a cigarette to calm his nerves as shares of GameStop Corp, the stock he had shorted, continued to rocket higher.

    Left, who has built a reputation by targeting companies he thinks are overvalued, is as convinced as ever that videogame retailer GameStop is a dying business whose stock price will fall sharply someday. He said on Tuesday he is still short the stock, which means he has bet that the price will fall, and more convinced than ever of his position.

    “If I had never been involved in GameStop and came to this right now, would I still be short this stock? 100 percent,” Left, who runs Citron Research and a hedge fund, told Reuters on Tuesday. “This is an old school, failing mall-based video retailer and investors can’t change the perception of that.”

    GameStop did not immediately respond to a Reuters request for comment.

    Shares of GameStop jumped 22% on Tuesday after surging 144% a day earlier, as individual investors again piled into a number of niche stocks, prompting short sellers to scramble to cover losing bets.

    Ticker Security Last Change Change %
    GME GAMESTOP CORP 147.98 +71.19 +92.71%
    Powered by
    Left shorted the company’s stock - selling borrowed shares in a bet that the price will fall and that the shares can be bought back at a lower level - when it traded around $40 a share and forecast publicly that it would tumble to $20 a share.

    Since Left spoke out publicly about GameStop earlier this month, other investors have turned out en masse to take the other side of short-sellers’ bets, forcing the stock up some 308% this year to trade at $112.45, or up 47% on Tuesday.

    Along the way, Left said he has been threatened - although he declined to specify how - and asked authorities to investigate.

    “Everyone thinks this stock sucks and the only reason people are buying it and own it is that for them it is a game.”

    He added, “I created this game, based on uncovering the truths ... so I can’t get mad at people for taking the other side.”

    The market fury, however, is something that Left, who has been posting his research for two decades and has taken on prominent hedge fund managers like Bill Ackman at companies like Valeant, has not seen before.

    Short selling is something every hedge fund is technically able to do but only a handful of firms - including Citron, Jim Chanos’ Kynikos Associates, Carson Block’s Muddy Waters Research, and Ben Axler’s Spruce Point Capital Management - specialize in.

    Many hedge funds acknowledged over the last months that shorting had hurt their performance and Melvin Capital, a $13 billion hedge fund, on Monday received a financial lifeline from hedge funds Citadel and Point72 Asset Management after having been deeply hurt by short bets that went the other way.

    The pain continues for short investors as some of the market’s most shorted stocks like retailers Bed Bath & Beyond and Dillard’s Inc have marched higher in the last days.

    “I don’t smoke but yesterday I was outside smoking a cigarette,” Left acknowledged with a laugh, explaining his current stress. Last year his two-year-old fund returned 155%, after gaining 43% in 2019.

    This year the Citron fund is off 2.5% since the beginning of January, Left said. “This kind of situation teaches you proper allocation,” he said.
     
  20. Jan 27, 2021 at 4:29 AM
    #2300
    TreeFortRichard

    TreeFortRichard Barcelona Red is the best red...

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    StoCK Pr0N!
    Today shall be EPIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
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