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Surging/Thrusting Problem Under Acceleration

Discussion in '1st Gen. Tacomas (1995-2004)' started by jberry813, Jan 2, 2013.

Page 6 of 14
  1. Jan 4, 2013 at 6:41 AM
    #101
    NwiTACO

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    NwiTACO Big tars, little/no bed.

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    Sounds the the fuel pressure regulator isnt opening soon enough and thats why you're seeing the higher pressures.
     
    NwiTACO, Jan 4, 2013
    #101
  2. Jan 4, 2013 at 8:34 AM
    #102
    disc0monkey

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    disc0monkey All right. I believe ya. But my Tommy Gun don't!

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    As long as its stable the trims should get it back to stoich, to a certain point. If its too far out, it will throw a code.

    The fluctuation is what the ECM can't handle
     
    disc0monkey, Jan 4, 2013
    #102
  3. Jan 4, 2013 at 8:35 AM
    #103
    jberry813

    #103
    jberry813 [OP] Professional Fluffer Moderator

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    ...too much shit to list.
    Why don't you come up here Vin and lemme borrow some parts off your truck :D

    I have absolutely no way of checking that. If ECM voltage wasn't steady though, you'd think I'd have a hell of a lot more wrong than I do. And I don't understand why fuel pump (and ecm voltage for that matter) would only be a problem during a very specific driving situation (uphill, 2nd to 4th gear, between 2-3k rpm, mid-3/4 throttle).

    Excellent point and something i forgot to mention. In the previous post, I did the fuel pressure test drive in the cab WITH the vacuum line to the pressure regulator completely disconnected.

    So does this rule out vacuum leak?

    Current fuel pump has only 20k miles and less than 2 years old. Seems unlikely, but certainly not impossible that it's out. I still have my old fuel pump which was working perfectly fine before I put in the 190 lph, but I've got 1/4 tank of gas in the truck and no way I'm dropping that bastard till it's almost empty.
    I'm going to call around today and see who can do a fuel injector clean and test on all 6 I have in the engine and the 4 on the shelf and pick the best 6. FPR would be really easy to swap with no intake or fuel injectors on :cookiemonster:
    Lastly, I lost my compression tester during the move. It's always little stupid shit that end up lost after a move. I have no idea what happened to it but I'm pretty sure I can do a rental on one from Oreilly like I did the fuel pressure test kit. Would that be a worthwhile test as well?

    I'm fairly confident the 5vz motor is not VVT.

    At this point I'm inclined to agree.
     
    jberry813, Jan 4, 2013
    #103
  4. Jan 4, 2013 at 10:17 AM
    #104
    StAndrew

    #104
    StAndrew Wait for it...

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    If it was a bad pump, you should have the problem sporactically, not at a specific gear/rpm... Sounds like the ECU. Do you still have the URD calibration unit still installed?
    Silly 2nd gen's :D
     
    StAndrew, Jan 4, 2013
    #104
  5. Jan 4, 2013 at 10:26 AM
    #105
    jberry813

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    jberry813 [OP] Professional Fluffer Moderator

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    ...too much shit to list.

    No. URD, 7th, and supercharger are all removed.
     
    jberry813, Jan 4, 2013
    #105
  6. Jan 4, 2013 at 12:17 PM
    #106
    12TRDTacoma

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    It could very well be a ecm issue. That surging is going to be fuel related or have a vacuum leak somewhere. I'm glad you are narrowing it down! See it always helps when you take a step back and start checking the basics again huh! :D
     
    12TRDTacoma, Jan 4, 2013
    #106
  7. Jan 4, 2013 at 1:10 PM
    #107
    jberry813

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    jberry813 [OP] Professional Fluffer Moderator

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    ...too much shit to list.
    Well I pretty much started with the basics from the get go.
    The only "basic" as you refer to it I didn't really cover is fuel pressure. Given that the fuel filter is brand new and the pump relatively new and since I didn't have a fuel pressure test kit at the time, I see no extraordinary logic in looking at the FSM and inspecting the entire ignition system per the instructions.
    I'm not an idiot, I know it basically takes three things to make an engine run, air, spark, and fuel. And given the sypmtoms...any of them could cause the problem.
     
    jberry813, Jan 4, 2013
    #107
  8. Jan 4, 2013 at 1:12 PM
    #108
    BamaToy1997

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    BamaToy1997 Wheel Bearing Master

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    It wouldn't be a bad idea to run both a static and running compression test. You can use that to potentially rule out valve issues.

    As for the fuel pump, unfortunately with a HIGHER than normal fuel pressure, it makes it more of a challenge to see if that is truly the problem. It is the fluctuation that has me concerned the most. Since you ran a test with the vacuum disconnected from the FPR, and that made no change, then you most likely do not have an engine vacuum issue causing the fluctuation (I am assuming the fluctuation was still there with the vacuum disconnected from the FPR)

    From there the direction is heading towards either too high fuel pressure, or faulty injectors. I will say that even though you HAVE tested the major sensors, without actually being able to scope the reading, we may be missing something there that you can't test.
     
    BamaToy1997, Jan 4, 2013
    #108
  9. Jan 4, 2013 at 1:30 PM
    #109
    jberry813

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    Correct, in-cab-driving test with the fuel pressure gauge was done with the vacuum line disconnected from the FPR. Gauge showed extremely fast fluttering/fluctuation only while feeling the surge.
     
    jberry813, Jan 4, 2013
    #109
  10. Jan 4, 2013 at 2:06 PM
    #110
    dirty dangler

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    dirty dangler GFO DMC LBR

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    im sorry your getting some "special" replies old timer...but you did ask this question on tw where 99.9999% of people are just that...."special". Have you tried yota tech yet?
     
    dirty dangler, Jan 4, 2013
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  11. Jan 4, 2013 at 2:57 PM
    #111
    brian

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    brian Another Traitor

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    I'm coming in a little late on this one, but can you reproduce any symptom of this problem at idle?
     
    brian, Jan 4, 2013
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  12. Jan 4, 2013 at 3:10 PM
    #112
    jberry813

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    jberry813 [OP] Professional Fluffer Moderator

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    ...too much shit to list.
    ;)
    I haven't posted on yota tech yet.
    I've been inundated with work this week after being on hiatus for 4 weeks. I've been trying to spend at least SOME time with the mini-me's while they are on break too. Basically the time I spend on the truck is after 9:00pm when it's 20 fucking degrees in my garage.
    But I'm working through it. Just went through and checked all the air pressure in the tires and replaced a burnt out license plate bulb. Still got the same surging problem :pout::D :p

    Nope. Only under load.
     
    jberry813, Jan 4, 2013
    #112
  13. Jan 4, 2013 at 3:58 PM
    #113
    12TRDTacoma

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    Agreed. However, when you are checking all basics fuel is a major player in the game and why that wasn't one of the main things you checked is beyond me. Filter okay well there ois really no possible way that thing could be defective, but the pump is a major player that can and has been defective brand new out of the box. Putting new filters, cleaning some pieces and slapping on some plugs is hardly what I would call checking basics. I am not trying to be a smart ass or offend you, but even you have said yourself that you are not a mechanic. So you have been doing pretty good so far but there were some shortcomings in your approach. What I meant by taking a step back for a second was like taking a quick break and trying to tackle the process a little differently. Anyways, back to the regular scheduled program. I just wanted to get that out of the way.
     
    12TRDTacoma, Jan 4, 2013
    #113
  14. Jan 4, 2013 at 4:44 PM
    #114
    jberry813

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    jberry813 [OP] Professional Fluffer Moderator

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    ...too much shit to list.
    And what you seem to be consistently missing is....I DON'T HAVE A FUEL PRESSURE TEST KIT and I live in the fucking sticks. I called 8 places during normal business hours and finally found one in stock and for a rental in the next state over and burned my lunch hour to pick it up. And since auto parts stores aren't open at midnight when I'm normally out working on my truck, why not pull out a voltmeter and test what i can test, clean the shit I can clean, and replace the consumables that I have? Fuck I stock more parts in my truck cabinet specific to my truck than most auto parts stores do.

    [​IMG]

    While you may not agree with my approach, what you are missing in my approach is I'm actually making do with what I have in the time I have and not spend money. Would it be faster if I did this for a living, and worked in a shop with a lift that has every toyota scanner possible...of course. But I don't. If you look at my OP, fuel was never off my list.

    And for what it's worth, any time someone says something to the effect of "I am not trying to be a smart ass" or "I'm not trying to offend you" and my personal favorite, prefaces any sentence with "With all do respect", they are really saying "fuck you, you're doing it wrong"...I just wanted to get that out of the way
     
    jberry813, Jan 4, 2013
    #114
    DanoDavis likes this.
  15. Jan 4, 2013 at 7:09 PM
    #115
    jberry813

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    jberry813 [OP] Professional Fluffer Moderator

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    :laughing: Someone got the reference!

    Nothing was done under the hood with when I rebuild the rear end except pulling the ABS fuse and disconnecting the battery while I was welding. I have since plugged that back in the 30 amp fuse, and obviously the battery.

    As for the Tundra, I never work on that thing. I just put gas in it and change the fluids once in a while. The nice part about buying a vehicle brand new and doing all the work yourself is you know EXACTLY what's been done to it. No rats nest of wires, no chasing other people's gremlins, just easy peasy.
     
    jberry813, Jan 4, 2013
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  16. Jan 4, 2013 at 8:21 PM
    #116
    theduck911

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    theduck911 Max's Canadian Twin

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    This would be place to start.

    Surging might be the most annoying problem to solve. Just spent a week chasing the problem on a friends diesel ended up being fuel pressure regulator so I'm biased in thinking this to be the problem.

    Beginning research now. :cool:
     
    theduck911, Jan 4, 2013
    #116
  17. Jan 4, 2013 at 8:31 PM
    #117
    Shaggs

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    Shaggs Well-Known Member

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    It IS winter fuel mix right now that runs like shit, since it's lower quality fuel. But I will be travelling to Rocklin tomorrow to pick up my AK. If you are heading down the mountain at all I can let you borrow my Scangauge2 if you mail it back to me with tracking/insurance. You can monitor just about anything on it, and it will tell you much faster whit stuff is wonky. I fix high end luxury vehicles for a living, but will be travelling 2.5hours to pick up my toy tomorrow morning. That SGII thing has saved me on plenty of cars without using a factory IDS machine. Let me know, I'm leaving early because its a long drive
     
    Shaggs, Jan 4, 2013
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  18. Jan 4, 2013 at 10:13 PM
    #118
    BamaToy1997

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    BamaToy1997 Wheel Bearing Master

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    He is still getting some good responses and information from some people on here. Not everyone on TW are dumb about these trucks. lol.

    Just a thought. You mentioned that this surge occurs around the 2500-3000 rpm range I believe. Have you tried to power brake the truck into that range and see if the surge is there? Obviously you only want to power brake for short time periods. I am curious if it only does it while moving under load, or under ANY load at that RPM range.
     
    BamaToy1997, Jan 4, 2013
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  19. Jan 4, 2013 at 11:39 PM
    #119
    jberry813

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    jberry813 [OP] Professional Fluffer Moderator

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    ...too much shit to list.
    In the snow shots you saw I was in 4 low. I rarely notice the problem in 1st gear, and definitely not 4low. I noticed the problem probably a couple months ago, before the snow really even started.

    Thanks for the offer man, I really appreciate it. I have to get up before the butt crack of dawn tomorrow to help some retards in India that can't install software. I think I'm actually just going to order one given the feedback I've read about them so far.

    Good idea. I'll try that tomorrow sometime. So far it's only been discernible 2-3k rpm and uphill.
     
    jberry813, Jan 4, 2013
    #119
  20. Jan 5, 2013 at 12:13 AM
    #120
    jberry813

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    jberry813 [OP] Professional Fluffer Moderator

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    God damn I love you old man!!!!!!! <3

    http://www.yotatech.com/f2/2002-4r-v6-surging-acceleration-243180/

    I disconnected the plug on the AFM as the above thread suggested and truck runs like a top again. I'll order a new one from Camelback Toyota tomorrow.
     
    jberry813, Jan 5, 2013
    #120
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