Tesla back under it again....

In theory, the subsidies are supposed to give some space for us to develop these new technologies, learn and make some mistakes before it has to go compete in the market.

There's a limit to how far into the future private business can look. Shareholders aren't concerned about profit in 10 years, they want profit next quarter. They're not going to voluntarily look at renewables as long as fossil fuels are still relatively cheap.

That's where government is supposed to come in. Looking farther down the road, using science to see where we're headed and make the necessary changes to steer us in the correct direction while we still have the time to learn and figure it out

There are plenty of industries that are not developing new strategies or even trying to become more efficient and they get subsidies all the time

I have no problem subsidizing solar and renewables if it can help get us off our dependence on oil. It's cheaper than using expensive bombs to put holes in the desert.

The era of cheap and easy access to oil ended in 1973 with peak oil. Ever since then we've had to drill in farther and farther away places and deal with crazier and crazier "governments" that control those areas.

Energy security is national security as they say..

 

The other thing “we” have to come to terms with is that there is 8 billion people on the planet, not 4 billion like when I was a kid.

 

.... sorry, was away for a bit doing some stuff in the snow we're FINALLY getting after a lackluster Dec.

I'll be back later, I have an emergency egg burrito construction situation to take care of for a while

 

Solar plants last 20 years, Battery creation is very pollutive and replacement cycles are roughly 10-15 years. Fossil fuel plants last 60+ years. The fight is really about what locale actually sees the emissions (California especially is an expert on out of sight out of mind)

We could always mass terraform to create some sci-fi levels of pumped storage, especially in America. How do the environmentalists "view" that?

 

The unusable buffer is there by design to prevent damaging the battery by fully draining it. In a potentially dangerous situation Tesla modified the software to allow using that buffer and give a bit more range. Nothing to see here but a company going out of its way to help people out.

 

Assuming he meant "panels"? They loose quite a bit % of efficiency after certain time frames. I think 20 yrs was the expected I heard at some point to put them down to where they would not be useful to run. Probably some range +/- that dependent on desert, ice, sandy wind, build quality, etc. They must then be replaced, the new must be manufactured (new energy manufacturing cost), the old are removed. When removed, the old are discarded (worse case) or an attempt at recycling some amount of materials. I assume not all can be recycled.

The out of sight / mind mentioned above really comes into play with anything electronic today. Most Americans are unaware of where stuff comes from, except for "Aisle 7"

 

its clear you don't like EV's. I get it.

but what speaks volumes is that despite your lack of interest in one, you still have an interest. a negative one. why even bother a minute's thought to what someone else does, or buys, or likes. weird.

 

Actual questions here -
Did they give this boost to everyone in the US? I keep seeing the phrase "some customers" when they did this. They would have to do this to everyone that bought their car, as they wouldn't know who was possibly travelling around in the limited path of the potential crisis. Or this would admit that they are tracking the whereabouts of every car they sell at every moment, in order to only boost those in the path that they decided.

If I owned a Tesla, could I call them and state I have an emergency where they need to boost my individual battery even for a limited time? I'm in the middle of nowhere and am rushing my spouse to the hospital. I am being tailed / stalked and don't want to go home, but need to get to a police or other safe place.

 

Every modern car reports where it is to the manufacturer. It wouldn’t be hard for Tesla or anyone else to know what vehicles are where. The easier answer is that they just sent the update to any vehicle with the owners address in the areas affected by the storm. I have no idea if Tesla would allow the change to any one who called about it but I doubt it. As mentioned, the buffer is a designed feature to prevent battery damage and extend its life and not meant to be used.

 

Ah, there's one hit. First off, on one "like" topic I can see an appeal - the rush of instant torque. That's fine. I rode sport motorcycle for many years, and it's the same rush. I get that with an EV - good for those who want that. And yes, wouldn't it be great if the charge and battery tech and functionality was able to match what most, if not all, had to have in a vehicle. I keep stating that it's not all there yet with current tech - and can it be? Can trains and trans-oceanic cargo run all their vessels on this? Is there enough materials on the ground to build up all the usable items and NEW infrastructure to support the private population? Do we have an accurate count on materials going forward to say we can meet the goals? Or is it mandate and find out later? Most of the push seems to be only towards private vehicles (kind of like how certain owned vehicles / industry transports get a pass on emmisions...)

And the other issue is not what I care about what someone else does or likes. I have and do plenty others probably wouldn't like too. The issue as I see it for this topic is that there is a concerted push / mandates to force people out of what "they like" into something that may not be all up and running yet, that would have a detrimental affect on their life / jobs. That's why some people bother to get bothered about it - someone has different ideas about somebody else, and force it.

They literally just mandated that date X in Canada will no longer be allowed to sell gas powered vehicles. States and cities are drooling over this same move. And a lot of this is being predicated on junk science at least as it exists right now, and guilt. That is literally bothering about what someone else does, buys, and likes.

 

The same could be said about fossil fuels

Seems like nobody cared about "reduce, re-use, recycle" until EVs started to get popular. Now all of a sudden everybody is an expert in resource extraction

 

A lot of this still circles back to my (admittedly snarky ) post / questions. Does anyone actually believe it is a good idea for a remote entity to change your wholy-owned vehicle's functionality based on something such as your driving "likes" compared to theirs? A statement is made about why bother with what others think / do, but that is literally what the Tesla post states.

I couldn't care less about the actual affected mundane function listed, but they are determining what they like or not about your driving and affecting the functions of you vehicle based on that. Here on TW of all places, where I remember complaints about dealers because they said the Tacoma Off Road was not literally meant to be taken off road. Can you imagine that they would brick your 'connected' truck of you tried to take it too close to MOAB / whatever, because they didn't believe in your "like" of driving it there in the way you do?

My whole interest in this from the beginning has always been a privacy control matter. If Toyota has a lawyered-up doc stating they can remotely adjust my engine because I took a corner too sharp, per their discretion and not my driving ability, I will gladly sell.

 

Remember ashtrays in McDonalds, change is a bitch, but it’s constant. Fixing any problem requires admitting that you have a problem. Anyone that thinks we don’t have serious problems is in denial. It’s a science thing, gravity is a bitch.

 

'nobody' and 'everybody' are pretty broad brush strokes. I'd been for years on the fighting end of your three R's, and RoHS, and working with countried /states that require EOL items to be returned to the manufacturer, etc. Your last sentence should be more like nobody is an expert, which is the true problem. Resource extracting is the beginning of the energy cycle of a product, and I don't think anyone would argue that today's tech uses much more that is "seen" by the general public, and even engineers. If so your first R would go down.

Otherwise it all reminds me of this (increasing public (i.e. never ending) funding to make EVs and things popular, but not necessarily wholy feasible)

 

Assuming you are referring to your drift to solar / other as per some of your previous comments - that's welcomed good and ok. But in re: to your "it's a science thing" - serious question - Do you think we are at a point in time / tech where a forceable mandate should now be put in place for near future date X to get rid of gas-only engines?

This would be putting out a replacement of generic widget in place if it was ready to go. This replacement must be able to keep up with demand (i.e. resources), supply work / life performance and needs as current (including "fueling" infrastructures meeting current availability for our scenario). And particularly be more environmentally friendly from energy cycle begin, ongoing maintenance, and to end of life of the product. Since that's the main stated goal, right?

Again, this is literally what Canada has done, and others are doing. Are we actually at this point where we can mandate without the final product being ready?

 

Great post, we as a nation have mandated things in the past without knowing the outcome. Look back at the sacrifices that were made during WW2, there were plenty.

 

Not sure how you can compare a solar farm to a fossil fuel plant (I guess you're talking about oil refineries?)

Solar panels sit outside and collect sunlight.

Oil refineries don't create gasoline out of nothing, they have to be fed crude oil from a tanker or pipeline

 

Bingo.

Between increased population and increased energy demands per person, imagine how much energy the world will need another generation from now. Doesn't matter where it comes from (how its generated) it all ends up in the same place..

 

If people would just stop pumping out babies we’d solve a lot of problems.