The Frankenstein Build! LT/Expo/Trail rig..and BS

You don't count... Haha I'm talking about stock drivetrain!

 

with a crawl box. i could tolerate an manual haha.

so jerry, you have the fast and furious gear box then?

 

Manual trans with dual cases FTW!

 

Agreed!!

Wait till I put on my front skid haha 3/8 think for part of it..gonna be ridiculous haha

So jelly!

Someday..

 

Eh, not so much anymore. These new touch screen phones make it a lot harder cuz you can't feel the buttons like I could on my older phones. I used to be able to send texts without even taking my eyes on the road.

My auto has 5 gears too, so I would also have 15 different low gears. Although how are you getting 15? 4Lo and high has 5, then 4hi and low has 5 and then 4Lo and low has the last 5?

Anymore I am debating not getting a crawlbox... Right now I can use my brakes on really steep and tough obstacles to stop and re-adjust, etc and then just power brake it to keep from rolling back. If I go to a crawlbox I kind of lose my brakes because the crawlbox will push through them so the only way to stop is to shift into N, which could be a pain if you happened to be in 1st... Plus in 4Lo and 1st mine crawls just fine. Hell it crawls pretty good in 4Hi and 1st, just takes a little more throttle to get moving and the tranny probably hates it. haha Look at mh.meier, he did all of Moab 2012 in 4High without a problem. Let's see you guys do that with your manuals. I'm sure you could do it but your clutch would hate you by the end. haha

This is my thought on a manual for offroading:

It's just one of these basically:

While the Auto is more like one of these:


Sure they can both go offroad, but the auto can do it better and without having to dump money into it (aka crawlbox). The only reason a lot of people still use manual tranny's in dedicated crawlers is because they are cheaper and easier to repair than an auto, but at that point that means you are planning on it failing and most dedicated crrawlers are much older rigs from back when they were mostly manuals right from the factory.


That will be my new take on this debate. haha. The manual is the spacer lift to the auto being the suspension lift. Both can get the job done really, but one does it better

 

You'll love it with your 35s! ...just sayin

 

Do you realize what you've just started!?

 

NO!

Here's my first time out with dual cases, still getting to know the system.
http://youtu.be/0hRnUBoZ9t4

 

But you can choose the gear you want with a manual. Autos are for girls

I have 5 in the T case low

5 with just the crawl box

And 5 in Low low

 

What is humming noise I heard twice in that vid?


I can do all that too just fine with my auto haha Only difference is I didn't have to drop $2k on the crawlbox + redo the driveshafts. It would be nice if it was just slightly lowered geared, maybe 5.29's but my 4.88's while in 4Lo it will walk up a slight incline by itself, just not rocks like that without a touch of throttle. My 4.88's seem to be right on the edge of getting the torque converter to hook up without throttle, like I said I think if it was just a tad lower geared it would walk up much steeper stuff on it's own. It's actually geared low enough I can kill the motor! haha That freaked me out the first couple times it happened

 

So, that noise is my PS pump. It needed a flush. Here's the thing about the cost. My rig was only 6k when I bought it, so the 2K I spent on the box puts me at 8k. In other words CHEAP! That being said, my rig is faster than comparable autos, climbs up I70 better than the autos and gets slightly better gas mileage than the autos.

True you can climb the same stuff with an auto as a stick... for an hour or two. The auto guys I wheel with have to take breaks through our trips to let their trannys cool because of gas/brake combo. Also, that combo makes the break CVs all day long. My truck rock crawls on CVs with almost 220,000 miles on them!

 

Case in Point^^^ It's a dick measuring contest haha


And I hate that argument... It's like you people have never driven an auto before, you can choose your gears in an auto as well.... Some of the newer autos are getting to not be that way, like my mom's cobalt, It just has a L, I, and D. I is supposed to put it one gear below whatever the tranny things is the optimal gear making it a little more torquey or to hold back better while going down a steep hill.

But the Tacos still have every gear on the shifter.

 

They need bigger tranny coolers then... That's not even an issue on the 2nd gens and I doubt it is on the 1st gens either. Are they trying to run like 40's on factory gears or what?

I can see how the cv thing can be an issue, but that is driver error (too much throttle too quickly...). If you eliminate that driver error, it is just as likely to break a CV on a dual cased 1st gen when you have your foot on the brake and start to let out on the clutch... Possibly even more likely because you have significantly more torque from the crawlbox. I've only broken 1 cv and it had nothing to do with power braking it. I got high centered and was at almost full droop and fully turned with the front locker engaged so the poor CV never stood a chance since it was pretty much the only tire with traction. Was dumb on my part to turn the wheel all the way. I realized my error right when I heard the pop...

 

Just caught your edit. I wondered if that is what it was. Flushing it fixed it?

But if that person bought a $6K rig like yours but auto, he could have dumped that $2K into say gears and lockers, or suspension or armor or whatever. haha

 

I know for me when I went trial riding for about 6 hours it never went above 192. The 4Runner I wheel with all of the time did get to 206, but that's because of a known problem.

 

Not really... they run 33s and 34s (305s) on 4.10s and are all experienced wheelers. (CO4LO and RM4x4 club members) It's just that contastant force of the gas/brake that kills em.

Also, the dual cases ends up reducing torque on the CVs and people rarely break them after going duals. This happens because the engine is basically at idle (putting out idle torque) the entire time you're crawling. Nate from TTORA broke 14 axles before he went duals (he's on 36" TSLs) and hasn't broken as single one since.

For me, it's just a great system.

 

Yeah, it went away... i think my fluid was just too old and it was a cold day. You're right about getting the auto, but it comes down to priorities I guess. I'm locked, armored and cased. I got my locker first, armor next and case last, so I crawled single case for a good while.

 

x2

My .02, if 4lo isn't geared low enough it's 2 slow for me.

manual trans are just as good, and more fun than a auto, hence making the classic yota 5spd a obvious winner over a auto trans.
nobody remembers a decent auto, it either is extremely impressive, or is a paddle shift that is fast and smooth, but people remember good manuals, and they remember bad manuals, so manual is more iconic.

Monte, i wasn't thinking strait when i asked about a cab swap, thanks for your time.

 

I see. They need to add a tranny cooler to the rig then. RCToy put one on his 1st gen with it's own E-fan. Great insurance really. You can get some nice one for $200 or less.

Crawlboxes increase the torque. Gears are torque multipliers. When you regear your diffs you are taking all that torque/stress off of your driveshaft and moving it to the axles, when you add a crawlbox you are taking the stress off of your tranny/motor and adding it to the driveshaft and axles. It all just rolls downhill basically.

The catch is like you said you put out less torque at idle, but I think that isn't significant enough to counter the massive gear change you just did and you are probably still where you were at to begin with.

The big difference is driving style. You no longer have to play the "operate 3 pedals with 2 feet game" and don't get carried away with the throttle so naturally you break less CV's.

Take RCToy and Slodgetto both have 1st gen autos. Slodgetto had only broken 2 CV's until he went to 37's (which is asking for trouble, haha) and that was because he had just converted his pre-runner to a 4wd and was still driving it like a prerunner instead of a 4x4, plus they were weaker non-OEM CV's. Once he broke them and put non-OEM's in and figured out he didn't have to drive with a lead foot, he didn't break one for quite a while. Mean while RCToy manages to break one almost every time he goes out. He uses a mix of OEM and non-OEM, but he drives like a bat out of hell and puts his S/C to work those 35's pop CV's all day long.

 

What? The lower you gear it the slower it is Unless you are talking about flat out acceleration, then yeah lower gearing equates to better acceleration. haha

It's hard to compare a 1st gen auto to a 1st gen manual though, because they are like on different wave lengths entirely... Their 1st gears are way different. 2.80 vs 3.83 while the 2nd gen auto is 3.52 so it isn't too far off of the 1st gen manual.

Look at it this way. A factory 2nd gen auto with it's 3.73's and a factory 1st gen manual with it's 4.10's are both geared low than a 1st gen auto with 5.29's! I was blown away when I 1st realized that. It's pretty close though. Basically a 1st gen auto with 5.29's is on par with a factory 2nd gen auto and the factory 1st gen manual is just a tad lower geared than them.