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Towing/Camper Question

Discussion in 'Towing' started by Andrews77, Apr 18, 2023.

  1. Apr 18, 2023 at 4:30 PM
    #1
    Andrews77

    Andrews77 [OP] Member

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    I drive a 17 dc trd off-road with tow package and I have no issue adding a secondary trans cooler or any other parts to make this work better.
    I flipped through a large portion of the towing thread and found it difficult to get a good answer for my particular scenario. I’m looking to purchase a camper and two surveyor legend models have made it to the final decision. The 240bhle and the 19bhle.

    240(uvw 5137, hitch weight 550, ccc 2500, dual axle)
    19(uvw 3750, hitch weight 400, ccc 1000, single axle)

    The 240 would be better for my family and I believe I could make it work but would have to be so frugal when choosing what to take with me because it would obviously be dangerously close to my capacity.

    The 19 is less ideal but obviously much lighter which would give me wiggle room as far as what I can pack, however the single axle will be the limitation and potentially cause a problem down the road when I upgrade my truck and want to take more stuff with me.
    So I’m looking for advice on which direction I should go, I don’t want to tow dangerously but I also don’t want to make a purchase that will not serve its purpose properly. Buying a larger truck can’t happen at the moment but could be an option in a couple years.
     
  2. Apr 18, 2023 at 4:38 PM
    #2
    USMILRET

    USMILRET Tacoma Owner

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    I would get a total weight of everything. The family, dog, food, water, camper ect and work with that total weight. The problem that you have and you already well know is that the Tacoma is a very small, light truck.
     
  3. Apr 18, 2023 at 4:54 PM
    #3
    Marshall R

    Marshall R Well-Known Member

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    Your trucks payload is going to be the limiting factor, not tow capacity. There is a sticker on the driver's door jamb with a statement that reads something like this. "The total weight of cargo and occupants should not exceed XXXX pounds". That number varies depending on the truck but most 4X4 DC trucks will be in the 1000-1200 lbs range. Some as low as 900 lbs and occasionally as much as 1300. You need to determine that before you can do anything. Your truck is rated to PULL 6400 lbs. But your suspension may not handle anywhere near that.

    The UVW doesn't help much, those hitch weights are based on an empty trailer. Figure 500-1200 lbs more for the loaded weight of the trailer. Then figure 13% of that as hitch weight.

    The 3750 lb trailer will be 4200-4750 lbs once you get batteries, propane, water, food, and other gear in it. That means 550 to 600 lbs hitch weight.

    Once you find the payload subtract 550-600 lbs from it. That is how much payload you have left for you, passengers and cargo in the truck.

    I'll use my truck as an example. I have 1200 lbs payload. If I have 550 lbs on the hitch that leaves 650 lbs usable payload. My wife and I combined weigh 360. Which leaves 290 lbs for other gear in the truck. I could tow that trailer, but it would be cutting it close if I were to max out the the trailers GVW.

    I don't think it would be practical to try the 5100 lb trailer, but you'd just have to do the math. I'm assuming you're 4X4. If you're 4X2 your truck is maybe 200 lbs lighter, and you'd have another 200 lbs of payload.
     
    Da Voke and 98_3RZ_NIC like this.
  4. Apr 18, 2023 at 5:13 PM
    #4
    Andrews77

    Andrews77 [OP] Member

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    I agree that payload is the limiting factor. My truck has 1,000 lb payload cap, assuming 300 lbs for my wife and I, and another 200 lbs for miscellaneous gear in the truck, the smaller trailer would likely max my payload capacity out once it’s loaded down. I would be comfortable doing that with my weight distributing hitch, I have done it with other trailers many times and the truck handles it fine. My next question is the larger trailer is a dual axle so could I not carefully distribute the weight I want to carry in the trailer so my tongue weight is closer to that 10-11% mark? I could load the larger trailer down to 6000 ish pounds and still not exceed my payload capacity if I’m careful with the weight distribution. Then when I upgrade my truck I would have that much extra capacity to carry more stuff. I don’t want to literally put the cart before the horse but I also don’t want to buy a camper twice as they seem to depreciate quickly and it would be hard to recoup loses during an upgrade.
     
  5. Apr 18, 2023 at 10:45 PM
    #5
    PatZ

    PatZ Active Member

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    So the payload issue is already laid out. Heavier trailers will put more of a load on the vehicle, and the Tacoma doesn't have a very high rating. As others have already said, be careful you don't go over capacity because these trailers will at the very least bring it close. Couple of things to add to it, are you sure your max payload is 1,000 lbs? Most ratings I've seen have a max payload of 950 lbs, but I may have missed info on different trims. Two, do you know exactly how much your truck weighs compared to the GVWR? On my old Tacoma I've found that with the bed cover (which came from the factory with it), I only had 890 lbs left over from the GVWR when I weighted it at a CAT scale.

    The other thing you have to take into account is the WDH. The 240 advertised hitch weight WILL need a WDH (tongue weight over 500) with sway control. Those things weigh around 100 lbs, which goes against your payload and hitch weight as well. The Tacoma has a max hitch weight of 640 lbs I believe with a WDH (500 without one), so that empty hitch weight (550) + the WDH will put you at least up to the limit and probably over.

    In short I think the 240 may be asking for a bit much from the Tacoma. You're coming right up to the limits with the advertised weights, and it's likely the actual weight will be more than that. I think the 19bhle would be manageable depending on what the actual weights are, not just the sticker numbers. Though even if you keep the hitch weight below 500, you'll still want some kind of sway control system. It's normally recommended on trailer more than 3,000 lbs, especially for these large travel trailers. Looking at your last post, the 240 would put you at 1150 lbs of payload. That's including advertised hitch weight, WDH, you + pax (300), and extra gear (200). That puts you over, and that's before you get into extra gear on the trailer. The 19 puts you at 938 lbs estimated, same variables as before but with a lighter hitch. That's still cutting it tight.

    Now you might be able to make the 240 work if you load all your extra gear in the trailer so it's just you and your wife in the cab, so long as the tongue weight is at least 9-10% according to the Tacoma manual. As said before though, that hitch weight probably isn't considering battery and propane + extra gear on the trailer. That's almost 100 lbs right there. Now you can move the tanks into the trailer and get a lighter battery, but it's still going to be heavy and close to limits. That's assuming that the advertised weights are even accurate, which normally they're not, and not in our favor either. Again, I think that trailer's out of the truck's limits. That extra wiggle room with the 19 may make all the difference in the world here. Before you buy anything, make sure you measure these weights yourself. Don't just take the brochure's word for it, or even the frame sticker for that matter. At least measure the tongue weight. You can probably assume that the actual dry weight of the trailer is +300-500 lbs over the sticker.
     
    muddog321 likes this.
  6. Apr 19, 2023 at 12:33 AM
    #6
    muddog321

    muddog321 Well-Known Member

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    Been there done that had a 26Ft and sticker said 4200 (then factory sent a new one at 4800 oh sorry and I would not have bought it) then weighted at truck scale and actual empty (no propane tank or battery, all fluids empty and as bought) and 5400. You will not believe your total GVWR when you head out on a trip fully loaded - only the truck scale will show you and it will not be pretty. Truck scales have at least 2 scale sections so you can get a total, then drop trailer tongue on one scale and trailer on other pulling truck ahead off scales and get those weights. So for cost of 2 weighs you get figure out all the weights. Eye opening to see the results!

    You can barely tow that 240 but it is NOT safe no matter how you internally justify it and never trust a salesman they all lie for the sale period. MPGs will drop to 8-10. You will require a WDH and a brake controller.
    Braking will still suck. The Tacoma rear springs are weak and rear will drop and driveshaft angles will be terrible. The rear diff and wheel bearings will self-destruct over the next year.
    After the first 6 months to a year use usually drops alot after all the pre-trip packing and post-trip cleanups. Camping fees are now high, spaces limited in most Nat Parks, mileage sucks, stopping at friends overnight where to park, storage fees, etc. But camping is fun and with a tent it always seems to rain during the trip.

    Before you buy anything simply rent a unit of similar weight for a weekend and see how it tows as only costs a few hundred $$ and then you really know because after you buy one its yours (or banks).
     
  7. Apr 19, 2023 at 3:42 AM
    #7
    USMILRET

    USMILRET Tacoma Owner

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    I think that the OP is fully aware of his limitations.n Just keep in mind that when you go camping that it should be somewhat minimalist anyway. Go with the lighter camper and be safe.

    19(uvw 3750, hitch weight 400, ccc 1000, single axle)
     
  8. Apr 19, 2023 at 4:01 AM
    #8
    Andrews77

    Andrews77 [OP] Member

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    Thank you for your replies. I unfortunately think y’all are 100% correct and the 240 is too much. I have a wdh with Sway control and an add a leaf I can throw on the back end of my truck both of which help with the sag and ride quality but I know neither of them technically help with payload capacity. Also my door sticker does say exactly 1000, and not 950. If the smaller trailer had a second axle and could handle more weight it would be a no brainer for me, but the smaller is a single axle and will likely limit us in the future as far as bringing kayaks and bikes and other fun gear. I may need to go back and look at other trailers. All camping trips for us are within a couple hour drive as we live in Florida and have a wealth of camping opportunities near us, we tent camp semi often and love it so the camper was the natural next step. Camper trips would be avoiding the highway and likely less than 2 hours one way. Also I borrowed my parents Coleman rubicon 1628, dry weight 3500 and hitch weight is crazy high for size at 550, with wdh and a very lightly loaded truck it towed okay, I wouldn’t be afraid of pulling it again. Overall I do believe y’all are right as much as I want everyone who commented to be wrong, I could possibly make due with the heavier trailer for a short time if I had plans of a truck upgrade very soon. I think even the lighter trailer will push my truck to the limit with its tongue weight after being loaded.
     
  9. Apr 19, 2023 at 4:48 AM
    #9
    Ridgewalker1

    Ridgewalker1 Well-Known Member

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    Better to be on the conservative side because it’s your family. Towing can be stressful.
    What ever you do have fun outdoors!
     

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