Toyota recalling 228,000 Tacoma's due to oil leaks and possible loss of control of vehicle

For the inconvienence, have the dealer install it for you. Worth a shot.

 

Yes, call corporate ahead of time. Get the ball rolling, maybe this time it will get done right.

 

I've had multiple people say that! I should!

 

I got my rear diff checked out today and it turned out good, but if they were to hold my truck for months I would have gone that route with mounting balancing my new tires and a free alignment (at least)

 

This is the biggest non-issue I've ever seen, wow. I get it, Toyota doesn't want to potentially kill anymore people and overreacted big time. But people worried about RTV sealed third member, being 1/5 quart low, barely even weeping in the first place. Most of the pictures I've seen, it would take like 5 years to completely empty the differential. I'd brake clean the shit out of my diff before an oil change if it was leaking, if this is how Toyota wants to handle it. Just add more oil, it will be fine until all this blows over and they can fix it in a timely manner.

 

Holy crap on a cracker!

 

Unfortunately, a lot of us had our trucks confiscated before this thread was started! So, all we knew was what the dealer told us, which was a catastrophic differential defect.

 

maybe......i got lied to....i had pictures of it the night before i took it in....they showed it to me before they "fixed" it...Clean as as if it were brand new.......then they gave me an invoice that stated it had a o-ring replaced......took it back when I questioned it and when I got home, they had added red RTV without telling me.....now it is weeping again in just a 1,000 miles.....oh they said they torqued the bolts only.....

Edit 8-30,2017.........only 657 miles after Recall fix and its weeping again.....

 

The structure of your sentence makes you really hard to understand. There is no O-ring. Ive sealed my differentials with RTV, forever.

This is still a non-issue, sucks Toyota made it into one. But hey, GM let like 125 people die before they fixed their ignition switch problems. Could be worse.

 

I would not put one together without a thin smear of RTV on both sides of the gasket, the gobs and gobs that some dealers have applied as evidenced by some of the photos in this thread are to mind either a sign of gross incompetence, or worse a deliberate attempt to deceive the customer into believing something was done (which if they billed Toyota for is fraud).

On Ford's differentials with rear covers one of the first things most do is throw the gasket away and use only RTV...

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In the matter of r1200gs4ok's dealer experience my bet would be that the dealer did nothing but torque the nuts, and then apply a bead of RTV around perimeter of the already installed carrier assembly--they used red to enhance the illusion.

There are two O-rings, one on each side on the axle bearing flanges, both are to be replaced if the carrier (and thus axles) are removed. If indeed r1200gs4ok's invoice does claim only one O-ring (the report of such may be just a hyperventilated misinterpretation) then it is a complete sham.

Here are the parts, tools, and materials lists from the recall document (note the misspelling of "equipment" by a multi-billion $$ company, that sure adds confidence; also note there is no sealant, red RTV or otherwise indicated in the materials):

 

just had mine checked no leak

 

In and out in an hour or two. Nothing found wrong!

 

I kinda understand where you're coming from, but this is an issue. You should really never have fluid leak out of a differential or anywhere for that matter. You can say that a little is acceptable and you may be correct, but after all the years walking these automotive plants, that's not what I have seen as acceptable. You should have no leakage in this day and age where we have all these materials that could seal up to mating pieces to where no fluid passed.

Do I think Toyota over-reacted? To some degree, yes.

Do I think Toyota handled this correctly? Absolutely NO.

Toyota created the whole TPS - Toyota Production System that was meant to eliminate any and all issues at the component level. They let this one slip and then they tried to hold trucks for "ransom" (not the best word, but that's what I'm calling it) so they could cover their mistake.

I'm an engineer... I wish they would actually say what the component failure was just so that I would know what to watch out for down the road. Not that that will ever happen, but it's a wish.

What really bothers me is seeing folks w/ dealerships doing a repair that is not per the NHTSA repair record. It may be better, but r1200gs4ok got flat out lied to. This is where this whole issue goes south for me. If Toyota has some dealerships doing one thing and others another, how do they control the fall-out if one of the options fails? He wasn't the first to have RTV used (and I'm not saying that RTV is not better, just not per the paperwork that is filed w/ the NHTSA) and he probably won't be the last. I'm pretty sure that is an issue that Toyota will find out later was not a good situation.

 

I do not believe there was any component failure, but rather an assembly process failure. Were it a component failure the response to an assembly that is not currently leaking would not be "re-torque the fasteners and send them on their way"--which would be a completely irresponsible response to a potential component failure in 228,000 vehicles; that can only be apparently identified by that it is not "leaking" now, with "now" being some relatively random point in time selected by each owner choosing to have their vehicle inspected.

This is supported by a statement made by a "Victor Vanov, spokesman for the automaker." that they had changed the assembly process at its plant “to include a bolt [sic] retightening process,...” as reported here. I suppose though this could be so as to minimise the issue.

I agree that one should never have fluid leaking from anywhere, however in the real world it happens--I had a '73 Jeepster years ago on which i had to top off the front differential every 10 to 12 days. And in the real world a few milliliters of misting/weeping gear oil hardly constitutes a safety hazard.

Toyota has no dealerships in the sense that they are factory outlets, they are all independent "franchise operations" like AAMCO, Midas, JiffyLube, McDonald's or Burger King--think about that for a while...

 

I will clarify that I intended that by "component", I mean component or piece in the process (assembly included). Sorry for not being clear.

You're right that losing some over some longer amount of time is not bad, but this is the first new vehicle I've had in years and the first vehicle in the last 15 or so that had a leaking issue. Last one I had that leaked was an old '97 T-Bird that had an issue w/ leaking oil through the head gaskets or something. Even that was not that bad... not enough to worry between oil changes at the time.

This is a new vehicle... kinda sad that I've had this many issues.

 

I have been doing some research for a friend with regard to unfounded beliefs and ran into a form of informal fallacy called argumentum ad novitatem (Appeal to Novelty). It is a premature claim to something's superiority simply because it is new and for no other reason.

The Wikipedia entry for this has an explanation of same that fits the 3rd gen Tacos to a "T", I have highlighted the most relevant charcteristics:

I found this last night and found it striking (4 out of 5) as related to not just the 3rd gen Tacoma, but also to many other vehicles and consumer products.

The Wikipedia article also speaks of Appeal to Tradition (unfounded assertion that older things are inherently superior) and Chronological Snobbery, the assertion that only relatively contemporary knowledge, things, etc. are worthy--is well worth the read...

 

Um... Ok, not sure why that matters, but sure, Wikipedia has the answers.

My point is:

1. I have had less issues on older vehicles I've bought used
2. Toyota has built their reputation on being one of, if not THE, premier automotive producers
3. They have TONS of background to build upon when reviewing designs to see what works and what doesn't

You're right... just saying it's new doesn't make it great. But, given the above mentioned points (along w/ others I just can't think of right now), you would believe that Toyota would not release a new generation of their segment leading vehicle w/ this many issues. To top that off... when you have one like this (not even mentioning the transmission fluid low issue that never got recalled, the crankcase position sensor, hood issue, etc.) and it being handled the way it is, it's sad that I've had this many issues. Not only issues w/ the vehicle, but issues dealing w/ the dealerships trying to get it fixed.

That's what I'm ticked off about. It's one thing to have issues... nothing is perfect, but to screw around w/ your customers like these guys have is rather poor in my opinion. That's the issues I'm speaking about... not just the issues w/ a new product on the market, but getting the run around by what is supposed to be one of the premier companies in the world. And before you say it... yes, dealerships are independent "franchise operations", but they are also the face of the company that we, consumers, see and that is what gets reflected as Toyota.

 

Our propensity to equate "new" and "best" is one of the things my friend is writing of for his thesis.

I agree 110% with all you have said--we have not bought a new car in 30+ years for exactly those reasons. It is unlikely I will ever buy new again, but should it happen it would never be in the first or second year of a new or redesigned model's run. Between letting the real world throw its weight at a product, and the consumer being the final quality control for some years now, it takes a couple years to shake the bugs out...

 

They called me and told me parts are in, and they are working on my truck. Might be ready later
today or tomorrow early. ...Alleluia!!!!!! Now I can order some Michelin tires.
Took 1.5 months and 3 days.

 

I dislike these fuckers so bad....