Trans Shutter

If you want resolve, then you may have to get a little more aggressive with the dealer and Toyota like did. All I can say is do not buy their "But let it learn for a few months and let us know how you're doing on your first 5000 mile service" that's total BS!!! This is NOT a trans learning issue! This is; what is pointing to a software issue in how it controls the transmission shifting, rpm's and such. It has 100% NOTHING to do with your driving habits! Don't buy their's or anyone else's crap who tries to use that age old excuse! They tried pulling that sh_t on me, I stood my ground and demanded something be done and now it finally is being moved directly into Toyota's lap as my post explained. I explained to the dealer, I have been a mechanic since before I could drive, thanks to my AWESOME Dad teaching me. I told my dealer they might sell that load of crap to some little ol man who doesn't know any better but they are not going to pull that over on me and it got their attention or at least I hope it has.

Go back to your dealer, speak to the President, GM or even the owner if you have to and those guys only! Tell them you want a Rep from Toyota to come down and inspect your truck and don't leave until they agree to do it. If they still refuse, PM me your information and I will give it to the Toyota rep who is coming to look at mine for the same EXACT problem. Some of these dealers are a-holes, once they get your money in their eyes, they are done with you.

Let me know.

 

Thanks for your support. I will be watching for your Friday update on how your meeting went. Do you think we really have a couple of rare lemons, or do you think no one else can feel this?

 

You are welcome. No, I think there are many others out there just like ours. However, since the 19's are so new to the market it will take a few more months before we really start to see the numbers rise like when this issue happened with the previous year models. My thing is, I don't mind having an "issue", as long as there is a fix for it. However, when I really loose my patience is when the dealer tries to give us consumers a bunch of lies and BS that they themselves know is false, like what they told you. I'm sure they do that because that is what Toyota has instructed them to say. Sadly, it is typically the consumer who looses in the end. I'm just tying to keep the faith that my dealer will make sure I leave there satisfied with the outcome.

I will definitely keep you updated.

 

Well, I am still fighting and struggling but it is only the beginning. Here's the latest as of today:

Mr. President,
Thank you for taking the time to visit with me today. However, I am very disappointed to say the least with the outcome thus far from TOL (Toyota of Longview). I feel from you and the service manger after today's visit that I am the only one who is feeling this shudder/hesitation. When I left your dealership this afternoon, I immediately felt the shudder all the way home just like always. I consider my self an extremely honest & reasonable person. I am trying my hardest to be patient and work this out in a very courteous & professional manner. However, I feel like I am getting the run around and I'm not exactly sure why. I'm a paying customer who has a legitimate complaint that your Master Tech has acknowledged (on more than one occasion) as well as the FST who came down. I was told that he did feel the shudder to some degree.

So, my question to you is; where does the customer service piece of me being an unhappy consumer start? I bought this vehicle from you in good faith that I would be satisfied with all aspects of the truck. If that were not the case then I would not have made the purchase. I am again very sorry but I will NEVER buy the idea that this truck is designed per the normal performance parameters to shudder/hesitate. I am not crazy & I am not imagining something that isn't really there. If that's the case then your Master Tech is crazy and imagining things as well. I did drive another truck like the one I have and although It did seem to have the same issue, it was not as obvious as what my truck is doing. It is not my concern who, what or why this is happening on these particular vehicles. It is however my most important concern that I pay for a vehicle that does not exhibit this issue as mine is doing especially being brand new. To be totally honest with you, after today's visit, I feel that TOL has no intention of recognizing my issue with this truck because then they would assume accountability/responsibility. The fact that certain individuals within your store will not acknowledge this issue is deeply concerning to me. My wife who typically doesn't even notice so much as a rattle in a vehicle is telling me of her own observation that she is feeling the shuddering whenever we go someplace.

So, where do we stand as of today? This is my 2nd request that TOL switch me out to the same truck except this time with a V6 engine. All my life and during the time I worked for my Dad, he always made the customer happy even if it meant a loss for him which I have seen happen more than once. He made sure the customer was satisfied no matter what when they left. That is why he was extremely successful in business all those years. You see sir, I was brought up that way. I am no different that anyone else who walks through your door and spends money with you with the same expectation. I should not have to go through the process of "lemon law" nor should I have to deal with all this back and forth to the service department like I patiently have been. As the dealer (owner), it is you responsibility to manage my expectation and ensure that I leave happy with the product that you have sold me if you want to be successful.

Please explain to me why I don't feel that way after today's visit?

All I want is what I intended to get when I first came to your dealership; a vehicle that performs as it should and sadly, I do not have that at this point. Instead, I get excuses that basically Toyota designed this truck to shudder/hesitate and that is complete nonsense. By switching me into a different truck is nothing more than you yourself would not demand if you went into a dealer and a made a purchase like I have.I spend a great deal of time on social media and I have given TOL good reports and surveys but at this point I am starting to question if that was such a good thing for me to do. I would appreciate it if you would find a way to get me out of this truck and into a V6 model in order that I can feel like buying a vehicle from TOL was a smart thing to do.

Regards,
ME

 

The engine is tight, if it lugs down it's going to viberate! Try putting your foot in it more, it's cheaper than buying another truck. I was pretty disgusted with mine, till it got some miles on it, once it loosens up it gets better.

 

I can understand the theory of a tight engine and the effects. However, the loaner they put me in was a brand new 2019 4 cylinder Camry with 21 miles, It was as smooth as glass. My wife's brand new Chevy Equinox is a 4 cylinder, it is as smooth as glass. So, if the engine was so tight that is causes a shudder then there is still a problem. I have been building engines since I was a teenager (again, thanks to my awesome Dad) and NEVER EVER have I seen shudder like this because it was new and tight. I do appreciate your post and suggestions though.

The engine runs smooth as silk even when it is shuddering, the rpm's are spot on smooth as well. The tech at the dealer who has been thus far the only person who has been real with me believes in his opinion and "off the record" that there is a glitch the computer and/or software. He, like me, does not feel there is anything wrong with the engine or transmission.

 

Here is an interesting observation. Recall that I have the low RPM vibration noticeable in the low end of 4th, 5th, and 6th. Worst is 6th, or perhaps this is just the speed I am in most frequently. But just for kicks, I tried cruise control at many speeds from 31 to 45. It appears there are two computers, one for normal Drive and one for Cruise. In Cruise control, the software is much smarter and for 4th and 5th, it maintains a much improved 1400 rpm as it's minimum. Setting the cruise at anything higher than 45 will get you into 6th and for some reason, this gear is still allowed to get down to about 1200 rpm where I still get the rude vibration. Try this and see if all your cruise settings below 45 mph reduce the vibration.
So if the normal drive computer was as smart as the cruise computer, it would not be so eager to move me up to the next gear and things could be a lot better. Even though the better designed transmission should not have any of these problems, it seems this one could be reduced with simple reprogramming.
Regarding simply putting my foot into it more, that's not the cure. My daily commute is primarily 35 to 45 mph. How do I keep my rumble ride from settling into the next highest gear when we are all flowing along at a peaceful 42 mph? All the way to work I keep thinking my phone is on vibrate and I have continuous calls!

 

Very good observation. I also tried the cruise control and mine seemed to almost completely clear up. I tried mine at hwy speed of 75 mph. The the cruise on @ 75 it seemed to stop the surging, when I turned the cruise off it immediately started back doing it again. I told the dealer this and they are going to have Toyota investigate that as well. Of course the cruise control is worthless in the 4 cylinder like mine unless you want to blow the engine up. With the cruise on while running 70-75 and hitting an incline it downshifts to the point it almost redlines. Whatever 9 year old designed the computer software, transmission ratios and how those ratios coincide with the differential ratios should be FIRED! When I hit the smallest of inclines at hwy speeds it is like putting the brakes on. in fact, whoever decided it was a good idea to build a 4 cylinder with an automatic transmission should be fired. If my truck had a manual transmission none of this would be an issue.

 

Dan. I want to pass this along. Last night I tried something that should have been tried from the very beginning and wasn't. I took the positive post off the battery and walked away for 20-30 minutes. This morning on my way to work and I'm not sure if it is all in my mind or not but I could almost swear I'm not feeling the shuddering/bumping anymore. HOWEVER, I'm NOT convinced just yet that it is "fixed" as that was just one quick trip to work. Once I drive it home this afternoon and for another day or so I will be able to confirm this either way. There is always a chance the ECM could have had a glitch in it somewhere and resetting it may have cleared it up, at this point, I honestly cannot say for sure because I don't have a computer science degree but regardless, I will let you all know soon.

Try this this on your truck and report back the results.

*****UPDATE***** Nevermind, coming in to work this morning it is still bumping/shuddering/jerky mostly while accelerating in between shifts. Oh well, I was hoping that would fix it anyway.

 

*****UPDATE (1/28/19) *****
So, imagine my surprise when I received a phone call this morning from a Police Officer stating that he had received a call from the owner of Toyota of Longview who was reporting me for writing this negative review on social media. Customer Service at it's highest level ??? Hmmmm...

 

What does law enforcement have to do with this? By chance did you threaten someone? Outside of that occurring, LE has no reason to be involved in private party disputes.

 

Again, LE has nothing to do with it but when a citizen calls the police wanting to file a complaint the officer HAS TO answer the call by phone or in person. There were no threats or names mentioned. The dumba_s owner of the dealership was just very intimidated and mad at me (because of my social media posts) and the thought calling the PD out would get me in some kind of trouble, obviously he was wrong! The officer called me just as he should have to confirm my side of the story, he and I had some laughs, told some war stories and he left. The owner of the dealership is the idiot who has no clue what Freedom of Speech means.

 

Was not accusing you. Just curious as to how LE got involved in a private party dispute. Hope you can get all of this resolved.

 

No no, I understand, it's all good. Just explaining. Thanks.

I am beginning the process of Lemon Law suit now per my lawyers instructions so, we'll see.

 

Transmission is programmed to shift to higher gears as soon as possible to improve fuel mileage. When you get into low RPMs and put more load on the engine to do the same amount of work, then you get an increase in vibrations. Accelerating smooths everything out. IMO, comparing the 2.7 Tacoma with the Chevy Cruze and Camry are not valid comparisons. The Tacoma is a Body-on-Frame truck weighing 4000+lbs, powered by a relatively underpowered and old design 4cyl. They are different engines with different transmission, power curves, programming, curb weights and aeorodynamics. The 3.5 V6 trucks have a lot of the same complaints and there have been hundreds of thousands of those trucks sold, many owners of which are perfectly content with their truck. You are within your rights to lemon law yours but with all due respect, I don't believe that is the honest or most appropriate action considering how the trucks are designed.

Can I suggest you have your transmission fluid level check atleast.

 

I appreciate your information. However, you have no idea what you are talking about in my case. Sir, I know the difference when a 4 cylinder has a load on it and its reactions versus a constant hesitation, bumping, jerking,shuddering! Again, I have been racing, repairing cars/trucks and building engines for very long time on all makes, models and engine sizes. NO ONE is going to sell me that line of BU_LLSH_T that this truck is engineered to do what it's doing and I don't care who it is. I am more aware of and understand power to weigh ratio's than most people I assure you. If that were the issue then I would have known than before I bought any 4 cylinder and would not have room to complain but that's not the issue. You SIR or anyone one else will never convince me that Toyota designed this truck or any of their vehicles to buck, jerk, surge, hesitate or shudder during acceleration and or cruising speeds because I unlike some know better. I'm not sure if you are just one of those "content owners" (as you put it) who cannot understand why someone else is having a problem such as this but the facts are the facts and the fact is, this truck is not operating as it should and that also includes a Toyota FST, 22 year Dealer Master Tech and a Service Manager agreeing with me. So, in ALL DUE RESPECT, anyone who sits behind their computer and claims that there is nothing wrong with my truck and it is operating as it was designed is simply full of sh_t! And YES, comparing any other 4 cylinder that has to meet the same US Government controlled EPA laws is indeed an equal comparison! AGAIN, there is NO reason that this truck is doing what it is doing other than a malfunction in the ECM, software or both.

Thank you for you comments (although they hold no credibility towards the issue my truck is having). Have a great rest of your weekend!

 

Lulz

 

So, here the latest.

Toyota has refused to do anything (just like I figured). So, I said the h_ll with this POS and went to trade it off 3 weekends ago (Saturday) at another local Toyota dealer. They could not get it done because of my negative equity with it being a brand new now used vehicle. I spent almost 3 hours at the dealer only to find this out. When I left, I just exploded and lost my temper, not at the dealer, just fed up with the whole situation. From the moment I pulled out of the dealer, I turned on ECT and hung the accelerator on the floor and kept it touching the redline there most of the way home. Everytime I took off, I stuck it to the floor and redlined it over and over and over. I literally tried my hardest to blow it up. I literally beat the #$^# out of it all the way home and that is about an hour trip from where I live to the dealer I was at. I got home, parked it with it smelling like it was burning up and I went inside to calm down. I did not look at it or touch it until I had to go to work on the following Monday. When I got it and started off to work Monday morning, I noticed that it was NOT bucking, surging, jerking or hesitating and hasn’t since. Imagine that, right now it is 95% fixed while in ECT mode and just from me beating the %$^& out of it.

So, Monday when I got to work I discussed this whole scenario with my boss who is also a lifetime auto mechanic trying to dissect why this had happened this way. We talked it over and this is the only logical explanation we can come up with. We theoretically determined that the issue has to be with the torque converter. With my application, the fins and internals in the T/C apparently had to be REALLY beat on and gotten REALLY hot to seat in because they were possibly too tight. That is the only thing that could be causing the issue that is logical to us. With the truck in park, you can rev it up to any rpm and it stays as smooth as silk. Previously, you could put it in drive, take off and it would start all that stupid sh_t again. So, I did some research and Toyota released TSB T-SB-0058-18 for this apparent same issue for the 2016’s and up. Those "so called" genuis’ at Toyota need to go back and issue one for the 2019’s because they have not fixed the problem just like I tried to tell them this whole time. Know I see just how stupid these HIGHLY TRAINED TECHS truly are. That dumbazz FST that came to look at my truck apparently did not have the intelligence/training to diagnose what I inadvertently did in about 1 hour. Now, of course, had I not beaten the ever loving %^&$ out of it, I would more than likely still not have found the issue as I believe I have. However, it is still a problem that Toyota refuses to address.

IN MY OPINION, replacing the Torque Converter from the start would have been the best chance I had at fixing the issue. I do know that some T/C's when they are assembled can have some tighter than normal tolerances especially when you are producing these things by the thousands and the QC process has any weak links at all. I've seen aftermarket (high end) drag race converters with the tolerances slightly tighter than they should have been that caused similar issues for a while until they get hot and broken in. In a NEW T/C it doesn't take much difference in tolerances at all to produce the effect that my truck had. However, having said all that, if I turn off the ECT, I can feel it a little more than with ECT on but even so, It is night and day difference compared to the way it was prior to me beating on it.

So, anyway, the truck is doing pretty decent now so we’ll see how it goes. Due to me having so much negative equity, it will be at least 2-3 years before I can trade it without loosing my azz so I am keeping it for now and trying to make the best of it.

DISCLAIMER:..........I AM NOT UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE; RECOMMENDING ANYONE WHO READS THIS DO WHAT I DID AND RUN THE RISK OF DAMAGING YOUR TRUCK. I did what I did simply because I did not care anymore and I was totally fed up with Toyota and the dealer I bought it from. Was it the right thing to do? NO. However, so far it looks like doing what I did brought the issue I was having to the surface.

Just wanted to let you all know the somewhat final result.

 

@IndianaDan

Did you ever find any resolution to that issue?

 

No sir. Sorry but apparently, unless you have something wrong with your vehicle in a manner that it just will not run or drive or is safety related, Toyota doesn't give a sh_t about working to resolve issues. Their token response to everything I have said and documented is; "the vehicle is operating as it was designed" which is total horse shit! Like I have said endless times on here, Toyota designed my truck to shutter, hesitate, jerk and buck, hmmmmm??? RIGHT! I have to say, this will be my last Toyota product! And of course, since I am apparently the only one with this issue, I must be imagining all this.