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Urethane bushing question.

Discussion in 'Long Travel Suspension' started by Lil'Taco, Jul 5, 2013.

  1. Jul 5, 2013 at 2:08 PM
    #1
    Lil'Taco

    Lil'Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    So my Total Chaos lt suspension has been a little squeaky lately so I thought I would grease the Zerk fittings today. For starters will that help with the squeaking? Second while I was in looking around I noticed the bushings one the inside of the LCA are really squished (the aft inside one has even cut in a little and shaved off a little of the bushing) and the outside ones seem to have a little bit of a gap. Is this normal/ok? Aslo the mounting tab/alignment tab is extreamly close to the LCA.
    Driver side aft bushings
    [​IMG]
    Passenger side Forward Bushings
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Jul 5, 2013 at 3:59 PM
    #2
    Lil'Taco

    Lil'Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    I forgot this picture of where it was cutting into the passenger side aft LCA bushing
    [​IMG]
     
  3. Jul 5, 2013 at 4:44 PM
    #3
    MEMO CAMPOS

    MEMO CAMPOS Well-Known Member

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    Bent spindle perhaps?....
     
  4. Jul 5, 2013 at 6:46 PM
    #4
    Happysmiley

    Happysmiley Well-Known Member

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    The problem is bushings with inner sleeves are just not a good idea in oval holes with misalignment cams. You're only contacting the inner sleeve on the very top and bottom of the sleeve with the a-arm mount tabs, your inner sleeves will dig into the tabs when you torque the cam bolts down. Your bushing sides are now wedged in, spinning and sliding against the sharp edged surface of the oval hole so they are going to get cut up.

    Bushings are fine when they pivot against a smooth surface on a tab that has a clean single hole the size of the bolt running through them.

    Uniballs with nice spacers that have a big outer diameter where they contact the a-arm tabs are where it's at.

    You can swap to delrin bushings, which is a much harder material. This helps.

    Your cams being maxed out inward bringing your arm that close to the tabs to get your alignment right makes me think something is bent on your truck like Memo Campos said.

    Is that a 2" over kit?
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2013
  5. Jul 5, 2013 at 11:53 PM
    #5
    Lil'Taco

    Lil'Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    It is a 2" over kit.

    I have hardly ever taken it off road yet because I was waiting to get the rear suspension done so I would find it hard to be leave it is a bent spindle. The coils are set at their lowest height so maybe that is why it had to be set to where it is. I plan on putting more preload on them once the rear has been done to level it back out.

    I thought getting lower cam gussets was enough to prevent stuff like this from happening but I guess I never heard/thought of a single round hole for the mounting bolt instead of an oval but then you would loose all adjustability to align the front end.

    I would imagine something with the install must have gone wrong since the total chaos LT kit is a tried and tested design, why would something like this happen and nothing else was mentioned about changing/fabricating the came mounts to prevent this from happening?
     
  6. Jul 6, 2013 at 11:25 AM
    #6
    Happysmiley

    Happysmiley Well-Known Member

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    It's just the way it is with urethane bushings on lower arms in alignment style a-arm mounts. It will still work the way it is, it's been done that way for years, there's just a better way to do it.

    You can smooth out the sharp inside edges of the tabs a little with a grinder and that will help the bushings from getting cut up so much. Like the pic below.

    You were smart to add the tab gussets, that's the first thing that needs to be addressed on 2nd gens.

    Putting a little more preload in your coilovers will help the camber go a lil more positive without having the cams maxed out all the way in.

    If you're not going to run fiberglass with that kit, make sure you cycle the suspension to check for tire/fender clearance at full bump. You can cut your stock fenders nice and clean if you take your time, jigsaw, tape, angle grinder..

    That's all I got, good luck with your build

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Aug 15, 2013 at 8:18 AM
    #7
    SoCaltaco65

    SoCaltaco65 Well-Known Member

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    When you greased the LCA's bushings/assembly did you loosen the bolt? That appears to be displaced by pressure internally.
     
  8. Aug 15, 2013 at 3:20 PM
    #8
    Lil'Taco

    Lil'Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    No I never loosened em' up. I did pump in some more grease and that helped with the severe squeaking a little
     
  9. Aug 15, 2013 at 3:21 PM
    #9
    Lil'Taco

    Lil'Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    What would the torque be on that if I were to do that?
     
  10. Aug 16, 2013 at 8:39 AM
    #10
    Littlebro 5

    Littlebro 5 Well-Known Member

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    You over greased them my uca's did the same thing the grease pushes the bushings out.
     
  11. Aug 16, 2013 at 12:18 PM
    #11
    Lil'Taco

    Lil'Taco [OP] Well-Known Member

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    no they were like that before I greased them. they defiantly look like they were torqued to much and squeezed the bushing. I haven't tried loosening them up yet and see if that helps any with the bushings being squeezed. when I installed the suspension I took it to a ship to do some welding and they had it aligned but I'm starting to think it was a poor alignment in the since that they might have over torqued the alignment bolts. and I honestly think the LCA could have been pushed out a little more still keeping everything aligned still.
     
  12. Aug 20, 2013 at 1:55 PM
    #12
    Happysmiley

    Happysmiley Well-Known Member

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    On uppers it may happen because the washers on the outsides of the bushings can cause a seal.

    On lowers it will not as the oval hole won't seal all the way around and the grease will find a way out.

    Smoothing out the sharp edges on the frame mounts will help, especially the rear mounts as the bushing diameter makes them stick out below the bottom of the tab.

    The lower arm pivots actually need to be a little wider than stock so the frame mounts don't bend in when torqued down.
    You know, like this - lUl not this - \U/
    The U is you lower arm bushing... get it

    So yeah, Delrin
     
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2013
    Crom likes this.
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