What’s With the Oil Viscocity.

If is 0 weight oil it is synthetic there is a difference.

 

I used nothing but the recommended Toyota brand 5w/30 on my 1st gen. No problems after 13 yrs and 229,000 miles.

 

The same engine in other parts of the world i.e, EU specs 5W30.

 

You are correct

http://www.datateck.com.au/lube/castr_au/
Select commercial,vehicles light medium and 4wd. Select Toyota, select “Kluger” 2016-2019 2gr fks 4x4 or 2wd. You will get 5w30 10w30 recommendations.

Kluger is Australian for Highlander. https://www.toyota.com.au/kluger

 

Yes 0-20 is thin like sewing machine oil. It enhances fuel economy. THat being said synthetic oil is far superior to conventional in virtually every application and temperature. I owned a 2005 Honda Accord coupe with a V6 that made 250 HP and that called for 0-20. After 250,000 trouble free miles I am a believer and it had some hard driving miles at high RPM and also lived through the very cold of northern Michigan as well as 90 degree summer heat.
Those engineers built that engine for use with 0-20. Go with it and like the kids say"no worries".

 

Running 5-30 would very likely lower the longevity. Lube keeps moving parts from tearing each other apart, AND holds moving parts a known distance apart during operation. Increasing the viscosity will increase that distance, and increase operating pressures, adding unplanned stresses to push rods, cranks, and piston rings. Only the engineers know for certain what will/can work in their design. The engineers told me to use 0-20, so I do that.

What did they tell you? If there's inconsistency, then that's a problem.

 

Many misunderstandings about viscosity, lubrication regimens and engine cycles.

What do you think happens when the oil is cooler than full operating temperature (you know when most your trips are less than 20 minutes)? The oil is thicker because it is cooler. Oil is thick when cool and thins as it warms. For example, a 0w20 driven 10 minutes will be much thicker than 10w30 driven 30 minutes all things being equal.
So short tripped vehicles with thick cool oil should be breaking rods and breaking head bolts according to your statement.

Lubrication regimen and heat cycle. As an engine and the oil warms to full operating temp the additive package becomes more effective, which is a good thing since 0w20 depends more on Boundary lubrication than a more viscous grade, in high pressure areas when it is at full operating temperature.
A more viscous oil will maintain the superior hydrodynamic regimen through higher pressures and temperatures than a less viscous oil. This is simple physical properties.

Hydrodynamic= a barrier of liquid oil film or wedge of liquid in a bearing separating the moving parts.
Boundary lubrication= the wedge or film has broken and antiwear additives such as zinc form protective layers and are repeatedly worn off and replaced at the contact point of metals. If this additive fails metal to metal micro welding, and breakage occurs resulting g in surface asperities.

Hydrodynamic regimen is superior for wear protection.
The only oil that is too viscous is the one that cannot be pumped, but more viscosity than necessary can rob hp and economy.

 

Some other inaccuracies to point out,

0w is a winter rating not a weight or viscosity it’s just the ability to pump and circulate at extremely low temperatures.

A0w20 is 8-9:times thicker than water @99c

0w20 is not always classified as synthetic. Indeed It’s just a grade of oil.

 

Put 80W in your engine, and try to accelerate to 90MPH with the skinny pedal pegged.

Watch. Listen. Learn. And most importantly, post the video on YouTube.

At that point, your theoretical understanding of lubricants and mechanical strain should have impacted with reality, and be scattered down ~1000 feet of road behind your truck. Don't litter.

Post the YouTube link.

 

Speaking of fuel economy, I recently learned that the EPA requires manufacturers to recommend the same oil viscosity used in the gas mileage tests. This may explain why the 0W20 is required in North America in the 3.5, but not in some other countries. Our colder winters may have something to do with it too. I don’t know. I thought I’d just throw that out there. On my vehicles, I just use what’s on the oil cap and change it on a regular basis.

 

That is bombastic but lacks useful content.

 

It's hyperbolic, too. You missed the obvious point, so I'm skeptical of your content usability judgement abilities. They have no value. Discard them immediately.

fry_skeptical_squint.jpg

 

Do me a favor... Go look up the Cst values (or Seybolt Seconds) for 0W-20 (in only comes in synthetic) At 60 degrees F and then at 250 degrees F. You will find your "much thicker" (that in itself is an incorrect statement but I know what you mean) oil at 60 is not a true statement. The viscosity index for a synthetic, much less a 0W-20 synthetic, is basically flat, meaning the viscosity at lower temps is very close to viscosity at operating temps.

 

I am very familiar with oil specifications and viscosities.

You said
“The viscosity index for a synthetic, much less a 0W-20 synthetic, is basically flat, meaning the viscosity at lower temps is very close to viscosity at operating temps”

That is incorrect. First of all I am not sure you understand viscosity index based on that statement or if you are playing devils advocate by feigning this incorrect position. The fact is that the kinematic viscosity is much thicker at even 104 f than it is at operating temperature.

I will continue to provide facts.

Here is the viscosity index specifications of a very high quality 0w20. M1 0w20 AFE
Viscosity, @ 100ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 8.7
Viscosity, @ 40ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 44.8
Viscosity index=173

Here is a link for sourcing,https://mobiloil.com/en/motor-oils/mobil-1/mobil-1-advanced-fuel-economy

Hmm the above facts and numbers disprove your assertion.
The oil is 5 times as thick at 104 f than it is at 212f
The oil is much thicker at 70f. And much thicker still at 0f.
The fluid is Newtonian in behavior. Nothing magic.it gets thicker as it gets cooler and thins as it heats. So when you start that 0w20 and it’s 100 degrees outside. You are driving around with oil much thicker than a 15w40 at operating temp. Which could be 12.5-15 cst.

2- not all 0w20s are synthetic.

https://parts.ford.com/shop/en/us/motor-oils/motorcraft-sae-0w-20-api-gf-5-8682919-1

I have had a dealer using this in bulk for the Toyota care. Castrol had some conventional GTX in 0w20.

Oh wait there are more! Read the label

Genuine Honda Parts 08798-9036 0W-20 Blended Synthetic Motor Oil - 1 Quart

https://www.amazon.com/Honda-Genuine-Fluid-08798-9036-Synthetic/dp/B007P5RFRO

https://www.phillips66lubricants.com/product/shield-choice/

All of these meet or exceed Toyota’s recommendations.

Amazing what pour point depressants can do!

 

Depending on methods of testing if it's Kinematic viscosity 0 viscosity oil can not exist. It is based on flow time through a fixed orifice so it is impossible to have zero flow time. With SAE 0 viscosity it would have to be a petroleum/synthetic mix such as ester. Now there is a choice you can listen to the team of engineers that had a major hand in developing the engines or someone that knows better that spends their on the internet.

 

Your grasp of kinematic viscosity measurement is incorrect, therefore you make appeals to authority to comfortably believe your understanding is correct.
Besides we already disproved 0w20 to be the engineering recommendation per the recommendations varying by governing body the vehicle is sold in previous posts.


0w oils are a winter rating not a quantitative measurement of viscosity itself.
Refer to SAE J300 https://images.app.goo.gl/48FTb1gEnp9uyrBDA

So when you see 0wxx it means that it will crank and pump and -35 and -40c respectively. It doesn’t mean it doesn’t have any viscosity infact at -40 it is very very thick.

A clarification on J300
There used to be common xxW oils and there are still straight sae grades therefore the minimum kinematic viscosities on the winter grades. With multi grade oils such as 5w30 the minim viscosity is for the higher number at operating temp.

 

Please note time is a factor it can not flow at zero time. "Kinematic viscosity can be measured using a device called a capillary viscometer which consists of a graduated canister with a narrow tube at the bottom. The liquid is placed in the container and allowed to flow by gravity. The higher the viscosity, the longer it takes to flow through the tube (i.e. a fluid with less viscosity will take less time to flow than a fluid with higher viscosity). Kinematic Viscosity is the ratio of absolute or dynamic viscosity to density - a quantity in which the force is external and independent of the mass of the fluid. Kinematic viscosity can be obtained by dividing the dynamic viscosity of a fluid by its density". SAE measure is a different approach. Frankly I don't care but I do believe Toyota has a clue as to what they are doing and will follow their recommendations. Maybe that's why my Toyotas all have run at least 300K.

 

So much internet science and engineering expertise here. I must go re-evaluate so many life choices.

Ok, done. Shop vacs are not good girlfriend replacements. I still suck at plumbing. Bacon is good. Nothing my wife wears makes her look fat. 0W-20 is the best oil for my truck. I can move on now.

 

If anyone is interested, the link is in my signature.

 

Excellent!