Red Bullet VVTi Solenoids GB (Primary GB CLOSED)

If you hear anything on the turd gen, i'm in. But based on their website, i bet they only work on the earlier 1gr.

 

Thanks Rob

I'm in
Please add me to the list

 

All you guys requesting to get in on the list have been added.

No problem. Just happy to do my part.

 

Please put me in on the list too.

 

@Murphinator I'll add you.

To all interested and on the list in the group buy, please review the updated post and make the informed decision for yourself. If you choose to stay on the list, cool, if not, that's fine also.

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/red-bullet-vvti-solenoids-feeler-gb.721327/page-10#post-26188734

 

So you did two baseline runs, then a single run with the upgraded solenoids. looking at the graphs, 2 things:

1. Did you get shown or snap any pictures of the baseline and after changes graphs overlayed? Very difficult to tell if the curves are higher or not. Looks like a bigger dip at the 3200 range with new solenoids? and the sharp spike at 4750 completely throws off the numbers the engine is putting down. perhaps there is a way to tell the difference in torque at 4250 or even 2600 or 3150 without just eyeballing it?
2. The owner saw/observed the peak that happened at 4750 and didn't immediately offer to re-run? That is crazy. If it was his dyno that had something wrong... it is on him. If it is the solenoids doing this... I would be concerned.

 

Hi Rob, please add me to the GB list

 

Interested as well. Will wait for people to post their review

 

I believe early iterations of what was equal to VVT (which was Hondas VTEC design) in the 90's was a simple on/ off version of an oil control valve. At about 4-5000 RPM you would be singing there at wide open throttle and then suddenly you would just feel this nasty kick from the engine and you would be going faster then what you thought the engine was capable of. This was further influenced by the adjustable distributor which you could advance to high hell and it would run even hotter (as in faster) but if you were to Dyno the changes upon advancing that adjustable distributor, you would find rich emissions. Too far back and you would run lean. So there was a recommended degree spectrum you needed to be within +-2 degrees in order to be within pollution control tolerances.

Later iterations of the valve turned into iVTEC, VVTi, Dual VVTi, OCV's, ETEC and similar. They all have the same function but manufacturers like to call them different names probably due to copyright purposes. As you were mentioning, what they do now is they receive a pulse width modulation signal from the computer which slowly ramps up the oil pressure to change the camshafts timing making for a more gradual increase of power which is often less perceived by the end user. To the individual with a very sensitive tookus you can definitely still feel it.

If you are able to modify the bores and the spring rate of the plungers to allow for more oil at X commanded duty cycle then you could in theory allow for more timing which results in more usable power output at the engine and ultimately at the wheels.

Bearing this stuff in mind, economics may play a role in this at the time of manufacture, but also, emissions both on the federal and CARB level. If you allow for too much timing you will allow for excessive fuel usage which would interfere with the emission regulation tolerances of CO and HC PPM that are allowed for the specific vehicle in question. These trucks run hot from the manufacturer so they are more capable of burning off emissions created as the engine runs. By modifying things like the 3* timing gears and the VVTi solenoids which then immediately affects those camshafts driven by the same gears, you are creating more power output ultimately demanding more fuel usage and thereby "creating higher pollution percentages." At this point, however, the vehicle is out of their hands so there is nothing they can do any longer.

The reason why these vehicles do not have an external EGR valve built into them is because the manufacturer (Toyota in this case) had the cams grounded to a specification that would allow the exhaust gasses to recirculate by manipulating the lobes to do so in the way they needed it to. It's ultimately ideal to them for pollution standards set by the gov, but not for us on power production.

My apologies for earlier. I obviously misunderstood the framing of your question and went for "oh this guy is obviously griefing and naysaying. Stuck with that and ran with it."

It happens to me a lot these days and a lot of it has to do with overall health condition. I hope this explanation helps!

 

3 befores and 3 afters.

The issue with our automatics is that we cannot lock our converters and if we do via HPT there is a super high heat production would stress out the hell out of the tranny. I did get a re-test after that and the numbers were posted on the graph immediately above that one. I think it was 315/359. So I'm not sure which one to believe. As hard as the truck pulls with them installed, I'm more inclined to believe the 347/389 numbers.

 

There is one more test I can do to see if the change affects positively or negatively and that is via HPTuners datalog. I can log a 0-60 run on 4X4 so there would no slip based on a hard take off and I could log those times in comparison to my previous 0-60 log.

If anyone would like to see that I'd have to do the swap one more time and do logs of both runs but it is an option on the table.

 

Do that as well. You can get more data, and watch MAF g/s as well. Before and after. Give the engine a little time to cool between pulls too. To help prevent that heat soak.

 

Let us know if you actually gain any MPG.

 

I was thinking the same thing this could confirm the 1st dyno of the solenoids maybe the best of 3 runs with each and same cool down times between them... Also Curious if your gas mileage stays higher with these in. Any way I really like where this is going

 

You guys got it. Logs, check. Some Dyno runs, check. A 0-60 logged pull methodically done to rule out heatsoak and PCM adaptation error, now pending on me.

As far as fuel economy improvements of my own truck 14.0 - 14.3 MPG best previous with mixed city highway driving on OE equipment.

On these solenoids 17.7 - 17.9 MPG with mixed city highway driving.

There is definitely a fuel economy improvement with these versus them out.

 

Do you think NA applications will still yield similar results?

 

I have no reason to believe they wouldn't. You would need other supporting mods like exhaust (ie headers and de-cat) and the cam gears to really see a benefit, but it all helps when you are on the quest for power adders.

Also, NA would make less power than boosted, but that is simply because of the non forced induction factor.

 

I'm more going reliable with better gas mileage as I add weight to try to balance it out. Re-gearing, 3* cam gears and the solenoids are on that list.

 

I expect similar benefits but perhaps not as robust in HP/Tq, but maybe possibly greater in the MPG department. But this is just my speculation.

I will commence discussions with Red Bullet on a firm GB price and will also attempt to procure a 2nd set so we can substantiate the benefits on an NA engine. If that does happen, the NA guinea pig has been identified.

Ball is rolling on this.....thank you for your continued patience.