Yet Another UCA/LCA Ball Joints Question

I am more or less (probably more) a suspension/steering ignoramus. My 2003 has always has a slight pull right, I attempted getting it aligned in 2018 and they did their best, said I needed a new control arm (I believe.) Lots of moving cross country and life situations prevented me from actually addressing until today.

My goal is to just refresh worn out bushings and ball joints, no lifts or special mods, and it looks like replacing the entire arms will be less work than pressing out old/in new bushings. I'm on the fence about new cam bolts unless mine look abused when I take them out.

The question: is there any reason I should stick with OEM and not go with aftermarket control arms?

I've been researching the past 3 days, especially this guy and know a little bit now.

Reason for asking is the price factor, and my biggest concern is aftermarket parts may alter the handling characteristics (see video link.) I'm looking at some MOOG lowers that look beefier than OEM's but they are far less expensive. I haven't found a set of aftermarket uppers that seem right, but have my eye on some OEM uppers that are way less than dealers offer.

The Back Story (if you're bored)

Being ignorant of most things suspension/steering, I took it to a fairly reputable (by W.O.M.) mechanic just for diagnosis. Bottom line is he says both upper and lower ball joints are shot, and need new CA bushings. He gave me an estimate for $1500.

Per side.

Skeptical because they also did stuff I didn't ask for, probably standard in the industry - checked air filter, brakes, fluids, and engine belts, said the belts needed replacing (which I already knew, it's on my list.) What made me really back off was their estimate for replacing engine belts was $520 P & L.

Of course I came straight home and started researching and know a bit more than I did last Friday. I can get OEM uppers or lowers for $200 or less per side but I'm seeing aftermarket control arms for $20 and up, including fire sale kits that include ball joints and other hardware starting at $130 and up. My gut instinct tells me "you get what you pay for" but wonder if I'm throwing money at a label.

So once again my trust in the auto repair industry takes a shot and I'm back on the creeper under the truck.

 

I have about 165k on my 2002. LCAs are stock with stock original bushings. No issues. I replaced the UCAs when I went to a larger tire and installed an OME lift. Cam bolts? Mine are still original. I'm sure location plays a huge factor, no rust problems here on the west coast but they are still original.

Have you tried another alignment shop? I'm always leary when I see posts about these mechanics quoting prices and 'needed work' like that. You'd have to have a serious impact to screw up a control arm. Bushings of course can be an issue and many shops as I understand it will suggest replacing the entire control arm because shop mechanics don't want to hassle trying to replace just the bushing.

If you aren't interested in a lift then just stick with OEM control arms. They come up often here on TW, I'm sure someone in your area has some that are just sitting on a shelf. Try your regional threads. https://www.tacomaworld.com/forums/regions.36/

As for lower ball joints, I'd stick with OEM.
https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/can-lbjs-fail-without-any-warning.786435/page-3#post-28143091
https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...s-wanted-about-lower-ball-joint-bolts.772506/

 

You can DIY it, not particularly challenging, and $3k is way way too much for that job if you decide to have a shop do it

 

Thank you, I'm skeptical of all auto shops, I have horror stories I'll save for another time LOL. Before I pull the trigger on anything I'm going to have a closer look now than I know a little about these suspensions (keeping in mind "a little bit of knowledge is dangerous.") I was able to watch him through the shop window in the waiting room, a bit like watching a baby through the glass lol . . . and saw what he was doing to check the ball joints. He basically put it on the rack and worked a crow bar between the ball joints and knuckles looking for play.

I've seen videos of changing out the bushings, it looks like a lot of work and considering the cost of bushings to the cost of an entire arm with busings installed it might be to my advantage to just change out the arms. Still wondering about the MOOG arms though, and if it will muck up the OEM handling characteristics (camber/caster, etc.)

 

So with the lower ball joint, use this as a reference -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bu2rQMxXV2M

For lower control arms, take a look here:
https://adventuretaco.com/guide/ste...ement-on-a-1st-gen-tacoma-or-3rd-gen-4runner/

I can't speak to MOOG arms. Have never used them. I am currently on SPC UCAs (because of the lift and tires). I like the SPCs and alignment tech is able to dial it in without issues.

Here is some additional info (also by the good ol' adventuretaco dude) -

 

Yeah that ball joint test was exactly what I had planned! Good to know I'm on the right page. I see some conflicting info on the OEM ball joints, but will most likely go strictly OEM on them and tie rod ends as well. That quoted thread, been there and one of the reasons I'm thinking about the MOOG's. I can get a pair right now for $215, OEM's go from $280 and up - for one side.

 

What conflicting info did you come across?

 

I couldn't show you but like I said, digesting many posts and videos. Somewhere here on TW are a couple threads who claim they replaced their ball joints with OEM ball joints and they failed rather quickly, in one case 35K miles. I'm thinking it may have been a one-off or install error, not sure. Overall I'm gathering to go OEM on ball joints unless you're doing a lift.

 

A lot of people use the Moog Lower Control arms, there shouldn’t be an issue with them, but make sure to only use the OEM Ball joints, the OEM LBJs are about $200-250 for the set, and take about 30 min to swap, get the pack with new bolts when you purchase them

I will second Adventure Taco, he has a series on changing the bushings in the Lower Control arm and goes through your different options

 

I'd get a 2nd opinion that you actually need new LCAs. You'd really have needed to do something major to eff them up. Bushings, now that's a different story.
UCAs should not need to be replaced unless you want to upgrade for lift/travel purposes.

Moog as a brand I haven't had great luck with, but no comment on the LCAs in specific.

 

I suspect what he needs is bushings for the LCA, and as Toyota doesn’t sell replacement bushings they told him he needs new LCAs. Could also go aftermarket bushings, but you’d need access to a press. Agree on Moog in general, but for this application it’s likely fine. Just depends on which direction OP wants to go

 

You 100% do not need a press

 

Right, I imagine they recommended U/L CA's because removing and pressing in new bushings would add to labor time and charges, which is why I'm considering just replacing the arms.

I've seen a couple videos using the bottle jack method, you put the bottle jack in the yoke and heat up the housing, slowly expand the bottle jack - slowly so you don't distort the control arm - until it begins to pop out. I've seen others burn out the rubber and break out the bushing. Both sound like a lot more work than replacing the arm with bushings already installed. :-D

 

I replaced lca on my 2003 with new oem Toyota ones. About 250$ a piece. Had about 300000 on stock ones they were pretty bad

 

I don't have much faith in the quality and specifically the life span of Moog parts. I personally have had replacement Moog u-joints that all failed within a year (2 on the rear drive shaft), and I had to replace them with OEM parts. I have a friend who went the easy route and replaced the whole LCA to replace just the bushings, only lasted two years before I ended up buying whole new OEM arms.

I myself, replaced the lower bushings with the Whiteline products, and the uppers with ES. The ES bushings are actually VERY easy to install. You burn the old bushings out, but leave the metal jacket in the arms, and push the new bushing in. "Burn the old bushing out" really means, heat the bushing up so it's moveable (around 350 degrees on my laser thermometer), and push it out. I believe the strong flex products are similar.

 

I replaced my LCA bushings with MOOG ones a while back and they failed in 3 weeks, may have been install error [can't remember if I torqued the cam bolts while the truck was still on jack stands or not]. Afterwards I sprung for OEM Toyota ones to the tune of $80/piece [x 4 bushings]. This was to replace the original OEM LCA bushings at 270k. That being said, these trucks are as great as they are because of the OEM-quality parts they are made up of. Control arms, control arm bushings [upper & lower], ball joints [upper & lower] are all critical components to the front suspension, and I'd advocate spending the extra money for OEM Toyota quality every time. Anyone who's held aftermarket and OEM versions of these parts in hand, can see the clearly superior quality of the OEM parts. Just my $0.02.

"Buy once, cry once" - anonymous TW user.

 

This is all very helpful and thank you all . . . guess I should go OEM on everything and holy cow that is outta my budget (boo fn hoo waa fn waa . . . )

Has anyone had bad experiences with TRD shop, or can recommend a better OEM vendor? I'm still digging around looking for a price I can afford for OEM parts. The average cost of a lower control arm is around $350, yikes, but TRD shop has them for just over $200. Their ball joints and bushings appear a lot less costly too, $130 for lowers. I guess I should bite the bullet, do the work and just replace the bushings, however . . .

One of the things I keep coming back to with auto diagnosis is "what if they're wrong?" The original problem is a slight pull to the right - no one who's looked at it has suggested it, but what if I have a slightly bent CA? I guess the only way to know would be to buy new CA's. What would really suck is going through replacing the bushings and still having the problem.

Another question, I went through the entire chapter on suspension in the Haynes manual, and they suggest a similar method of checking ball joints but they move the tire instead of a crow bar directly on the knuckle. The manual shows an allowed 2.3mm of play, does that sound right? I'm gathering that there should be zero play when lifting the steering system at the ball joint.

 

1.) I'd check out McGeorge Toyota for OEM parts. There prices tend to be about as low as you'll find for OEM stuff. Can't speak to TRD shop, never used them.

2.) What makes you believe your control arm is bent? Sorry if I missed that part. It'd take a pretty huge impact directly to the control arm for that to happen in my opinion. I'd strongly consider buying just the 4 LCA bushings (OEM), and doing them yourself, to save loads of money. Here's a great how-to video on that:

https://youtu.be/kmaZNBp1gZM

3.) My understanding is zero play, but I know the Toyota FSM specifies a VERY small amount is acceptable. I'd say if you can see the play with your naked eye, it's too much.

 

I just went back to your original post. The most important thing you can do is replace your lower ball joints. You can take your time and do your research on the other stuff, but the LBJs. Just replace them with OEM parts ASAP.

"A slight pull to the right" could be anything in the front end. It's extremely unlikely that your control arms are bent. You would have had to have a pretty serious impact, and you would remember it.

What's the service history of the truck? Is the steering rack original, or replaced? There was a member last week who had the rack replaced, and the shop doing the work hadn't centered the new rack. Original front brake calipers? A sticky caliper could pull.

Address the lower ball joints. Then figure out the rest.

 

I just want to echo what @Andy01DblCabTacoma said. There's so many things that can cause a pull in your steering, and just about every one of them is far more likely suspect than a bent lower control arm.