Transmission-Hesitant/sluggish operation

Hi all,
Was wondering if I could get some input on my Tranny performance issue.

Problem: When accelerating from a dead stop or while at a low, mid or highway speed I decelerate, then accelerate the tranny seems to be hesitant/sluggish, like its not engaging but then after a second or two..sometimes a few seconds it finally operates normally. It doesn't happen 100% of the time, but then it seems to happen 50% of the time. this started about a year or so ago,but very light or once in a while but recently its on a daily basis.

My testing or notices: I've tried to troubleshoot this and here is what I noticed.
Yes: Fluid is full w/ Toyota genuine ATF type T-IV, I changed filter and fluid @ around 110,000 miles (I know it doesn't need changing but did it anyway, this was around 2010-2011).

During the first drive of the day, in the morning to work (about 15 miles) everything works fine. but then in the afternoon coming home is when it really acts up. Seems when things are cooler or not warmed up yet its shifts fine.

@ low,mid or highway speeds when I decelerated then accelerated and it took a little more than i expected for it to come around I tapped the brake and it snapped back to normal operation.

when It was hesitant(at low,mid,or highway speeds), of course naturally I gave it more gas ,but it didn't seem to matter(RPM's didn't go up either,,that seemed strange as well), eventually it operated normally again after a few longer seconds.

My Past experience: I had a 94' Toy Truck 4WD,V-6 w/ around 185,000 miles that did almost exactly the same things, it got so bad driving that at times it stalled out and I had to pull off to the side of the rode and put it in Park and turn it off then start it back up...then all was good. I found out it was the Vehicle speed sensor (VSS).. that cured the problem. So I'm thinking its time to change this one out, but looks like it has 2 of them. I don't believe the Tranny has any mechanical issues.

What I have: My tranny is Model# 30-40LE,35000-3G330,2003 prerunner w/204,000 miles, seems I have 2 speed sensors? (my '94 only had one) I have 1 on driverside @ tail assy. 2 wired, that only says "TOYOTA AISIN", this is rockauto AIRTEX/WELLS 5S4770 {#8941150010, SU5526}. The Pass.side @ tail Assy has a 3 wired, PN 09408D02 and its equivalent rockauto part is STANDARD MOTOR PRODUCTS SC414 {#8318124070}

From my problems I have, would you say it is the sensor(s)? Thanks all for your help

 

... 89 views and nobody.. well I guess nobody ever had this problem or I was incoherent and didn't explain it in laymen's terms (I didn't make sense) . So, yesterday I pulled off both sensors, the Drivers side I just sprayed with electrical cleaner and used a 00000 steel wool over the metal contact point. The Pass. side w/ gear: I pulled out the gears and removed the cover (to clean the contact point on the inside of cover), pulled out the short metal pin/w spring and the disk w/washer. Sprayed them down and took the steel wool to them. I had a small amount of gray grease type goo and just a little micro amount of metal shavings, that was attached to the disk. I think the disk is magnetized. As far as the goo, I cleaned it all out, not sure if it was lube grease or 15 yrs and 204,000 miles of tranny gear wearage. The splined gear shaft and inside cover contacts were lubed with tranny oil(I think its suppose to be like that cause there was no seal to prevent it from coming thru).But anyways, with a short test drive yesterday and the drive into work today the tranny seems to shift more "crisper and sharper" like a shift kit. But we'll see(fingers crossed), usually this cleaning is only temporary and I'll eventually have to change them out.

 

Nice. What grease goo you used?

 

Hi Tony,
No, i was just making a comment about what i found inside the sensor, saying it looked like some sort of gray grease, sometimes components come pre-lubed. But in this case i think it was very fine metal shavings which got into the sensor. This is something common that you would find stuck on your metallic drain plug, say in your tranny pan or in your oil pan. its a grayish sludge..very small amounts are ok, its metal wearing together with other metals that make contact ( rubbing,meshing,etc. ) and after a while it produces this gray sludge..like i say, its common and ok in very small amounts but when you see large shavings, teeth from a gear or larger pieces of metal in your pans,its not a good sign. So i think in my case this " metal goo" threw off the readings of the sensor to make the tranny act eratic.

 

Well, no change, but what I did find out thru trouble shooting was:
Removing and cleaning the VSS, first drive of the day, pulling the + battery cable for 30 minutes plus, then re-connecting, to reset the computer or tapping the brakes while driving at any speed temporarily makes it all good. So I guess I may be due for a new VSS, hate to think I might be wasting $175 if it isn't the VSS.
New note: Correct me if i'm wrong, but the Check engine light came on this morning while driving into work. Recently this happened about a month ago. Now, what I understand is that when the CEL comes on, its for emission related components only. And by hooking up a OBD II scanner, it wont tell me anything related to the VSS. Over the last couple months its been very hot and humid. The CEL light came on last month so I took the fuel cap off, so the tank could breathe and then put the cap back on, the CEL went off the last time I did this and I just took it off a while ago, so I"ll see as I go home today if it goes off. I don't think this is related the VSS. This also happened to my wifes 2009 Mazda3 about a month ago. CEL light came on, took off the cap(just filled up the night before as well), after about 5 miles of driving the CEL went off.

 

Pull the code. OBDII does any sensor that feeds the ECU.

It is not emissions only.

 

Bill, thanks for clearing that up. Good ole' Hawaii (the only state) prevents the likes of autozone,O'reillys,etc from doing a free OBD check. While in Arizona last month I went crazy in Harbor freight and spent about $500 ($300 was for the Badlands winch for the Taco) I did see the OBD2's but didn't get one. I'm seeing the
ZR4 OBD2 Code Reader Zurich- item#63808 for $45 and also the other ones. I would guess this one would be good enough for my needs. All the Zurich brands @ H.F. seem to have good reviews.

 

What's the logic for that? Forcing folks to use a pay for service shop?

Be careful, you'll not be allowed to pump your own gas soon.

 

Hawaii, How's it Bra? I was stationed at Pearl in the 80's.

The only thing that comes to mind when you step on the brake is the Torque Converter might be unlocking. So maybe a problem with the Torque Converter switching in and out?

 

Bill, Yep! exactly. my local politicians hard at work, keepin' me safe from unscrupulous non ASE techs (aka autozone,O'reillys,etc). back in 04' I was looking at new vehicles and the local main new car dealerships (owned by about a half hand full of individuals) were and still are notorious for...well you know what I mean. So I went online and found much better deals, even with the shipping to HI. I went to the DMV to see what it takes to do this, 1)out of state title release from financial institution (where u getting ur loan from) and a few other things, but the lady said I had to be the registered owner for last the previous yr. She said the dealerships lobbied the state to make it against state law to buy a new vehicle from out of state. This is what I remember and i'm sure i'm probably leaving out some details. Yea, I see pump your own gas going away too. I experienced this in Oregon a few years ago when I started pumping my own gas the attendant got all upset about that. Vehicle registration went up (weight tax portion) 33% this year. Taco is up to $365 a yr now. Gotta find some way to fund this Rail to no where.

Hey Cruisedon,
MMM...didn't think about the torque converter. I wonder if the VSS controls the T.C. or is there a T.C. switch that goes to the ECU????

I'll probably just get the OBD2 from H.F. and see what it can tell me.

 

ordered the Zurich ZR4 OBD2 Code Reader last night from H.F. CEL was still on yesterday going home, this morning it was off coming in.

 

ok, I'm back, finally got my Zurich ZR4 OBDII tester from H.F. today and just finished the scan. AND the winner is......P0976 (SHIFT SOLINOID B CONTROL CIRCUT LOW). i did a quick search for the P0976 DTC and noticed 8 articles here on T.W. for it and I'm skimming through them to decipher what i need to do. I also have my FSM manual that i'll look at to. Getting late and just thought i would post this to see how you guys tackled this....Thanks all!

 

I'd love to see a step by step pictorial...

 

i did some searching for A340E info and saw GEARCRUNCHER had put out some pages out of the FSM on the tranny itself and i found a little bit on the Shift Solenoid B, but could tell the exact location of it if i were to drop my pan. Looks like Shift Solenoid A is right next to it. its a little hard searching my saved online FSM , i cant really get to a good page of it that shows the valvebody w/ the solenoids. Does anyone have a good page of it along with maybe the OEM Part number i should get. also i found more on mine: P0976 (SHIFT SOLINOID B CONTROL CIRCUT LOW) shift solenoid valve S2. i searched rock auto and couldnt really tell which one that was, but then they came in a set sometimes. Is it better to replace them in a set rather than 1 ea? like
SHIFT SOLINOID B CONTROL CIRCUT LOW shift solenoid valve S2 and SHIFT SOLINOID A CONTROL CIRCUT LOW) shift solenoid valve S1. Crap i think im getting confused

 

i did some searching for A340E info and saw GEARCRUNCHER had put out some pages out of the FSM on the tranny itself and i found a little bit on the Shift Solenoid B, but could tell the exact location of it if i were to drop my pan. Looks like Shift Solenoid A is right next to it. its a little hard searching my saved online FSM , i cant really get to a good page of it that shows the valvebody w/ the solenoids. Does anyone have a good page of it along with maybe the OEM Part number i should get. also i found more on mine: P0976 (SHIFT SOLINOID B CONTROL CIRCUT LOW) shift solenoid valve S2. i searched rock auto and couldnt really tell which one that was, but then they came in a set sometimes. Is it better to replace them in a set rather than 1 ea? like
SHIFT SOLINOID B CONTROL CIRCUT LOW shift solenoid valve S2 and SHIFT SOLINOID A CONTROL CIRCUT LOW) shift solenoid valve S1. Crap i think im getting confused

 

tapping the brakes dis-engages the lock up convertor, if so equipped.

 

follow up for parts: the local Toyota parts guy gave me the parts list for the valvebody and looks like the one I need is PN 35290,couldnt find a google search on who makes this. Thru my nephews(hes a tranny mech) distributor (Transtar) I got a 2 pc solenoid kit. Its Rostra 52-0230. My FSM pic of the solenoids vs the Parts list solenoids are different. The ones I ordered look like the FSM pics. Man, what a headache, well I guess i'll see what i'm getting in a few days.

 

man-O-man...what a ride its been. After installing the universal Rostra 52-0230 solenoids, i still had the same but slightly differenct problems. heres the skinny of events:
1)The day after installing them the check engine came on for the same P0976 code and later started to hesitate going from second gear to 3rd.
2) first week in Oct, had enough of this. search the Rostra catalog again and came across the same set of solenoids that i had orignally asked for but this particular distributor was out of: 52-0204 (OEM toyota pn 85240-22080),(this is what was in my toyota parts list as a PN) universal bracket set. 52-0448 is the same OEM soleniod kit but with OEM brackets. Found another vendor who only had the universal set.
3) upon ordering the second set of soleniods i returned the first set...a day before the new set came(later to have been a bad move)
4) Oct 15th-dropped the pan for the 3rd time already and found the new set didnt come with a dual bracket like the first set had.. More pissed now, i had to reinstall the original solenoids and put the pan back on and fill with oil. Called the Rostra direct and told them the problem and they sent me the dual bracket PN 52-9002-00-01..2 1/2 weeks later i got the bracket(should have waited to return the old set until after i got the new set,,,could have used that bracket)
5)Nov 4th- finally got the solenoids installed. the transmission acts and performs much better, but still is hesitate going from second gear to 3rd(20-30% of the time).
6)today-called my nephew again(Tranny Mech). in the very beginning he said that it may have been a mechanical problem with the gears slipping. But after all this he said at times that troubleshooting doesnt work he said throw a can of Seafoam in it. he said sometimes it works and cures the problem cause i may have a sticky valve(s) preventing it from fully engaging into the 3rd gear..he said try it!!! wouldnt hurt cause, theres really nothing left to do but a rebuild. he said the naptha blend would lube and free up moving componets. the hesitant only occurs from a dead stop and turning at an intersection, a straight take off is fine, and i noticed if i do turn, and i do it at a low grauate increase of speed it seems to be ok, via a immediate increase in accelaration from a dead stop where the hesitation occurs.
7) WHEW!! what a trouble shooting adventure i"ve had. Anyone ever try the Seafoam in there Tranny's?

Notes learned: Toyota service manual on trouble shooting the soleniods states the OHMS must be between 11-15
1)My original OEM set was at 13.7 OHMS(still should have been good right!)
2)First set of universal soleniods Rostra PN 52-0230 was stated to be at 12 OHMs(per Rostra catalog) but when i tested them after i had run them was at 17.3 OHM
3) Second set of Soleniods currently installed Rostra PN 52-0204 (OEM toyota pn 85240-22080) was stated to be at 12 OHMs(per Rostra catalog)was tested before installation at 12.6 OHMs