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3rd Gen Traction Control Modes Explained

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016+)' started by Doggman, Jan 25, 2018.

  1. Sep 3, 2020 at 4:08 PM
    #381
    gudujarlson

    gudujarlson Well-Known Member

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    The original post suggests that TRAC is enabled in 4lo on a SR/SR5/TRD Sport/Limited, but I do not think that is the case. I never heard the ABS brakes operate in 4lo (without the brake pedal being applied) on my 2016 SR5. I did however notice it when in 4hi. I have a 2020 OR now, so I cannot confirm it.

    I am referring to this section:

    SR/SR5/TRD Sport/Limited
    7. 4Lo TRAC ON and VSC OFF.
    8. 4Lo TRAC OFF and VSC OFF
     
  2. Sep 3, 2020 at 4:45 PM
    #382
    BigWhiteTRD

    BigWhiteTRD Official thread killer (only crickets remain)

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    Extensive team testing did indicate SR/SR5/Sport/Limited does have TRAC in 4lo (by default), as shown by the posts in this thread.
    I can't verify that from personal experience (OR model here).

    Start reading thru this older thread for some verification
    https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...s-non-trd-offroad.437814/page-8#post-16945563
     
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  3. Sep 3, 2020 at 5:02 PM
    #383
    gudujarlson

    gudujarlson Well-Known Member

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    That video is fairly convincing. I know I tended to disable TRAC/VSC with the long push every time I wanted to have fun, but I don't remember having to do it in 4lo. I remember 4lo defaulting everything to off. Maybe I wasn't observant enough, my memory fails me, or I had an oddball 2016 SR5. I wish I had an SR5 to go test with again.
     
  4. Sep 5, 2020 at 10:07 AM
    #384
    MtnFisher

    MtnFisher Well-Known Member

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    VSCTRAC.jpg
     
  5. Nov 30, 2020 at 1:56 PM
    #385
    RmikeD

    RmikeD Well-Known Member

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    The first post of this thread implies MTS + Crawl Control is a viable operating Mode. With a 3rd Gen Tacoma TRDOR with automatic transmission, this is not possible. What was the author intending to convey? He seems otherwise very knowledgeable. I just want to confirm my understanding of the traction control logic. Also, it is my understanding that with MTS + locked rear diff, the brake modulated traction control still applies to the front axle, but not to the rear above 3 mph. Meaning you get good traction up front, limiting slip using brakes with the open diff, but the rear diff is locked implying no relative slip between the 2 rear wheels. Thanks in advance
     
  6. Nov 30, 2020 at 2:20 PM
    #386
    ShimStack

    ShimStack Well-Known Member

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    MTS runs simultaneous with crawl control. Or think of it as crawl control includes MTS functionality inside of its own speed control functionality.

    Yes MTS operates across the front axle when the rear diff is locked.
     
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  7. Nov 30, 2020 at 2:31 PM
    #387
    RmikeD

    RmikeD Well-Known Member

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    Ok. But the Manual says MTS can only be operated with Crawl Control OFF. I understand that when in Crawl Control it includes the wheel limiting slip of the brake induced traction control. So in a way Crawl Mode includes the MTS feature. However, MTS alone allows you to select the amount of slip allowed before the brake induced slip control operates. Using the knob there are 5 selectable values. That same knob is essentially the speed control (cruise control if you will) for crawl mode. You can’t actually turn on MTS and Crawl using the 2 push buttons. If I hit one of the buttons , say Crawl, while in MTS, the instrument panel message says that mode is not selectable, I’m almost sure. Have you ever been able to select both MTS and Crawl simulataneosly?
     
  8. Nov 30, 2020 at 2:38 PM
    #388
    RmikeD

    RmikeD Well-Known Member

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    CC may operate with MTS functionality BUT it must assume some allowed (pre-programmed slip) associated with each speed on the 5 position knob. Again, when in MTS mode the 5 selections proceed from position 1 Mud (allowing much slip before intervening with brakes) To position 5 rocks not permitting much slip before intervening with brakes. When in Crawl mode the selections are just speed with 1 being slowest and 5 being fastest. You can’t select a slip limit (1-5) while in Crawl, only the speed at which you crawl. I’m guessing the permitted slip in Crawl is very low , perhaps the least slip associated with Rock setting (5)? I’m not sure. Seems to me when in crawl there would be very little sip desired.
     
  9. Nov 30, 2020 at 2:50 PM
    #389
    Matt Sierra

    Matt Sierra Well-Known Member

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    I wish they made it this clear in the manual, thanks guys!
     
  10. Nov 30, 2020 at 2:52 PM
    #390
    ShimStack

    ShimStack Well-Known Member

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    If we want to get technical then technically MTS is an adjustable slip version of A-TRAC and CC includes A-TRAC functionality embedded. A-TRAC is the base system created by Toyota that all these 4LO traction control systems are specific tunes of.
     
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  11. Nov 30, 2020 at 2:58 PM
    #391
    RmikeD

    RmikeD Well-Known Member

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    ShimStack, I studied this system in February 2016 when I got my TRDOR. My notes say “MTS is adjustable slip version of ATRAC”. I came to the conclusion comparing the Gen 3 Auto Trans version to the Gen 2 with ATRAC. What I am not sure about is how much slip Crawl Mode permits before using brakes to limit wheel spin. As I explained above it is most likely the slip permitted in the Rock setting of MTS (least amount of slip). It has to work on rocks and in mud it would still work. What do you think?
     
  12. Nov 30, 2020 at 3:05 PM
    #392
    BigWhiteTRD

    BigWhiteTRD Official thread killer (only crickets remain)

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    Try reading this post
    https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...l-modes-explained.530695/page-7#post-17023370

    I attempted to test MTS vs CC (with techstream). Read the post for more detail...
     
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  13. Nov 30, 2020 at 3:09 PM
    #393
    ShimStack

    ShimStack Well-Known Member

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    That I don't know. But if I was forced to guess I'd say CC slip ratio adjusts a little based on speed selection and correlates with the chart in the manual. Notice the CC speed chart correlates to a terrain and those terrains correlate to the MTS settings. This is my guess.

    If I was curious and owned an auto I'd check the traction control states via Techstream while operating CC and see if they show any adjustment with CC speed. If that didn't shed light I'd log wheel speeds and brake activity to figure out what slip ratios cause braking intervention and if that changes with the CC set speed.

    MTS.jpg
    CC.jpg
     
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  14. Nov 30, 2020 at 3:26 PM
    #394
    BigWhiteTRD

    BigWhiteTRD Official thread killer (only crickets remain)

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    As you say, need to do full logs to learn more.


    I didn't research enough of the techstream data to know if there really is a difference.
    However the computer knows (and remembers) if you have MTS on when you turn on CC.

    (Deleted double post - whoops)
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2020
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  15. Nov 30, 2020 at 3:30 PM
    #395
    RmikeD

    RmikeD Well-Known Member

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    I would say the Owners Manual implies the Crawl permitted slip is in the reverse order of the MTS selections: In Crawl-Rock it permits low slip which would be the highest MTS setting, In Crawl-Mud/Sand it allows more slip as in the lowest MTS setting. My original comment was referring to the MTS + Crawl reference. After our discussion here, it seems even though you can’t select the MTS button while Crawl selected OR Crawl button while MTS selected, the two are intertwined. When in MTS mode the truck speed is controlled by the transmission selection (D,4,3,2,1) and gas pedal while when in Crawl Mode the truck speed is controlled by the 5 position knob. It appears Crawl has pre-selected permitted slip values in line with conditions described by the MTS/Crawl selection knob.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2020
  16. Nov 30, 2020 at 3:44 PM
    #396
    ShimStack

    ShimStack Well-Known Member

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    Let's log!! :D

    SIU400_Pic.jpg
     
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  17. Nov 30, 2020 at 3:54 PM
    #397
    BigWhiteTRD

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  18. Nov 30, 2020 at 3:59 PM
    #398
    RmikeD

    RmikeD Well-Known Member

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    You guys look pretty serious with interface capability with truck computer. I would interested in what you find out.
     
  19. Nov 30, 2020 at 4:19 PM
    #399
    ShimStack

    ShimStack Well-Known Member

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    Good 'ol MTS! Pretty familiar with some of their bigger motorsports stuff. There's so much capability and capacity available across the board now it's great. MTS, NI, McLaren, MoTeC, and the still hanging around Cosworth Pi. And that's just the stuff I've dealt with.
     
  20. Dec 26, 2020 at 12:01 PM
    #400
    tkay2009

    tkay2009 New Member

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    I have read through this thread and it is still confusing. I am a new '21 TRD OR 4x4 owner, and want to know what these should be set at for the most fuel-effieicient "normal" 2WD driving? Thanks in advance!
     

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