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3rd Gen Traction Control Modes Explained

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016-2023)' started by Doggman, Jan 25, 2018.

  1. Jan 27, 2018 at 3:55 PM
    #61
    shakerhood

    shakerhood Well-Known Member

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    AWD and 4x4 are totally different systems, Apple's to Oranges.
     
  2. Jan 27, 2018 at 4:14 PM
    #62
    splitbolt

    splitbolt Voodoo Witch Doctor

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    TRAC is a traction aid used to limit slip using engine management and brakes.
    A-TRAC is a traction aid used to match wheel speed side-to-side using brakes.
    Torque vectoring is more of a steering aid used to distribute torque side-to-side via computer-controlled clutch packs on the differential.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
  3. Jan 27, 2018 at 4:21 PM
    #63
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    Those other replies plus, most of what we see on the 3rd Gens existed on the 2nd Gens. None of this is in response to any other brand, just killer design.
     
  4. Jan 27, 2018 at 4:34 PM
    #64
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    I finally found a spot to test on a loading dock ramp! It was steeper than ideal and I didn't have a spotter, so I couldn't test any engine limiting inputs.

    IMG_20180127_151104.jpg

    I'll post up the updated file in a while .
     
  5. Jan 27, 2018 at 5:02 PM
    #65
    Tacomavkk

    Tacomavkk Well-Known Member

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    I’m very aware of 4wd vd awd. I’ve owned a 4Runner, 2 Audi’s and a Subaru. However, I’m wondering about the traction benefits of torque vectoring over braking based traction control.
     
  6. Jan 27, 2018 at 5:05 PM
    #66
    Tacomavkk

    Tacomavkk Well-Known Member

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    Right, but has anyone actually compared one to the other in terms of traction? I wonder if applying torque mechanically aids or detracts in traction vs reducing engine power and braking.
     
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
  7. Jan 27, 2018 at 5:09 PM
    #67
    Tacomavkk

    Tacomavkk Well-Known Member

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    True, but there wasn’t trac in 4wd low on 2nd gen nontrd unless I misunderstood the earlier thread?
     
  8. Jan 27, 2018 at 5:35 PM
    #68
    splitbolt

    splitbolt Voodoo Witch Doctor

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    I would imagine torque vectoring relies on steering angle and wheel speed sensors for control. I think a more oranges to lemons comparison would be VSC vs torque vectoring.
    Torque vectoring wouldn't do much good without steering angle input. I'm sure the Ridgeline has other systems to aid in that regard. Those are what you need to compare to TRAC and A-TRAC.
     
    Tacomavkk[QUOTED] likes this.
  9. Jan 27, 2018 at 6:31 PM
    #69
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    I am sorry that I didn't notice earlier. My Sport table was the same as the OR. I have it fixed to agree with what I found.

    Attached is the updated file. @Doggman, can you please update the first post? Thanks!

    When I get a spotter or a good hill climb, I will update it again, esp about any engine limitations.

    BTW, for any locals, here is where I found that dock ramp:
    https://goo.gl/maps/WtyjqJBN1pr

    As noted above, the sides are steep.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
  10. Jan 27, 2018 at 6:39 PM
    #70
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    I think it was said that the 2012s through 2015s got some TRAC functions?
     
  11. Jan 27, 2018 at 6:42 PM
    #71
    Topanga Taco

    Topanga Taco BUZZING NITRO

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    I think an edit has to be made for 4LO. It’s not just a lsd, but a strong lsd like the 2WD cell has.
     
  12. Jan 27, 2018 at 7:35 PM
    #72
    tonered

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    I am sorry, but I can't yet confirm that. There was certainly no delay in forward motion each time I tested it. I just don't know if it is a full lock.

    I do feel that I could have bulled up that loading dock if I let it.

    Let me put it this way. I associate Strong LSD with A-TRAC and LSD with TRAC.

    Whatever is going on, I have lost any desire for a mechanical locker for what I want to use the Taco for.
     
  13. Jan 27, 2018 at 7:36 PM
    #73
    Topanga Taco

    Topanga Taco BUZZING NITRO

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    Find a very steep hill to climb.
     
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  14. Jan 27, 2018 at 7:43 PM
    #74
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    Agreed. The problem in this area is that the nearest open offroad area is an hour in any direction and this time of year most are closed for winter sports only. It's the same crappy story for good twisties for motorcycles. An hour of either slab, traffic lights, or slow ass cars to get to the good stuff. The really good stuff is out of state.

    I am heading out for some wheeling and camping in the middle of February. That will hopefully be the next chance to really sort out the modes while climbing.
     
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  15. Jan 27, 2018 at 7:50 PM
    #75
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    Here's a pic of the side slope:

    IMG_20180127_151209.jpg

    Looks like a bit less than 45deg. I would have liked a shallow 30deg or so to goof off by myself.
     
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  16. Jan 28, 2018 at 5:53 AM
    #76
    BigWhiteTRD

    BigWhiteTRD Official thread killer (only crickets remain)

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    Thank you for the diligence.
    Can you update the v106 file (here https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/3rd-gen-traction-control-modes-explained.530695/#post-16989891) And label and rename 107 and upload.

    Just to verify, in 4hi quick press you did see brake firing for lsd? My data showed open diff and 'TRAC-OFF' for this condition (in OR auto). (I am on phone, so errors in data analysis much more likely for me.) Wish we could have had a first post that 4 or 5 of us could edit for latest data...
     
  17. Jan 28, 2018 at 5:58 AM
    #77
    BigWhiteTRD

    BigWhiteTRD Official thread killer (only crickets remain)

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    Cool, how did you find? Dont work for boeing do you?
     
  18. Jan 28, 2018 at 7:11 AM
    #78
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    Will do!

    4Hi for mine is a that way, backwards from the OR. I did that test a couple times to verify the light was flashing. It didn't hesitate and moved along just like the 4Lo default.

    I was driving around all the hilly business parks that I knew off. I did work for Boeing after college, but I wasn't there long. I needed a smaller company. I'm still in aerospace.
     
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  19. Jan 28, 2018 at 7:15 AM
    #79
    BigWhiteTRD

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    Cool
    We definitely have updates to make then. Plot thickens. Love it.

    Stress Analyst here. Primarily Part 23 expertise. Metallc stress analysis, test, and MRB for the most part...
     
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  20. Jan 28, 2018 at 7:24 AM
    #80
    tonered

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    I'm there with you!

    I started in design but jumped to stress when I left. Mainly Part 25, but we take on Parts 23, 27, and 29 from time to time. We're mostly secondary structure but are doing antenna FEMs, ferry tank approvals, and VIP interior completions. On the side, we are trying to get some non-structural 3D printed parts certified.

    Sometimes, it is way too many pokers in the fire!
     
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