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A little Gas is a good thing...

Discussion in 'Technical Chat' started by NVR_QUIT, Dec 10, 2007.

  1. Dec 10, 2007 at 3:45 PM
    #1
    NVR_QUIT

    NVR_QUIT [OP] My goodness, my Guinness!

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    Hey gents!

    While at work yestrday my mother (yes good'ol mom) sent me some tips she got from the state about filling up at the pump. So if you want to get a bit more for your dollar; listen up and pay attention.

    I don't remember the exact reason behind everything, but I'll let you know what you need to know...

    :D Always fill your vehicle up during cold hours. if it be in the morning or at night, make sure it's colder. The reason being is as the day gets warmer pressure builds up in the underground tanks and in your fuel tank. This pressure isn't always realesed and sometimes as you filling it, you don't get to add as much fuel to the tank.

    :D When fueling up, he notched settings on the pump usually have one or two speeds. Always use the slowest speed. The reason is something to do with the vapors getting over recycled yadda yadda yadda... Always fill it up with the slowest setting.

    :D If you see the fuel trucks are beginning to restock the tanks or have just finished, AVOID that gas station. The tanks underneath have a floating roof. This roof sinks as the tanks empty. As the trucks re-fill the tanks sediment at the bottom (sand, rocks, etc...) gets mixed in the fuel and is terrible for your engine.

    :D Last, Don't let your tank go past 1/4... One, it's back for you fuel pump as it struggles a little more to suck fuel up and second... Has anyone ever noticed how when you first fill up, it takes FOREVER to put a dent in the fuel meter. But the lower it gets, the faster it burns fuel. Next thing you know you're filling up again. Well, this too has something to do with vapors. Just trust me on it...


    :eek: I'm sorry this is soooo informal and not backed with precise facts. Just trust me on this stuff... I'm getting ready to go for a run then a swim, so I was just trying to spread the word as quickly as poissible

    V/R Abe
     
  2. Dec 10, 2007 at 4:09 PM
    #2
    Toy4Life

    Toy4Life 668: The Neighbor of the Beast

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    Thanks NVR, good to know. I'll be paying attention to those things next time I fill up.
     
  3. Dec 10, 2007 at 4:13 PM
    #3
    concrete jedi

    concrete jedi Well-Known Member

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    Message received, some great intel in times of pinching the penny. :D
     
  4. Dec 10, 2007 at 4:51 PM
    #4
    gdawg25

    gdawg25 Zoom-Zoom

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    Well, don't have to worry about that here. Every second of everly day is as cold as any other second of anyother day during the winter.
     
  5. Dec 10, 2007 at 4:55 PM
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    98yota

    98yota Mean Green Machine

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    plus if you are at a gas station where you have to lift that thing up after you lift the nozzle, when you get done fueling, push that thing down and hold the nozzle in your gas tank, thats about .10+ more cents of gas, not much but anything is good these days lol
     
  6. Dec 10, 2007 at 5:27 PM
    #6
    ForeRunner

    ForeRunner Scotch before noon. Moderator

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    I'm not going to call bs yet but there are some things that sound a little fishy.

    The reason I say this is I found another variant on Snopes


    It seems as it gets passed around it changes
     
  7. Dec 11, 2007 at 5:15 AM
    #7
    beondwacko

    beondwacko Well-Known Member

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    Ummm,,,, I call bullshit on this one!

    Gas pumps are metered and regulated. The volume of fuel is strictly controled and measured yearly in most states by the department of weights and measures.

    What is true is this. It is better to fill up in the morning because the fuel stored in the underground tanks will be cooler than in the height of the day. The cooler the fuel, the more DENSE it will be. This has been proven by various tests by consumer groups over the years and it has been proven that in terms of volume, there can be a difference of a few percent especially in the summer time.



    Ummmm,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, bullshit again.

    Fuel senders ( what sends a signal to your gas gauge ) are never exact. Your owners manual will tell you that the gas gauge shows APPROXIMATELY how much fuel remains, not exactly. Now because not all fuel tanks are flat sided, flat bottomed in shape, some taper in places to fit under the vehicle, there will be times that one portion of the tank is consumed more quickly than other times. I don't think that the fuel senders are calibrated as such. They read a static level of fuel, not the volume contained in the tank. In order to measure the volume in the tank, they would have to take the weight of the fuel into account for an accurate measurement. It has nothing to do with fuel vapor. As for the fuel pump portion of this,,,,,,,,, again,,,,,,,, Bullpoopy.
    Most all FI vehicles use a submersable intank fuel pump. This statement sounds as if it were made way back when engines used mechanical fuel pumps attached or driven off the engine itself. If that were the case today, I'd agree with that statement, but that's just not how it is in modern times.

    I'm not trying to come off as a pompus ass but, those quotes just aren't true.
     
  8. Dec 11, 2007 at 7:46 AM
    #8
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    Aw man, i hate you healthy types! Always showing off your abs..."hey look at me! I DONT have scars from a tripple bypass surgery all over my chest and a pig valve in my heart!" Whatever dude, i'm gonna go eat a steak biscuit, smoke a cigarette and have uprotected relations with a dirty foreign "lady of the evenging". When i die i'm gonna die fat and happy, leaking grease from my pores and rife with disease.....

    Nice thread though, thanks for the info. Appreciate it! :)
     
  9. Dec 12, 2007 at 6:10 AM
    #9
    NVR_QUIT

    NVR_QUIT [OP] My goodness, my Guinness!

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    Look man... I said take it for what it's worth... Everything i posted will not HURT you in any way. I'll tell you what, do some researh, and post up some good tips.
     
  10. Dec 12, 2007 at 6:11 AM
    #10
    NVR_QUIT

    NVR_QUIT [OP] My goodness, my Guinness!

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    HAHA, I have to stay healthy...It's a job requirement... :eek:

    But, I'll join you on the dirty foreign lady, and steak and biscuit!!!;)
     
  11. Dec 12, 2007 at 8:09 AM
    #11
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    haha! deal.

    I wish staying healthy was a job requirement for me. I need motivation to stay in shape. At least now i do. Back in the day working part time or going to school i didnt have a problem with it. But now that i have a real job and work all day i have a hard time going home and doing anything. I need a bitchy girlfriend who calls me fat and makes me work out, unfortunately i have a good gf who makes me fried okra :)
     
  12. Dec 12, 2007 at 9:27 AM
    #12
    colttsi

    colttsi Well-Known Member

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    There's only one thing I would like to add about the 1/4 tank. The fuel acts as a lubricant and keeps the pump from getting too hot. So whenever a fuel pump pumps air, itcreates some minor internal damage that shortens the pump life. That is the only reason why you should keep your tank with at least 1/4 of fuel in it.
    There are baffles all around the pump which acts as a pool of fuel for the pump but sometimes, even with these baffles, if the level is too low, it will pump air.
     
  13. Dec 12, 2007 at 9:51 AM
    #13
    TheMaster

    TheMaster Born to Ride

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    Acts as a coolant.................;)
     
  14. Dec 12, 2007 at 10:23 AM
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    007Tacoma

    007Tacoma I dub thee malicious!

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    That is a good girlfriend!!! I can't even get my wife to make me a sandwich most of the time. :(
     
  15. Dec 12, 2007 at 10:35 AM
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    TheMaster

    TheMaster Born to Ride

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    Eat Steak :hungry:
     
  16. Dec 12, 2007 at 10:38 AM
    #16
    gsm

    gsm Well-Known Member

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    NVR_QUIT unknowingly has it correct. Here's my 2 cents worth:

    1st my background,
    My career is aviation, (yes I'm a commercial pilot), and my degree is in aviation management.

    Did you ever wonder why large jet aircraft show volume of fuel as lbs, vs gallons? It has to do with pressure altitude and temperature. For this lets keep it simple and stay with temperature. As fuel cools it's molecules condence, as it warms up they separate. Therefore a gallon of cooler fuel weighs less than a gallon of warmer fuel. Aviators are taught to purchase fuel during the cooler parts of the day for this reason. As the fuel trucks can only measure volume (gallons) vs weight. The same as at the local filling station.

    This can be seen at your local airport. Smaller general aviation aircraft that are topped off with fuel during the cooler hours end up squirting fuel on the ground in the hotter afternoon hours as the fuel expands (you can always see fuel stains below the vents on the wings of these air craft).

    An aircraft topped off with fuel in the early morning one day will show several gallons less on their fuel meter days later in the heat of the day. Which is why we purchase fuel the morning of a flight and don't top it off way in advance.
     
  17. Dec 12, 2007 at 10:41 AM
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    TheMaster

    TheMaster Born to Ride

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    Because she thinks you are a Turkey she's fattening you up for Thanksgiving 2008 :rolleyes:. Did that not cross your mind fluffy?
     
  18. Dec 12, 2007 at 11:03 AM
    #18
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    I'm gonna have to go ahead and give my woman props right now. She is the best gf i've ever had. She is hot and cooks (very well, especially southern food) she likes to shoot guns, she's smart, and all my friends love her. Unfortunately i'm tainted goods due to my last relationship and am kind of a dick and really dont deserve her. I'm trying to do better but its hard. Anyway, i just wanted to brag. oh yeah, she has two different types of fried okra, the normal kind with flour and eggs etc.... and the special kind where she substitutes corn meal for flour (its really good, imagine cornbread okra!!!) .... man i wish i was a better boyfriend....
     
  19. Dec 12, 2007 at 11:04 AM
    #19
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    shut up bacon!
     
  20. Dec 12, 2007 at 11:10 AM
    #20
    MotoXFreeStyle61

    MotoXFreeStyle61 Displaced Texan

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    Sorry man, I'm gonna have to call you out on this one. Liquid fuel will not more dense or less dense under pressure or under temperature changes. Its a basic law of thermodynamics. It takes a heck of a lot of pressure and low temperature to make a liquid compress and be more dense. How many times have you heard of anyone compressing a liquid? Pressurezing or depressureings usually results in a phase change from either a liquid to solid or liquid to gas. Looks at water for example,:

    Below 32 degrees F water will freeze and form ice.

    At 32 degrees F water has a specific volume of 0.01602 cubic feet per pound (= 62.422 pounds per cu. ft.).

    At 170 degrees F water has a specific volume of 0.01645 cubic feet per pound (=60.7903 pounds per cu. ft.)

    At 212 degrees F water has has a specific volume of 0.01672 cubic feet per pound (=59.8086 pounds per cubic foot)

    Above 212degrees F water will boil and turn into vapor, or steam. (at sea level barometric pressure).

    The volume of water changes very little under temperature changes. Gasolines and other liquids act very much in the same way.
    Now, on the other hand what might be different is the amount of gasoline vapor present in the underground tank. Gasoline vaporizes fairly easy, even the slight increase of temperature. Which is why you smell more gas when its hot outside vs. when its cold. When you go to pump your vehicle you might be pumping a saturated gasoline liquid vapor mixture which will make it seem like you are pumping the same amount of fuel. More than likely though the mixture be around the 97% liquid. Hardly anything to notice when you go to fill up a tank. Any changes will be very slight. When comparing to cooler parts of the day vs hotter parts, you would have to fill up a lot of tanks before you would have any notable difference in volume.

    I would like to see the tests done by the consumer groups. I can't help but to think that some of these groups would love to find ways to prove that the gas pumps are cheating us out of our hard cash. ;)
     
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