Attention all Law Enforcement...

Wow, i didn't know this.

If a cop is searching my truck and he's getting close to finding my porn stash, i can tell him to stop. I no longer give him consent to keep searching my vehicle?? What if he continues?

(I don't really have a porn stash... i'm just asking because i never knew you could tell them when the search is done and the areas they can search)

 

If he continues- Let him continue and do whatever you can to document the situation...Cell phone video works nice...Start the camera and say "STOP SEARCHING MY VEHICLE" DON'T- REPEAT- DO NOT try to physically stop them...That'll earn you an asswhupping and a jailing.

I doubt you'll find any cop that'll keep going right off. Might try to keep building PC- but won't usually go so far or be so bold as to clearly violate your rights.

 

Another thing i dont know if any body mentioned was if you have a ccw, and the officer wants to see it, i would tell him where it was and ask him to get it, and for you to get out of the car, and tell him he has permission to retain you if he feels more comfortable, because i have heard of people shot when getting a weapon to give to the officer, O and i heard this from the sheriffs captian in my county.

 

My undergrad degree is in criminal justice and I have worked with several local as well as state police agencies. To break it down simply, the 4th amendment REQUIRES law enforcement to have a valid warrant in order to search you, your vehicle, your home or your place of business. Any place you have a reasonable expectation of privacy. They also need probable cause in order to get a warrant.

Law enforcement does not always have time to get a judge to sign a warrant when they are out on patrol. So there are several EXCEPTIONS to the 4th amendment that officers can utilize while in the field. These exceptions allow the officer to conduct a search WITHOUT a search warrant.

The one most cops try initially (when they don't have PC) is to ask your permission to search your vehicle.

ANY TIME A COP IS ASKING FOR YOUR PERMISSION TO SEARCH YOUR VEHICLE IT MEANS HE DOES NOT HAVE ENOUGH PC TO INVOKE ANY OF THE 4TH AMENDMENT EXCEPTIONS.

You can very politely and confidently tell him 'No' and there's not a damn thing he can do about it.

However, if you had a bag of weed sitting on your dash and the cop sees it, there is an illegal substance that is in 'plain view.' Plain view is a 4th amendment exception which says that the officer can conduct a search if he spots an illegal activity from a vantage point that he was legally authorized to be at.

Now you have no say in the matter and he can search your vehicle legally without a warrant. There are several other exceptions but always remember that if they ask for permission it means that they have no other means to search and you can tell him to piss off.

 

That's a good point. Something to remember if one is ever in court for an illegal search.

 

TY Interesting Read.

Imagine John Adams thought that illegal search and seizure was the cause of the American Revolution.

 

I believe in all the great advice that's been said here with regard to cooperating with LEOS and being polite and courteous and what not, but someone needs to say this. "Don't talk to the police."

NRAFan asked for LEOs advice...and that's great. But also noteworthy is the advice of an attorney.

Here is a classic example from Professor James Duane ( Regent University School of Law ). He explains why innocent people should never talk to the police, under any circumstances EVER.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4097602514885833865#

Watching that video will give you a great free education.

 

I got to minute 14 and couldn't deal with his speed talking style any more.

I think your "Don't talk to police" should be qualified with a "for anything more major than a traffic ticket" or something like that. Because if you automatically take the 5th whenever a cop LOOKS at you...You WILL get cited and/or subpoenaed to court where you will still have the option to take the 5th, but it will be a pain in the ass for you.

There is something to be said for not "giving away the farm" but there is also something to be said for expediency too.

The choking example- The guy WAS guilty of assault...even if he was only kidding....so he was a fucking moron for talking to the cop. Don't be a moron and you'll be just fine.

 

as far as searching the car goes we will not search it unless u say yes, if a k-9 unit gets to the traffic stop before we finish the citation about 15-20 minutes and the dog alerts to your car we can search it but it is your constitutional right to say no

 

The video is instructional nevertheless.

It should teach you at least to be extremely careful what you say to law enforcement--especially when you're pulled over for a traffic citation, since that's where many encounters happen. Case in point:

Police Stops: What to Do If You Are Pulled Over -Nolo.com

 

What you are describing is reasonable suspicion that a subject is doing or does something, not Probable Cause for an arrest.

Be careful, that's where most LEOs can get in trouble.....confusing PC with reasonable suspicion. Probable Cause is what arrests are based on. Reasonable suspicion is usually what leads the officer to PC. We do not make an arrest based on suspicion of something. If you suspect something is going on, that leads to an investigative detention in which you begin looking or building up to Probable Cause for an arrest.

In a case like that you are better trying to get a K-9 out or asking for consent. Warrantless search without PC (based on inferences) will not hold up and the case goes down the toilet. Again, PC is not the same thing as reasonable suspicion. RS allows you more time to get that PC. That's why LEOs have to be some of the smartest mofos around.

 

I know how this all works- as I've done it to several people...Both frisks with RS and complete investigations leading to arrests with PC. I was a Federal LEO for 5 years and still regularly talk/work with some.

Reasonable suspicion a lesser requirement than PC for the same thing. Officers can observe facts without having any concrete proof. And PC for a search does not always rise to the level of PC for an arrest. There have been several (destructive) searches without making any arrests because the facts and my observations indicated that we needed to search in depth, but not that we need to make arrests.

Original example-A dog is just more information to build PC with...but I can articulate PC for a search based on the set of facts that I gave you...No dog...No anything else.

Great example is observing RS that someone is drunk driving. You can breathalyze them...but you don't need to. The breath test only helps build a stronger basis of facts for PC...but FSTs alone can be PC.


I agree with you that a consent search is the easiest...I did this all the time as well. But if you have that feeling something needs to be searched- It will happen eventually.

 

Hey all, thanks for all the great information. I hope I am never put in this situation, and I dont know how I will act if I am. I am, however, always respectful and polite and I have never had a bad encounter. I had a dick LAPD breathalyze me once because my eyes were red. Blew a .0000 just so you know. Other than that, I have never had a problem. I respect everything all you LEO's are doing and can appreciate the difficulties you face everyday. Be safe out there. And if you ever see a tacomaworld.com decal on any of our trucks, give us a break. Thanks again for all the great information.

 

I got pulled over last year and the cop walked up and said "Hello Sir, do you know why I pulled you over today?"

I was on my way home from work and it's all short little back roads so I wasn't speeding. I said "Yes sir but everyone rolls through that stop sign." He smiled and said, "No, your inspection sticker is out of date but let's talk about this rolling stop!"

He gave me a written warning for the expired inspection and said he would be watching for me. I had to have it inspected in 24 hours. Just got a lecture about the importance of full stops at stop signs.