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Base Reg. Cab Audio Upgrade Choices.

Discussion in 'Audio & Video' started by mako fisher, May 30, 2017.

  1. May 30, 2017 at 5:59 PM
    #1
    mako fisher

    mako fisher [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Int. wipers, fog lights, cruise control
    Love my Taco, but I cringe everytime I listen to music. As a music lover who spends spends an hour a day, at least, commuting it's time to do something.

    I'm interested in improving musicality. SPL is nice but SQ trumps all. My listening habits are pretty diverse, but if I had to list a pecking order it would be: Classic Rock, Jazz, Progressive Rock, Folk and select Country artists like Johnny Cash and Hank Williams.

    Reg. cab presents limitations, but fortunately I prefer a conventional stereo approach... R & L channels suplemented with bass are all I desire.

    Need to do this on a very limited budget, as I have many other upgrades competing for my "Taco improvement funds".

    I have done a fair amount of research and decided I will need the following: 4-channel amp (2 channels for fronts and bi-amping 2 channels for sub), mid-base/ tweet components for front channels, line-out processor with bass management and a sub.

    My buy list (subject to change) includes:

    AudioControl LC2i 2 Channel Line Out Converter Wwith AccuBASS and Subwoofer Control

    JL Audio JX400/4D 4-channel car amplifier — 70 watts RMS x 4

    JL Audio C2-650 6.5-Inch 2-Way Component Speaker System

    Pretty comfortable with these choices but alternative considerations are welcomed.

    Subwoofer choice has me confounded. Needs to go either behind or below seat which with a RC is very limiting(5-7"). Have a few component woofers I feel good with but would have to build enclosures and not sure how narrow depth would effect their tuning.

    Any thoughts and suggestions appreciated.






     
    Last edited: May 30, 2017
  2. Jun 1, 2017 at 5:58 PM
    #2
    mako fisher

    mako fisher [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Int. wipers, fog lights, cruise control
    Been doing a lot of research and decided to order these speakers from Crutchfields today.

    Focal PS 165V 6-3/4" 2-Way Component System.

    Now trying to find a 4 channel amp to drive the fronts and a sub. Leaning heavily towards Rockford Fosgate punch offerings.
     
  3. Jun 7, 2017 at 8:13 PM
    #3
    ABA180

    ABA180 It burns when I pee....

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    East Bridgewater MA
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    Pioneer CD, Megaloud/JBL amps, Rockford/Polk speakers.
    I have Fosgate tweets and 6x9s in my doors, love em. Probably gonna give the amp a shot too for my MTX 12's behind the seat.

    What other questions do you have about this? Check my page, I have a little information on my setup.
     
    mako fisher [OP] likes this.
  4. Jun 8, 2017 at 4:04 PM
    #4
    mako fisher

    mako fisher [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Int. wipers, fog lights, cruise control
    Focal speakers arrived. Look great but no chance to work with them yet ... maybe this weekend if I can shake this bug I been fighting.

    Ordered and received a Rock Fos. 12" shallow mount sub and an enclosure to mount in which I hope to fit behind bench seat.

    Install is gonna be a slow one as I have a lot to do and so little energy left after work ... it sucks getting old.

    My major decision pending is what amp(s) to use and how to set up the front end components ie active vs passive COs and do I biamp or not. Focals came with 4 CO units but not sure I want to use them to start.

    Also trying to get caught up on huge differences between home and car audio. In my home systems always favored seperates for everything, learning that with mobile, power supply (ac vs dc) changes things.

    Leaning towards an all in one solution ... 5 or 6 channels which would allow flexibility to biamp components or bridge front channels plus power sub.

    Looking closesly at Rockford fosgate and ARC XDi series, with cost definitely being a concern.

    FWIW thought Id pass on mny thoghts on vendors Ive dealt with so far.

    Crutchfield ..... awesome- very customer service driven prices a bit steep but deals are there.
    Sonic Electonics .... awful- sales driven, getting plenty of spam emails but recieved 0 reponses to 2 inquiries.
     
  5. Jun 8, 2017 at 4:14 PM
    #5
    ABA180

    ABA180 It burns when I pee....

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    Pioneer CD, Megaloud/JBL amps, Rockford/Polk speakers.
    I used passive crossovers on mine. You should use some kind of a crossover so you don't fry your tweeters.
     
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  6. Jun 8, 2017 at 4:16 PM
    #6
    Speedytech7

    Speedytech7 Toyota Cult Ombudsman

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    I've done a mod or two
    I've had great experiences with my JBL GTO-3EZ amp in my truck. It is a three channel, 50 for fronts and 350 and change for the sub. Great for a balanced truck system without breaking the bank.
     
    mako fisher [OP] likes this.
  7. Jun 8, 2017 at 4:19 PM
    #7
    ABA180

    ABA180 It burns when I pee....

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    Pioneer CD, Megaloud/JBL amps, Rockford/Polk speakers.
    I have 100x2 on my fronts and 300x2 on my subs. I'm sure my crappy Jensen isn't feeding near 300x2 of course..
     
  8. Jun 8, 2017 at 5:15 PM
    #8
    mako fisher

    mako fisher [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Definitely gonna use crossovers just have a lot of options and trying to figure out whats best. Will prolly take my usual approach: keep my options open and experiment with the sound. Question: what is an optimal Hi-pass CO setting to get the most out of tweets working with mids and a sub. I love how A few ARC amps incorporate bandpass CO options for optimal integration of 3-way components. Unfortunately option only appears to be on lowest end and highest end offerings. Lo end is 4 channel so would need sub amp and hi is awesome but pricey.
     
  9. Jun 8, 2017 at 5:17 PM
    #9
    mako fisher

    mako fisher [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, I'll give it a look.
     
  10. Jun 8, 2017 at 10:13 PM
    #10
    ABA180

    ABA180 It burns when I pee....

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    Not sure on that off my head. I have 2 separate amps so I use one on mid-high and the other on low.
     
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  11. Jun 9, 2017 at 6:56 AM
    #11
    dmb1650

    dmb1650 Well-Known Member

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    If you are using the crossover supplied with the component set you wont be able to adjust the crossover for the tweeter...well not as easy as adjusting the HPF on the amp. Sounds like you have experience in home audio and like to experiment. I would suggest looking into a digital sound processor(DSP), a lot of options. I run a minidsp c-dsp 6x8, its more on the budget side of things but its really a great value. This would replace the need for a line converter. It would allow you to run your tweets and midbasses active(without passive crossover). Myself and a few others have some build threads using a DSP.

    EDIT: I looked at the specs on the Focals. Did not know they have adjustable crossover settings(not common). But who knows if those are optimal for your set up.
     
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  12. Jun 10, 2017 at 3:41 PM
    #12
    mako fisher

    mako fisher [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Yes I do, but info on settings is limited. Seperate passive COs for each component with 3-lvl setpoint adjustments(hi/med/lo?) and a 3-way (flat/-3db/-6db) attenuation switch. Seems like a lot of wasted energy and since I'm not gonna upgrade my charging system, going active makes sense.

    I am looking strongly into dsp but want to keep things simple. Right now considering an Audiocontrol 2XO to feed an all in one amp. 2xo would niceley keep lo-bass out of mids and tweets and then I would use HPF in amp to filter more bass from tweets.
     
  13. Jun 12, 2017 at 8:57 AM
    #13
    dmb1650

    dmb1650 Well-Known Member

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    Not sure how where you at as far as knowledge on running active in car audio(there is a lot of information out there to read). But keep in mind you will need 1 channel of amplification per speaker so 4 channels for 2 mid-basses and 2 tweeters. A sub channel would be another So you're at 5 channels at minimum. If you don't have an amp selected there are also amp/DSP combos out there. Audiocontrol has one https://www.crutchfield.com/p_161LC61200/AudioControl-LC-6-1200.html
    Only worry I have about the amp/DSP combo is if you fry your amp you lose a DSP too.


    Don't forget the other capabilities that a DSP has outside of crossover settings. Most have time alignment(very valuable in car audio since driver is on one side of the vehicle), parametric equalizer and/or graphic equalizer, level adjustment, and phase adjustment.

    The video series below goes over one guys process on how to tune using a DSP. It's not the only way to do it, but it gives you an overview of what an DSP can do and also the key advantage of going active is the ability to make adjustments, but not knowing what you're doing can lead to disappointment. He's using a Helix DSP, but can be applied to most other DSPs on the market.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-i8cxJaDyjg

    It can be overwhelming, it took me a couple months before I got everything nailed down as far as equipment goes and another few months to get everything installed and tuned. If you haven't already I would join DIYMA.com a lot of knowledge over there.
     
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  14. Jun 24, 2017 at 9:52 AM
    #14
    mako fisher

    mako fisher [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Ok, I decided to purchase an AudioControl LC2i for HU signal processing, an ARC audio xdi 450.4 amp 4-channel 500w rms amplifier to power the Focal components actively and a Rockford Fosgate R500X1D mono amp to drive the RF P3SD4-10 sub. I figure I can add dsp downstream of the LC2i down the road if necesary.

    Currently putting together my wiring needs list and figuring out exactly how things will be configured.

    Question #1: how to best configure Lc2i outputs to amp inputs. Sounds simple and as usual trial and error may be the only way to sort it but wiring needs differ.

    Option A) Main (full range) output to 4channel amp and bass output to sub amp. Makes the most sense but requires running 4 RCAs and not much info is supplied on what processing is done on bass output channels. My assumption is that the bass restoration occurs across the full range outputs as well and the main reason for seperate bass outputs is to allow seperate level control.

    Option B) Main output to sub amp, and utilize pass through outputs on sub amp to inputs on 4channel amp. Only requires 2 RCAs and both amps get full range signal, allowing utilization of crossovers and gain adjustments in amps to tune sub, mids and tweets individually. Probably will try this option first unless someone can provide a better solution.

    Question #2: How to wire my sub for optimal usage. I purchased my sub weeks ago and ended up changing my mind on the amp I had ordered. Sub is a DVC 4 ohm and rated at 300 RMS. Amp is rated at 300 RMS at 4 ohm and 500 at 2 ohm.

    According to wiring wizard I only have the option of 2 or 8 ohm configuration with a single DVC sub. 2 ohm wiring puts me ~ double rated RMS and 8 ohm around half. Going with 8 ohm would allow me to add a 2nd sub and get to 4 ohm load without changing internal wiring on first sub, down the line.

    I think I got it in my head that you could wire a 4 ohm DVC using only 1 voice coil and create a 4 ohm load but cannot find any confirmation of the feasibility of doing this.

    Any thoughts and suggestions welcomed.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2017

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