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Calling all lift/suspension experts!

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016+)' started by jplafor, Dec 17, 2020.

  1. Dec 17, 2020 at 9:38 AM
    #1
    jplafor

    jplafor [OP] Member

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    Very clickbait title I know... but I had to draw you in.

    I haven't seen this done on the forum (probably has been though I feel like this seems like a pretty normie setup), I am also very new to this so scrolling through existing threads with a lot of the jargon can get overwhelming so I apologize if this is one of those "did you know tacoworld as a search box" sorta threads.

    MY TRUCK:
    2020 SR5 Double Cab, 6' Bed 4x4 V6​

    MY GOALS:
    1. I just graduated college in May, bought my very first car, and idk if I could bring myself to cut anything, if it's tiny alright. But nothing that I could see without looking for it.
    2. More decent gas mileage than not, going wider means worse mileage correct? Is that just because the tires and wheels are going to weigh more than pizza cutters?
    3. Want an oem look, hence the TRD Pro tires
    4. I don't want spacers, blocks or anything that's going to compromise suspension performance over stock. I don't have any plans for off roading just yet (still my baby ) but I do want it to be off road capable, I think spacers is just mall crawler look right.

    MY PLAN:
    255 80 R17 Tires

    https://www.metaltech4x4.com/old-man-emu-2005-tacoma-3-inch-lift-kit-medium-load/

    https://www.amazon.com/ALUMINUM-IND...d=1&keywords=trd+wheels&qid=1608226696&sr=8-1

    Some upper control arm (i've heard this is a pretty good idea although not needed) But I'm going the pretty good idea route.

    The diff drop (i've heard this is a pretty good idea although not needed) But I'm going the pretty good idea route.​

    WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR

    Dif drop suggestions, upper control arm suggestions, tire suggestions, I got toyos right now, I also live in a new england so maybe my existing rims could be 255 85R16 with a summer tire of sorts, and this trd pro rim could be winter idk...

    ANY CRITIQUES/ Reasons this won't work or look good, might rub... Extra parts I need? OME kit bad?

    Eventually will probably put a winch bumper on, but not now... is doing that as simple as getting a stiffer spring with the rest of the components in the OME kit I linked staying the same?​

    CONCERNS:

    https://www.tyresizecalculator.com/charts/tire-width-for-a-wheel-rim-size-chart

    According to the above link, the 255 will not fit on a 7" wide rim. I feel like this is a lie.. Why does it say this.

    Thank you to everyone that replies it is greatly appreciated, and don't roast me too hard.​
     
  2. Dec 17, 2020 at 9:48 AM
    #2
    gudujarlson

    gudujarlson Well-Known Member

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    Typically the tire seller/manufacturer will list a rim width range and typically that will be 6.5 - 8.0" for a 255/85/r16 or 255/85/80/r17. A 255 is in-between the 2 stock tire widths of 265 and 245, so it stands to reason that the stock rims will work fine.
     
    jplafor [OP] likes this.
  3. Dec 17, 2020 at 9:49 AM
    #3
    DarkMark340

    DarkMark340 @TRDLess_Taco

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    2011 Black 4x4 Tacoma DCSB Base
    SUSPENSION: 3” Factory/Toytec Lift Blackout14 Custom Leaf Pack 5+1 HD Bilstein 5100 B100 Shocks Wheelers Off-Road U bolt Flip kit w/ Timbren Bump stops BAMF HD Rear Shackle Hangers ARMOR: SOS Off-road Concepts Sliders SOS Off-road Concepts High Clearance Rear Bumper Pelfreybilt Front Bumper Full Hoop GEAR: Smittybilt X20 10K Synthetic Line Winch Leer 100XQ Prinsu CABRAC & TOPRAC Simple Outdoors Skyloft Hardshell RTT Pope Overland Expedition 72” Awning 18x9 VTX Off-road Bronze Terra CaliRaised LED Lights FUTURE PURCHASES: SOS Off-road Concepts Full Skid Plates Relentless Fabrication Tailgate Reinforcement ARB Twin Compressor w/ Locker
    "expert" is very subjective, especially on a forum. haha however the first thing I would say when planning to mod your truck is know that you will lose MPG. Changing the lift will change the aerodynamics, wider tires will increase rolling resistance, and any armor is adding weight.. All three will produce a reduction in MPG. For tires keeping them narrow and tall will help, also choosing a tire in the load range C group over E would be wise. C = 6ply E= 10 ply obviously 10 ply will be heavier but also more durable on trails etc. (for the most part) as for the other parts I will allow the experts to chime in.
     
    Shippe and jplafor [OP] like this.
  4. Dec 17, 2020 at 9:56 AM
    #4
    Shippe

    Shippe Well-Known Member

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    @MGMSteelCurtain 's setup is pretty clean and inexpensive. The lift with the AAL was $850 if I remember correctly from Headstrong off road. This is the route I'll be going except with 16'' wheels and skinnier tires.
     
  5. Dec 17, 2020 at 9:59 AM
    #5
    jplafor

    jplafor [OP] Member

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    Thank you @DarkMark340! I have accepted the fuel economy loss, I think the load range suggestion sounds good to me. I'd say minimal rubbing, ideally none, is most important to me, and also I'd say for off roading and tires that can probably wait. But if new tires is all id need for it in the future with my setup that would be sick.
     
    DarkMark340 likes this.
  6. Dec 17, 2020 at 10:01 AM
    #6
    jplafor

    jplafor [OP] Member

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    @Shippe Does the lift come entirely from the spring? the 5100s max out at 2" right? I am a fan of stance at 3" plus the 33" tire.
     
  7. Dec 17, 2020 at 10:03 AM
    #7
    jplafor

    jplafor [OP] Member

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    Comparing an AAL to a full leaf pack, is it night and day? or would most people say an aal is nearly as a good as a full leaf pack? / not worth the extra money. I'd say my budget on the suspension is 2k...
     
  8. Dec 17, 2020 at 10:05 AM
    #8
    Shippe

    Shippe Well-Known Member

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    OME makes a full kit.
    I've also heard Iron Man 4x4 is pretty good, too.
    I'm pretty new with my Tacoma as well and I've found youtube has hours of videos on suspension.
     
    4×4×4 likes this.
  9. Dec 17, 2020 at 10:13 AM
    #9
    gudujarlson

    gudujarlson Well-Known Member

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    The Old Man Emu kit is more like a 2" on 3rd gens. Some lifts get labeled as 3" I think because on 2nd gens they give about 3".

    For the Old Man Emu kit, yes the springs give the lift. There are no spacers, drop brackets, lower control arms, or spindles involved.
     
    4×4×4 likes this.
  10. Dec 17, 2020 at 10:18 AM
    #10
    gudujarlson

    gudujarlson Well-Known Member

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    My take on on AAL vs full leaf pack is this. The AAL creates lift by increased the spring constant of the leaf spring allowing it to carry more load but also be harsher when unloaded. The full leaf pack creates lift by increasing the arch in the leaf spring (perhaps because it is longer?) which maintains the the same spring constant, load carrying capacity, and ride quality. There are also full leaf packs that also increase the spring constant and load carrying capacity (e.g. the Dakar heavy leaf pack). With extended length shocks, both increase the suspension travel. I've never fully understood this though.
     
  11. Dec 17, 2020 at 10:34 AM
    #11
    jplafor

    jplafor [OP] Member

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    Hmmm seems like a full leaf pack is what I'd want then, thank you @gudujarlson ! So If the spring gives the lift, does the strut just need to be long enough for a given spring? long enough to put the right amount of preload on the spring? People use bilsteins 5100s for 2 inches of lift, but thats a shock not a spring? Maybe a good video out there on this topic?
     
  12. Dec 17, 2020 at 10:45 AM
    #12
    gudujarlson

    gudujarlson Well-Known Member

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    The ride height of the front IFS suspension is raised by either installing a stiffer spring, installing a longer spring, increasing the preload on the spring, or all of the above. The suspension travel stays the same unless you install extended length shocks and aftermarket UCAs. The ride height of the rear leaf spring SAS suspension is raised by installing a stiffer leaf pack, a leaf pack with more arch, or both. The suspension travel stays the same unless you install extended length shocks.

    AFAIK, the Bilstein shocks achieve lift by increasing preload on the spring.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2020
  13. Dec 17, 2020 at 10:59 AM
    #13
    jplafor

    jplafor [OP] Member

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    Sure, I understand increasing the preload will effectively make the spring stiffer, meaning to compress it further more force needs to be applied than before the preload increase. But if the spring needs to be compressed more to get the stiffer spring... Wouldn't that be the opposite of a lift?
     
  14. Dec 17, 2020 at 11:09 AM
    #14
    gudujarlson

    gudujarlson Well-Known Member

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    Preload does not make the spring stiffer. It will have the same spring constant regardless of preload. What changes is the amount of compression in the spring when the suspension is fully drooped. If you were to jack up your truck so that you wheel is off the ground and then press up on it, you would need to push harder to make it move after increasing the preload. This results in the truck riding higher. However at ride height, adding 100 pounds to the truck will result is the same displacement regardless of preload (e.g. 1" for a 100 lb/in spring). Let's say you have 100 pounds of preload. It then takes 100 pounds of weight before the suspension will begin to displace rom full droop. If the truck is capable of applying 500 pounds of weight to the spring and 100 pounds is used to start the suspension displacement, then only 400 is left to displace it. This results in the truck riding higher (e.g. 4" beyond full droop vs 5" beyond full droop).
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2020
  15. Dec 17, 2020 at 2:58 PM
    #15
    jplafor

    jplafor [OP] Member

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    how about bilstein 5100s in the front with an ome 888 coil? will that get me my desired lift, with a dakar in the back? This seems like the most popular lift on taco world no?
     
    71tattooguy likes this.
  16. Dec 17, 2020 at 3:13 PM
    #16
    71tattooguy

    71tattooguy Well-Known Member

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    Petaluma , Ca (707)
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    2019 Tacoma TRD Off-road DCLB / 6112’s /5160’s / AAL / SPC’s
    2”front lift 1.5” lift , black badges doors and tailgate / method 315 / magnaflow exhaust / meso int delete kit / meso led map lights / wheelers front super bumps / wheelers super bump flip kit / Cali raised fog light pods
    That’s a great kit also. Going to get lots of advice. IMO definitely get upper control arms. Good Luck OP
     
  17. Dec 17, 2020 at 3:14 PM
    #17
    gudujarlson

    gudujarlson Well-Known Member

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    That sounds decent. I'm not sure what your desired lift is, but unless you go to long travel or a drop bracket lift, you can only expect 0-3" in front. 3" is probably pushing up against the limits of the 3rd gen IFS. As I remember, my truck from the factory had 3" of droop. If I raised the ride height 3" I'd end up with 0" of droop. 0" of droop sounds bad. Imagine free falling into every dip in the road/trail. I raised my ride height by about 2" and also added extended length shocks to get an extra 1" of droop. It's on my TODO list to measure my ride height and droop about 1 year after the mod.

    The good thing about my Kings and also the Bilsteins is that you can adjust the preload to set the ride height where you want (unless you have unreasonable expectations or have changed the weight of your truck too much).
     
    71tattooguy likes this.
  18. Dec 18, 2020 at 5:57 AM
    #18
    DarkMark340

    DarkMark340 @TRDLess_Taco

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    SUSPENSION: 3” Factory/Toytec Lift Blackout14 Custom Leaf Pack 5+1 HD Bilstein 5100 B100 Shocks Wheelers Off-Road U bolt Flip kit w/ Timbren Bump stops BAMF HD Rear Shackle Hangers ARMOR: SOS Off-road Concepts Sliders SOS Off-road Concepts High Clearance Rear Bumper Pelfreybilt Front Bumper Full Hoop GEAR: Smittybilt X20 10K Synthetic Line Winch Leer 100XQ Prinsu CABRAC & TOPRAC Simple Outdoors Skyloft Hardshell RTT Pope Overland Expedition 72” Awning 18x9 VTX Off-road Bronze Terra CaliRaised LED Lights FUTURE PURCHASES: SOS Off-road Concepts Full Skid Plates Relentless Fabrication Tailgate Reinforcement ARB Twin Compressor w/ Locker
    @jplafor I agree with the others definitely go with a full leaf pack rated for the ride height you want and the constant load you expect to be carrying. Firm believer in the buy once cry once mentality, having taken short cuts and then spending more in the long run to get where I wanted its less aggravating to do it once and do it right.

    Dobinson is another great brand to take a look at for suspension kits, idk if the link will work for the full set up I tossed together but for UCA, front coils (assembled), full leaf pack, rear shocks, diff drop the total was $2300. I went Heavy duty (most expensive) on all options bc these trucks always tend to end up heavier than expected when fully built. So depending on your needs it could fall in to that 2k price range you were hoping for or if you have the tools or help you can save money by assembling the front coilovers yourself. I Also included the link to customize the order to your needs, there used to be a Dobinson rep on here but I cant find his @ right now.

    https://www.dobinsonsdirect.com/cart

    https://www.dobinsonsdirect.com/pro...005-to-2019-tacoma-4x4?variant=31801715785837
     
  19. Jan 29, 2021 at 7:22 PM
    #19
    garrettsprenger

    garrettsprenger Member

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    Hello everyone, I just ordered my lift kit and was looking for some input. Is there anything you guys would recommend me doing differently? and Is there anything you would recommend that I know before I install it? also thoughts on the 1/4 inch spacer? and last question how much lift do you think I will achieve front and back on my 2006 tacoma double short bed cab 4x4 with a topper and no other added weight other than about 150lbs of tools in the bed. Screen Shot 2021-01-29 at 8.13.51 PM.jpg
     
  20. Jan 29, 2021 at 9:00 PM
    #20
    Jaggerbub

    Jaggerbub Well-Known Member

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    Dont forget the ecgs bushing
     

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