Eubeenhadd's T4R build and adventures thread

Discussion in '4Runners' started by EubeenHadd, Aug 9, 2023.

  1. Sep 18, 2023 at 7:16 AM
    #21
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    I've been using Torque Pro and a bluetooth dongle for monitoring/code clearing and it's worked pretty well, it's got live scanning/pending codes/temps etc. Thankfully, no codes are pending (yet) and the monitoring values seem to be coming in line whereas before the sensors simply weren't responding. We will see what low temps reveal, but after a couple days it's been pretty consistently above reference values. My biggest issue with it so far has been having to dig a bit in the app to figure out how to see sensor history/readouts and having to use another device that's not fun to integrate in the dash somewhere. An ultragauge would probably integrate much better.
     
    Slashaar likes this.
  2. Sep 20, 2023 at 1:57 PM
    #22
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    Copy/pasting this info here for my own future reference:

    Originally Posted by Inv4drZm End-goal for me is to reliably fit 37's w/ front and rear lockers and a lower range t-case so I've been doing some research.

    Somebody PM'd me a while ago and I did a quick write-up for them on my opinion with some numbers thrown in. They had asked about my ECGS rebuilt 8" diff. Some of it you may already know but for anyone that is curious here it is.

    **Disclaimer: This post mostly benefits those that do serious high-traction rocky trails where low range is used, and greater than 33" tires are equipped.
    Currently mine and my brother's ECGS rebuilt diffs have been doing fine, but really only have a half-dozen of rock crawl outings with mine so far (35's). If you look around the forums on build threads with broken 'original' rear diffs guys aren't back the next weekend posting another broken gearset from what I have seen (maybe they are more cautious with the skinny pedal, but it seems the rebuilt diff is stronger) The stock gearset with 120k miles and the crush washer with 34's or 35's in my mind is guaranteed to break after a couple heavy trail runs/obstacles if you are not the utmost of careful (which is no fun, makes me sweat more). As I have posted before, guys on this forum inevitably seem to break their original diffs once they move up to 34's or 35's.

    If you had front/rear lockers (recently rebuilt diffs with solid pinion spacer) I could see potentially less stress being put on the diffs due to less wheel spin/speed on the trails. The rebuilt diff w/ solid pinion spacer is way better than your 10yr old diff with a crush washer. If you added a crawlbox (Marlin tacobox, $2.5k) or aftermarket t-case (Atlas) with a lower 'low range' gear ratio you could probably easily get by with rebuilt 8.0s as a guy from Marlin runs 40" tires on a 3rd gen Tacoma with their tacobox (their rear diffs might be a little stronger though). With the tacobox you have way more control and time to 'not break' stuff. I've also heard the lower gearing helps a ton with rock crawling capabilities.

    I'm not sure how much stronger the 8.2's are as they use the same size gears (or maybe slightly bigger?), they just beefed up some things to hold the gears more rigidly I guess. You don't hear of too many of these diffs breaking, but they are found in newer trucks that don't seem to wheel as hardcore (or have as big of tires generally speaking). The one I did hear of breaking (newer FJ) they broke an axle instead of the gearset, after ~7 years of wheeling with 35's. Personally I wouldn't spend too much money on an 8.2 upgrade, it's not really proven in my mind yet, but if you can sell your complete stock diff you could recoup some cost and if you can find a good deal on a used one it should bolt right in.

    My brother just told me ECGS can build a mostly-complete 8.2 diff that you can throw your existing axle shafts/bearings and things into. You might want to ask them about this (it doesn't appear to be on their website) and if you do, I would be curious to know the details. I just looked and JustDiffs.com
    does the same thing, cost with ARB/4.56/chromoly axles is $3800 plus shipping.

    It really depends on what expectations you have for your truck. If you are more careful than most, do medium difficulty trails with 33's close to home, and rebuilt your old diff with a solid pinion spacer and locker, I would wait to see if that gearset goes before thinking about upgrading. If you throw on a set of 35's and walk the thin line of your truck's capabilities, I would definitely consider the 8.2 if not more, especially if you occasionally wheel 1000 miles from home like me. My brother's ECGS gearset in his FJ has held up fine with 34's, after his stock gears died, for 1.5 years but he has a Diamond 9.5" diff on order because he is planning on 35's or larger, a bunch of other stuff, and doesn't want to break down in Moab or California when we are on vacation. I have a similar plan when I have the time/money.

    You said you like the elocker option, in some ways it is nice and cheap, with the ARB you can have more things go wrong (seals blow, air mixes in with gear oil, etc) and needs an air compressor setup, couple hundred bucks more.


    In summary, here are the options as I see it with prices mostly from my brain. Not knowing what tire size, gear ratio, or trail difficulties you want to run in the future, I listed about everything that made financial sense. The FJ guys have a good option that we don't have as cheap, which is sending in their elocker 3rd member gearset for a rebuilt gearset. Ours would be a couple hundred dollars more I would think, for that exact option because we don't have a rear locker from the factory.

    * An ECGS rebuilt diff has a 5 year warranty with 35" or less tires.
    * Regear will require additional cost of regearing front diff as well (check ECGS for prices)
    * Recoup costs not include in estimates.

    I'll say it again, this is a pretty rough estimate of costs depending on shipping costs, what spare parts you sell, or what locker you choose.
    • $0 Stay with 33's and hope to not blow the diff knowing that it could break if pushed hard, if you do rebuild/regear/ARB.
    • $600 Find used 8.0 3rd member with elocker unbuilt 3.73 gears, and retrofit.
    • $800 preemptively rebuild existing 8.0 to avoid paying tow truck and trail-shame, regear/no locker.
    • $1200 Find 8.0 3rd member with elocker already rebuilt/regeared (Or send ECGS your non-elocker + added cost for an elocker diff).
    • $2000 junkyard/used rear 8.2 w/ elocker, sell current 8.0 assembly to recoup cost.
    • $2800 junkyard/used rear 8.2 w/elocker/rebuild/solid pinion spacer/regear. Sell current 8.0 assembly to recoup cost.
    • $3300 Marlin crawlbox with ultra-low gearing for added control/capability plus preemptive 8.0 rebuild/regear/ARB.
    • $3500 Just Diffs/ ECGS 8.2 with standard axles/ARB/regear. Sell 8.0 3rd member to recoup cost.
    • $4000 Just Diffs/ ECGS 8.2 with chromoly axles/ARB/regear. Sell 8.0 3rd member to recoup cost.
    • $4500 ECGS Dana 60 with 35 spline axles/any locker/regear. Sell entire 8.0 axle to recoup cost.
    • $5500+ Currie F9/Diamond 9.5" ARB/regear necessary. Sell 8.0 3rd member to recoup cost.
    • $8000 Diamond housing w/ Tundra 10.5" gears. Sell entire 8.0 axle to recoup cost.
    Maybe this makes you more confused, but I hope it helps you out. If not it's a good reference for me to look at... Might make for a good thread some day.

    Also, my brother put together this guide for axle basics/terminology.Solid summary with one change.

    ECGS D60 w/Ox locker, reuse stock shafts: ~$3300 from ECGS, can upgrade to chromoly 30 spline shafts later if needed ($500) and is a stronger option than the 8.2

    99% sure I'm going that route, about 800 more than my current estimate for sourcing and building an 8.2 ($2400 +/- shipping etc) Only downside is there's no third to drop out, but for moderate/heavy wheeling I don't expect having to touch it again with just 35s. Short of a SAS, the front diff/cvs will be an issue long before the rear would be.
     
    Slashaar likes this.
  3. Sep 21, 2023 at 5:50 AM
    #23
    Slashaar

    Slashaar Trail Limo Supreme & Certified Hole Massager

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Member:
    #236717
    Messages:
    14,884
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Josh
    Kansas City, MO
    Vehicle:
    2015 Tacoma TRD-Sport DC LB
    Coastal HC Front, 6112s+650lb King Coils, JD 62 Swap + 14" Fox 2.0s
    I just checked, and it's looking at around $4200 for front and rear diffs regeared to 4.88 with Harrop E-Locker in the rear after core return in my 8.4 Tacoma.

    https://eastcoastgearsupply.com/i-788575-tacoma-8-4-non-eld-t100-tundra-3rd.html $2435 4.88 + ARB locker (spacer, bushing, used Flange, gear oil)
    https://eastcoastgearsupply.com/i-157223-tacoma-fj-4runner-8-reverse-ifs-clamshell.html $1380 4.88 (no locker)
    Total: $3815 shipped
    -$1000 core charges on return of stock third and clamshell.
    Final Total: $2815

    $4183.99 before Core Return with Harrop E-Locker rear. $3183 after.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2023
  4. Sep 21, 2023 at 6:59 AM
    #24
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    Yeah I'm looking at big bills all around, but I'm actively investigating sources of factory 4.30 gears to potentially regear a bit cheaper and make the swap a weekend job with cores sourced in advance. Seems like 3rd gen manual clamshells and 3rd gen 4 cylinder 3rd members are both 4.30's and can drop in to the front/rear on 4th gen T4R's, so it might be an inexpensive source of both core and gears, such that all that's necessary is a locker/LSD, spacer, and install, with the ability to sell the 3.73 bits or hold on to them for a deeper regear/spares. I need to investigate further but it seems promising so far.

    However, I do need to consider whether it's even worth it to get that deep into it because I'll always be chasing durability on trail and the correct path to durability with 35+ inch tires is SAS/D60's/tons/etc. I think what's going to drive these decisions is the breakpoint where I want to go from mild to wild. At what point do I turn it into a wannabe landcruiser? Only time will tell, but I suspect I'm going to build to 33's as inexpensively as I can and then start figuring out how to SAS without compromising the ability to drive it, because driving is the point.
     
    Slashaar likes this.
  5. Sep 21, 2023 at 8:05 AM
    #25
    Slashaar

    Slashaar Trail Limo Supreme & Certified Hole Massager

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Member:
    #236717
    Messages:
    14,884
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Josh
    Kansas City, MO
    Vehicle:
    2015 Tacoma TRD-Sport DC LB
    Coastal HC Front, 6112s+650lb King Coils, JD 62 Swap + 14" Fox 2.0s
    I've heard of regearing the transfer case as a cheaper route too, but most people only do the diffs. Unless you're looking for an all around use regear and not just a lower 4lo.
     
  6. Sep 21, 2023 at 9:10 AM
    #26
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    All around use and protecting the drivetrain. I can't find any regears for the AWD TCase in these rigs, so my option there is a Tacobox, and I'll save that for when the driveshafts are already being modded/replaced during heavy duty axle swaps. The more leverage I can give the trans/tcase over the wheels and axle shafts the better, I want my axle shafts to be the weak link, they're cheaper and easier to replace than anything upstream.
     
    Slashaar[QUOTED] and kyle11863 like this.
  7. Oct 2, 2023 at 7:07 AM
    #27
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    Still messing with the O2 sensors. I'm pretty sure the right side cat is fully dead and the left side is probably pretty dead too, and I'm not ready or willing to replace those yet, so I'm still investigating ways to hoodwink the system into not tripping the CEL. Right now I've done the capacitor/resistor mod and I think it's working on my passenger side, so I'm going to try it on the driver side too. If that doesn't work I'll source minicats, because minicats mean I could potentially just replace my manifolds with headers and not worry about having to source high quality cats.

    I'm also still feeling the knock/rumble of the front suspension over small impacts, so that's the priority fix. Given that every ball joint boot in the front is shot, and the alignment seems to be ok with factory spec parts on the 885's, I think I'm just going to pick up the moog front end kit and install UCA/LCA/Tie Rods/rod ends when I do OME shocks and just do it all at the same time. That way I'm 100% squared away to just get alignments for permanent weight as necessary.

    Unrelated to that, I've got a significant valve cover oil leak on the passenger side. Holding off on that until I do the timing belt which will be the first major maintenance job I do to it after the suspension.

    I also threw a new battery in it because the old one started leaking and cranking poorly.
     
    Slashaar likes this.
  8. Oct 5, 2023 at 8:52 PM
    #28
    gkomo

    gkomo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2015
    Member:
    #169821
    Messages:
    2,181
    Gender:
    Male
    San Diego, CA
    Vehicle:
    2014 MGM AC SR5 4x4
    You just buy this and plug it in? Any setup required? Did you buy any separate mount for it or just the one it came with?

    Edit: never mind, didn’t see anything pre-2007 available for it
     
  9. Oct 6, 2023 at 7:59 AM
    #29
    xtremewlr

    xtremewlr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2018
    Member:
    #270626
    Messages:
    8,310
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Todd
    Tucson, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2003 4Runner V8 Limited
    4th gen T4R with a few mods
    Running the UltraGuage MX on my 2003, which would work fine on your 2004. Plugs into the OBD2 port under the dash. Setup is of the gauges themselves and how you want them displayed. The trans temp takes a little extra setup but I have the required configs in my build thread so you can get trans temp working. As for mounting, I have it mounted to a MobArmor magnetic base so nothing permanent but I have moved it since I did the install, I really like it in that spot.
     
    gkomo[QUOTED] and Slashaar like this.
  10. Oct 6, 2023 at 12:41 PM
    #30
    Slashaar

    Slashaar Trail Limo Supreme & Certified Hole Massager

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Member:
    #236717
    Messages:
    14,884
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Josh
    Kansas City, MO
    Vehicle:
    2015 Tacoma TRD-Sport DC LB
    Coastal HC Front, 6112s+650lb King Coils, JD 62 Swap + 14" Fox 2.0s
    It's super easy to use once you figure it out. Make sure you calibrate the MPG settings if you're going to use them on the first fill up to fill up. Actual Distance and Actual Fuel usage. Took me a minute to figure that out. Now I know I'm actually getting somewhere in the realm of 17 mpg rather than 15.
    Some manufacturer specific readouts need specific setup, but they have the info on their site.
     
    gkomo[QUOTED] likes this.
  11. Oct 6, 2023 at 8:57 PM
    #31
    gkomo

    gkomo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2015
    Member:
    #169821
    Messages:
    2,181
    Gender:
    Male
    San Diego, CA
    Vehicle:
    2014 MGM AC SR5 4x4
    is the the one you purchased?

    IMG_5783.png

    Reading the ‘read me first’ document it seemed like the one that was for < or = 2004 models, but just verifying as the other option for Land Cruiser (but also says Australia, so prob not) or whatever lists the 4.7
     
    Slashaar[QUOTED] likes this.
  12. Oct 6, 2023 at 9:18 PM
    #32
    xtremewlr

    xtremewlr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2018
    Member:
    #270626
    Messages:
    8,310
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Todd
    Tucson, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2003 4Runner V8 Limited
    4th gen T4R with a few mods
    You don't want the one for the Tacoma/Tundra CAN. The 4runner doesn't have CAN so the preprogramming won't work there. I don't think I selected anything preprogrammed and just bought the UG MX v1.4 by itself. The preprogramming is only for special guages anyhow. The only one you really want is for trans temp, which I have when you are ready.

    Mounting is up to you how you do it. I personally didn't like any of their mounting options and used the Mob Armor magnetic base.

    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0725Q9YP5
     
    Slashaar likes this.
  13. Oct 9, 2023 at 7:51 AM
    #33
    Slashaar

    Slashaar Trail Limo Supreme & Certified Hole Massager

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Member:
    #236717
    Messages:
    14,884
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Josh
    Kansas City, MO
    Vehicle:
    2015 Tacoma TRD-Sport DC LB
    Coastal HC Front, 6112s+650lb King Coils, JD 62 Swap + 14" Fox 2.0s
    That's what I got for my Tacoma if it's the MX not the EM. I had to switch the Trans pan and Torque converter temp programming to work with my 2015 though. If you have a 4R then defer to:

     
    gkomo[QUOTED] likes this.
  14. Oct 21, 2023 at 3:43 PM
    #34
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    Bought some stiff used OME front shocks, and jeez these ride WAY better than factory. The front actually feels controlled. All I need is some stiff rear shocks and it'll be squared away on the lift. Still needs ball joints (though boots and grease might be enough), links, and rod ends.

    CEL came back for the cats, so I'm going to wire up the extensions for the resistor/capacitor mod this weekend.
     
  15. Oct 24, 2023 at 7:29 AM
    #35
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    I was looking at my CV's again this morning to confirm the boots were ripped, and both inner boots are toast. Hopefully I can throw new boots/grease at them and they'll be fine, and I'm not about to repair end-of-life CV's
     
  16. Oct 24, 2023 at 2:39 PM
    #36
    xtremewlr

    xtremewlr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2018
    Member:
    #270626
    Messages:
    8,310
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Todd
    Tucson, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2003 4Runner V8 Limited
    4th gen T4R with a few mods
    You should be fine with new boots. I doubt the CVs are end of life. Mine have over 340k on them and the inner boots on both sides were ripped when I bought the truck, so for an unknown number of miles. Rebooted them and they have been fine for 60k miles since.
     
  17. Oct 25, 2023 at 6:14 AM
    #37
    Slashaar

    Slashaar Trail Limo Supreme & Certified Hole Massager

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2017
    Member:
    #236717
    Messages:
    14,884
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Josh
    Kansas City, MO
    Vehicle:
    2015 Tacoma TRD-Sport DC LB
    Coastal HC Front, 6112s+650lb King Coils, JD 62 Swap + 14" Fox 2.0s
    They aren't end of life if the ball bearings still look good. I doubt it ever got completely dry of grease and then got grit in them to wear them down. Reboot with new grease and run em.
     
  18. Nov 19, 2023 at 5:28 PM
    #38
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    PARTS!

    It needed wheel bearings, brake pads, and rotors, and the caliper pistons had seized on both sides from the PO not replacing the dust seals correctly. I also found some cheap wheel spacers to simulate a 0 offset wheel. It's now driving, riding, and braking well, though I still need to do the CV's, rear shocks, sway links, and ball joints.
     
    Slashaar likes this.
  19. Feb 18, 2024 at 12:01 PM
    #39
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    I'm not dead yet!

    Built a sleeping platform in the back to accommodate an RV bunk mattress, 32x75. The rest of that stuff arrives later this week.

    With this, I have a spot for my rifle case underneath, cooler to the side, and a lot of other gear storage, plus cubbies and nooks for tools and such. The goal is to be able to bring my cats along for extended trips so I want to sleep with them, inside the vehicle where I can keep an eye on them, and this should help preserve space to that end.

    PXL_20240218_194105354.jpg
     
    Slashaar and BassAckwards like this.
  20. Jun 6, 2024 at 11:39 AM
    #40
    EubeenHadd

    EubeenHadd [OP] Bit of a derp

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Member:
    #220828
    Messages:
    1,881
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Nick
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2005 T4R 4.7 AWD
    Encounter AT 32", OME 90021/885/895
    Been a minute!

    Updates:

    installed minicats, no more CEL, worth every penny.

    Replaced the rear OEM shocks with OME 63005's (I'm now on OME 885/895's and stiff matching shocks at all 4 corners. Anybody who says the stiff shocks are too much is far less tolerant of a capable ride than I am.)

    Viper cut the front bumper, removed the front mud flaps, and trimmed the rear ones down

    Did 3/4 front ball joints to fix leaky boots, still needs the lower right but that camber bolt is seized. Also replaced my sway bar links and CV boots. Still a bit clunky over bumps.

    Firestone fucked up my alignment cam tabs on the left side and I'm still working through getting them to replace/fix them. If they keep fucking them up or can't replace them properly then I'm going to DIY Total chaos plate units as soon as my buddy's shop is up to speed.

    Found a very cheap Spartan locker and I'll be installing that ASAP.

    The rear mattress platform is 10/10, best camping ever.
     
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2024
    Slashaar and T4R_hereforbearings like this.

Products Discussed in

To Top