1. Welcome to Tacoma World!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all Tacoma discussion topics
    • Communicate privately with other Tacoma owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

Muth Mirror Install Clarification

Discussion in 'Technical Chat' started by Mingy, Aug 3, 2008.

  1. Aug 3, 2008 at 4:17 PM
    #1
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    Hey all.

    Just got around to installing my Muth Mirrors on the Taco.

    What I thought was gonna take a lot of time - disassembly of panels and installation of the mirrors went pretty fast (90 minutes).

    I used a pry bar wrapped in electrical tape to remove the door snaps without damaging anything.

    The lower side panels are removed after you remove the knob down near where your feet go. Do the passenger side first, then remove the driver side foot rest (it just pulls off).

    I used a thin aluminum rod (1/16th dia) for TIG welding to route the wires through the corrugated boot from the door to the body. I bent the 'leading end' into a tight 'U' so it would not pierce the boot. The advantage to an aluminum rod is that it bends easily, and has no spring, so you can gently push it along and modify the path by bending the rod in the boot.

    What I thought was going to be a breeze - hooking up the wires took about 8 hours. I blame the otherwise excellent instructions which had me trying to figure out why the wires I found which had the right color codes but didn't function correctly. I was looking at the worng bundle.

    This is is how you locate the wires (ignore the instuctions)

    1) Ignore the wire bundle indicated by the arrow.
    2) Look at the connectors beside where the foot rest would be and locate the Black Wire with Red Stripe. This is the bundle you want.
    3) Carefully remove the electrical tape on that bundle. Carefully slit with a knife and peel off about 2"
    4) Force a pin through the Black-Red Stripe wire and start the engine. The voltage on the pin should show +12 to + 14 when the engine is running. This is the ACC wire.
    5) Locate the Blue - Black Stripe, Blue - Yellow Stripe, and Blue wires in the same bundle as the Black - Red Stripe wire.
    6) Ignore all the other same color wires - the ones you want are in the same bundle as the Black - Red Stripe wire.
    7) Hook up as per the instructions, but I put a 5 AMP fuse on the power to the module and my heater controller, so if the indicators died but not the other accessories I'd know why.

    Also, the mirrors come with a plastic protector which leaves a nasty film on the glass. Glass cleaner has no effect in it. I got a 'heavy duty industrial cleaner' at Home Depot and cleaned them a couple times before I was able to clean them properly with glass cleaner.

    I went through this ordeal because I wanted heated mirrors. I DID NOT pay Muth $65 for the controller they sell. I have an electronics design backgorund and made my own for about $5 but cost can depend on where you buy your parts.

    Let me know if there is interest in my circuit. If so I'll draw up the circuit and post it here. :)
     
  2. Aug 3, 2008 at 5:42 PM
    #2
    Simon's Mom

    Simon's Mom Wag More Bark Less

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2007
    Member:
    #1297
    Messages:
    9,321
    Gender:
    Female
    First Name:
    Judy or Jude :)
    SBurl Vermont
    Vehicle:
    13 TRD OR DC MGM
    Stock for now
    Good Write Up Mingy, way to make your own $5 part too. If you wouldn't mind, can you post some pics of your mirrors? Thanx
     
  3. Aug 3, 2008 at 5:47 PM
    #3
    rhoppas

    rhoppas Land of Oz

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2007
    Member:
    #2564
    Messages:
    1,301
    Gender:
    Male
    Topeka, KS
    Vehicle:
    07 Double Cab V6 TRD Sport Tow
    Earnhardt Cannons, Terra Grapplers, Viper alarm, Hunter4x4 Bull Bar, 6" Pro Comp Off-Road lights, extra set of bed D-rings, Chrome exhaust tip, Metra Ipod/MP3 adapter, Garmin GPS, CarriageWorks grill, Maglite mounted to driver seat, 9" Stubbie Antenna, WeatherTech floor liners, Saddleman Neoprene seat covers, DeeZee bed mat
    Yes, thanks for the write-up Mingy....good info. I would love some heated mirrors but I don't know if I would invest 10 hours into getting them.
     
  4. Aug 3, 2008 at 6:40 PM
    #4
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    If you use my guide to find the wires, it should take a total of 2 hours, give or take.

    I'll take pix tomorrow
     
  5. Aug 4, 2008 at 10:36 AM
    #5
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    So here are the pix of my Muth Mirror install showing left signal light flashing. Brakes lights are the same, except both flash amber. The arrows are much less visible inside the vehicle, except at night.

    muth left 2.jpg
    Muth Blind.jpg
    IMGP1450.jpg
     
  6. Aug 12, 2008 at 5:35 PM
    #6
    shawnd2

    shawnd2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2008
    Member:
    #8497
    Messages:
    531
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Shawn
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Vehicle:
    08 Tacoma Access Cab 4x4 TRD Offroad
    I would be interested in seeing the circuit you made. What switch did you use?
     
  7. Aug 13, 2008 at 7:00 AM
    #7
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    I asked Toyota about getting a switch and they wanted about $70 :eek:

    So I removed a 'blank' and measured the internal dimensions. Then I went shopping to Radio Shack and a few surplus stores until I found a nice black rocker switch about 3/4" x 3/8". Then I cut a square hole in the blank with the dremel and installed the switch in the blank.

    Its not exactly OEM but it looks pretty good. You only need a simple SPST (SPDT will do) than can handle a few milliamps, and pretty much any switch will handle a few amps.

    The Muth kit has a big, ugly switch which they seems to want you to drill a hole in your dash with a hole saw to make it fit. Not gonna happen in my truck.

    It will take me a couple days to redraw the circuit and post it here.
     
  8. Aug 14, 2008 at 2:56 PM
    #8
    shawnd2

    shawnd2 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2008
    Member:
    #8497
    Messages:
    531
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Shawn
    Toronto, Ontario, Canada
    Vehicle:
    08 Tacoma Access Cab 4x4 TRD Offroad
    Mingy,

    Thanks, I appreciate it. It's good to see some local people (I live near Mississauga) that are into working on there trucks.

    Shawn
     
  9. Aug 14, 2008 at 6:31 PM
    #9
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    So for the switches and the other parts I'll show in my circuit, the best place to go is Sayal - they have a location in Mississauga and Burlington.

    Stay tuned - I should post this weekend.
     
  10. Aug 14, 2008 at 6:58 PM
    #10
    scottiem

    scottiem Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6846
    Messages:
    61
    Oklahoma City
    Vehicle:
    '07 PreRunner TRD Sport
    Mingy good write up, I was just considering getting some Muth before the winter sets in and you might have persuaded me. Couple of quick questions.
    1. Where did you get them as have been looking at different sites.
    2. How did you go about getting the glass out of the side view mirrors and how did the Muth's install
    3. Looking forward to your post on the circuit as like you I can't see paying $65 for something you can make for $5.

    Thanks again for the great write up.

    Scott
     
  11. Aug 15, 2008 at 5:47 AM
    #11
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    Scott

    I got them here http://www.accessconnect.com/toyota_signal_mirrors.htm they seemed very helpful, and I got them promptly, etc. They even sent them by mail, saving me a lot of money UPS would usually gouge me for (they tack on $40 or more for 'brokerage' to Canada, even though this takes 5 minutes at the post office).

    The complete process is shown at Muth http://www.muthco.com/products/kits/220-0269.htm - download installation manual.

    Removing the glass is easy - basically tilt the mirror up (like you want to see the sky) and slip a large flatblade screwdriver between the two plastic pieces & pry - it pops right off. You could replace the mirror on the call, but because you have to run wires, you have to take the mirror mechanism, etc, apart).

    By the way, if you just want a heated mirror, you could do better by getting replacement mirror with a heating pad this place sells the pads http://www.automirrorsplus.com/store2/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=246 but auto glass places can get you a mirror with the pad. The problem is my local guys (this is Canada, remember) wanted almost as much as me buying the Muth solution.

    So, stay tuned for the circuit

    Ok I added the circuit in PDF

    Most of the parts can be got at any electronics components store (Fry's, Sayal, Active, etc.). Remember to get a little PCB (about 1 x 2" should do). The parts are not critical, especially resistors and capacitors, but the relative value are (don't change the 10k for 100K but 22k would likely work). You might want to buy double the parts, except the switch any relay, and if you aren't used to putting circuits together a 'breadboard' would help. Make sure it works before you try an install it. I tested with a 9 volt battery and it worked ok.

    Don't overdo the relay - you only need to switch a few amps - the muth pads take 1 amp each. If you use a different heater, measure the resistance then figure Amps = 2 * 14.5/resistance of one heater. You may have to go to a bigger fuse than 5 amps on the fuse but I doubt it. The location of the red wire with black stripe is on a bundle behind the panel near the drivers left foot. It is easy to remove.

    The circuit works like this: on power on the 555 is reset by R2C2 circuit and triggered some times later by the R1C1 circuit. This forces 'Q' high, which causes current to flow through R5 and the base of Q1, turning the transistor 'On'. This allow current to pass through the relay coil, turning the relay on, powering the heater. (D1 is an anti-kickback diode which may alread be in the coil of the relay - make sure you get the polarity of the coil correct). Switching Q1 on also allows current to flow through R6, which causes the LED to turn on. After about 20 minutes (determined by R4 and C4) the 555 switches 'Off' which turns off the transistor and then the relay.

    When the switch is in the 'On' position, and the car is started, the timer runs for about 20 minutes then stops. if the switch is turned off, or the car is switched off, R4C4 discharge through D2, so if the switch or car are turned on the cycle is repeated for another 20 minutes. I have found 20 minutes works pretty good. You may want more or less, so to increase, increase C4 and to decrease decrease C4.

    Good luck - if you spot any errors let me know :rolleyes:
     

    Attached Files:

  12. Oct 14, 2008 at 8:51 AM
    #12
    CraigTRD

    CraigTRD Canadian in the South

    Joined:
    Sep 6, 2008
    Member:
    #9037
    Messages:
    507
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Craig
    London, Ontario, Canada
    Vehicle:
    Tacoma
    6" FabTech Lift, Custom rear leaf packs, RedLine gas hood props :D, Hockey Stick Canadian Flag Mod. 2012 Front
    That would be cool to use a POT for R4. Hide it up under the dash for adjustment......
     
  13. Oct 14, 2008 at 9:32 AM
    #13
    Agent475

    Agent475 "Mark It Zero"

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2008
    Member:
    #8829
    Messages:
    2,876
    Gender:
    Male
    Waldorf, MD
    Vehicle:
    2006 Red TRD Sport
    Hood Struts, 3" Tuff Country Lift, Shortie Antenna, WeatherTechs, Tinted front windows, custom TRD seat covers, custom pedals, debadged, custom USMC badging, quasi-functional hoodscoop (i.e. I cut it open), black front Yota emblem, Tailgate Theft-Prevention mod, Horn Relocation mod, Old Man Emu Carrier Bearing Drop, Brighter Backup Lights Mod, Smittybilt Reciever Hitch Tow Point, currently working on Satoshi Grill Mod
    Cool mod!
     
  14. Dec 16, 2008 at 2:00 PM
    #14
    Teufel Hunden

    Teufel Hunden No Better Friend, No Worse Enemy

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Member:
    #8415
    Messages:
    130
    Gender:
    Male
    Northern Virginia
    Vehicle:
    09 MGray DC SB TRD-OR 4x4 V6 Auto SR5
    Undercover tonneau, OEM tow package with hitch, OEM retractable roof rack, Front window tint (legal), WeatherTech FloorLiners, Door sill protectors, Tacoma bed mat, Rear leaf spring TSB, OEM DRL mod, Door edge guards, AFE Pro-Dry S Air Filter, Removed secondary air filter, Smoked LED 3rd brake light, Romik running boards, Go Rhino hitch step, Extra set of D-rings mod, Bed cargo net, TRD wheel locks, OBX sport pedal covers.
    This is a great write-up "MINGY"! Thanks!

    I just purchased my kit, but I need a little help before I do the install: I have a 2009 Double-Cab with the OEM Daytime Running Lights. This means my front turn signals are always on unless I am signaling, or my headlights are on. So, if I want the signal lights in the mirrors to work properly, I will have to tap into the wires that control the rear signal lights, and not the front ones. Are the wires that you tapped into for the front signals? If so, do you know where the wires for the rear signals are located, and what color they are? Thanks in advance for any help that you can give!
     
  15. Dec 17, 2008 at 6:11 AM
    #15
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    So, if you follow my instructions, you should be ok. That's why I explained exactly how to find the correct wires - there are many with the same coding that aren't the one you want. Maybe the wrong ones are the front ones, but the ones I explain how to find will for certain work.

    Did you download the Muth manual? The pix there are useful, but, as noted, a bit misleading, hence my clarification.

    If you need any further help, let me know and I'll take a picture this weekend. I have since installed a backup cam, which means the area is a bit crowded, but I'm sure we can work it out.

    I found it useful to probe my 'suspect' wires (the wires I thought were the right ones) with a voltmeter with a really pointy test lead. They are so cheap these days, I have a bunch of meters and I took the one with the pointiest lead and basically pushed the tip into the insulation while the flasher was on. It leaves a tiny pinprick sized hole in the insulation but because this is a low voltage system there is no danger from doing this.

    If you are worried about corrosion, you can wrap the pieced wire with electrical tape, but I wouldn't bother.
     
  16. Dec 17, 2008 at 8:00 AM
    #16
    TRD Larry

    TRD Larry trd larry

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2007
    Member:
    #2792
    Messages:
    494
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Larry
    South Park, PA
    Vehicle:
    08 Tacoma Black,Sport package,
    Sport pedals, Extang full-tilt cover, Magnaflow exhaust system, XPEL invisible paint protection, TRD short Shifter, Hood struts, Homelink mirror, Dbl power outlets,Kuhmo 275x55x20, Platinum #220 Abyss wheels 20x9.5. Muth heated signal mirrors TSB. Lo-Tek Pilllar pod with Glow-Shift gauges, 4x4 illuminated switch, Pioneer Z110BT (upgraded to Z130BT) w/2011 toyota tailgate backup camera,traffic tuner, parking brake bypass. Leather interior w/heated seats. LED's installed in glove box, center console, front and rear cupholders, rear console vent, AFE CAI, LED taillights, under hood lights, LED bed lights, oil catch can, extra D-rings installed in bed, frame replaced, Bilstein 5100, fronts set at.85, FOCAL Auditor 6.5" componet speakers. Replaced lower center dash panel with 2011 dash panel, installed USB charger and relocated seat heater switches to lower panel.
    Mingy, I would be intertested in seeing a picture of your switch. I did something similar,except I cut a hole in the blank and mounted the Muth switch in that. If your switch is smaller it probably looks better than mine.

    I'm catching up on the news I have been visiting my daughter in St. Augustine Fla. leaving today to return to the north. I hate leaving the 75-76 temperatures for the cold north. I live for the day i can move down here. Always summer.
     
  17. Dec 17, 2008 at 8:43 AM
    #17
    Teufel Hunden

    Teufel Hunden No Better Friend, No Worse Enemy

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Member:
    #8415
    Messages:
    130
    Gender:
    Male
    Northern Virginia
    Vehicle:
    09 MGray DC SB TRD-OR 4x4 V6 Auto SR5
    Undercover tonneau, OEM tow package with hitch, OEM retractable roof rack, Front window tint (legal), WeatherTech FloorLiners, Door sill protectors, Tacoma bed mat, Rear leaf spring TSB, OEM DRL mod, Door edge guards, AFE Pro-Dry S Air Filter, Removed secondary air filter, Smoked LED 3rd brake light, Romik running boards, Go Rhino hitch step, Extra set of D-rings mod, Bed cargo net, TRD wheel locks, OBX sport pedal covers.
    Thanks for the response! Yes, I did download the manual. Now that I know that your instructions are for a Tacoma with the DRL's, I will just follow your install exactly as you wrote them.

    If you have time, then a picture would be great and very useful. I don't plan on doing my install for a few weeks yet, so if you have time to get some pics, then I would really appreciate it. The more prepared I am, and the more I know what to do and look for, then the less chance I will mess up the install.

    I have a multimeter, but I will have to go out and buy some super pointy probes, like you suggested. I'm not worried about the corrosion factor either.

    Thanks again for all of your help!
     
  18. Dec 17, 2008 at 10:23 AM
    #18
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    Ok will do - I put it on my list for Saturday
     
  19. Dec 21, 2008 at 7:54 AM
    #19
    Teufel Hunden

    Teufel Hunden No Better Friend, No Worse Enemy

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2008
    Member:
    #8415
    Messages:
    130
    Gender:
    Male
    Northern Virginia
    Vehicle:
    09 MGray DC SB TRD-OR 4x4 V6 Auto SR5
    Undercover tonneau, OEM tow package with hitch, OEM retractable roof rack, Front window tint (legal), WeatherTech FloorLiners, Door sill protectors, Tacoma bed mat, Rear leaf spring TSB, OEM DRL mod, Door edge guards, AFE Pro-Dry S Air Filter, Removed secondary air filter, Smoked LED 3rd brake light, Romik running boards, Go Rhino hitch step, Extra set of D-rings mod, Bed cargo net, TRD wheel locks, OBX sport pedal covers.
    Awesome! Thanks!
     
  20. Dec 21, 2008 at 4:07 PM
    #20
    Mingy

    Mingy [OP] Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2008
    Member:
    #6164
    Messages:
    114
    Milton, Ontario
    Vehicle:
    V6 uble Cab TRX/Towing
    Lear cap.
    Ok. Sorry for the delay we've had a couple snowstorms Friday and today, which meant priorities, mainly clearing snow. Plus it's been cold.

    I don't know if this picture will help because the area is so crowded, but you can see the 'tab' connectors and which bundle I had to slice open to get to the correct wires.

    I couldn't figure out how to put a document 'in line' so I put an attachment



    [​IMG]

    MUTH 1-1.jpg
     
To Top