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Need some opinions on winches

Discussion in 'Off-Roading & Trails' started by johnwhips, Sep 6, 2016.

  1. Sep 6, 2016 at 7:45 PM
    #1
    johnwhips

    johnwhips [OP] Active Member

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    was going to mount a winch, thinking 9000-10000 lbs. I've seen several online.

    First: electric or hydraulic?

    Second: steel cable or synthetic?

    Any advice is most appreciated.
     
  2. Sep 6, 2016 at 7:50 PM
    #2
    Trowbocop

    Trowbocop Adventurer

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    I installed a 10k lb synthetic lined smittybilt x20. Saw good reviews, have yet to test it. But I'm stoked to have it if I need it. It's affordable, and good enough for what I'll need it for. You'll need to assess how often you'll be needing yours, also how much capital you have laying around. These get expensive quick, if you look for the nicest you can find.
     
  3. Sep 6, 2016 at 7:54 PM
    #3
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 Vehicle Design Engineer

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    What is your vehicle? It isn't listed in your profile. And how do you plan to use it? Different use cases will return different recommendations. Dedicated weekend rock crawler? Daily driver that occasionally sees some trails?

    Almost all modern vehicles use electric winches, PTOs are very dated. Synthetic is better than steel in most use cases, it is lighter and easier to manage but does cost more.

    If this is your daily driver, I suggest paying close attention to weight. A winch plus mounting system on the nose of the vehicle does affect suspension and handling dynamics. The Warn M8000-s is a solid well built winch that is reasonably priced and moderately light, though it is only 8000lbs. Excellent as an insurance policy or even light-moderate use. For moderate to heavy use I would look at 9000lbs plus, but it all depends on your use case.
     
  4. Sep 6, 2016 at 8:48 PM
    #4
    johnwhips

    johnwhips [OP] Active Member

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    I have a 3rd gen Tacoma, OR DC.

    Thanks for the advice, this will be my daily driver, want the winch for hunting season.

    Plan on using the winch maybe 10 times a year (plus having it as a safety net).

    The reviews on Warn are definately positive, I will consider that for sure.

    Have you heard much about engo? It is one of the options that for on the OEM bumper I'm looking at.

    As far as weight is concerned. The bumper/winch combo is right at 200 lbs (minus the original bumper). Too much weight for a daily driver?

    The main reason for the OEM bumper is protection from head on collisions as there are a lot of deer where I drive, and there is a lot of plastic on the front of these 3rd gen tacos.
     
  5. Sep 6, 2016 at 9:28 PM
    #5
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 Vehicle Design Engineer

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    What kind of pulls are you seeing yourself doing? Stuck in a muddy road, or just barely high-centered and need a short pull to get unstuck, or climbing something so bad you can't drive up? The OR with ATRAC and rear locker plus good tires will take a lot to get stuck.

    I hadn't heard about Engo, but just did some quick reading. Looks like former guys from Mile Marker pricing themselves inline with Harbor Freight. The HF winces are also known to be a 'good value'. In my Wrangler Rubicon if I was winching and it didn't work, I was really screwed. I gladly paid the premium for the Warn, because failure was not an option. I'm not going to take my Tacoma into those same scenarios, the truck just isn't as extreme as the wrangler. If you are doing basic pulls to get unstuck on hunting roads a value oriented winch may be the more logical route.

    Just for relative comparison purposes, the Engo 9k is 86lbs (didn't specify steel or synthetic, presume steel) and the M8000-s is 55lbs. Going synthetic on the Engo would probably shave nearly 20lbs.

    You can thank your pedestrian impact zone for all that open air plastic. What bumper are you looking at? 200lbs on the nose is going to require upgraded suspension to compensate. Your bump stops will be nice and clean from constant contact at that weight. Too much is all relative, it is really about your expectations. The nose will be less controlled over bumps (especially without upgraded suspension) and your truck will not be as nimble. Some people care, others don't. I do.
     
  6. Sep 6, 2016 at 11:23 PM
    #6
    johnwhips

    johnwhips [OP] Active Member

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    What kind of suspension upgrade, something in addition to the current suspension or replacement all together? The last thing I want to do is significantly alter the handling or rude of the truck.

    Doubt it helps at all, but I was planning on putting a 2" level on it when I have the bumper installed.

    Weight was definately something I was worried about given we're talking about a midsize truck, but even with a grill guard, there is a lot of exposed plastic.

    Fab Fours TT16-B3650-1 grill guard with winch front bumper is what I was looking at. Don't really care for the flashy look, but thought it would add some serious protection, was having a hard time finding a lighter and more conservative option, but would welcome suggestions with open arms.

    Mainly just want something that is going to replace all the damn plastic, and protect the lights and radiator while I was at it.

    Winch is a plus (was leaning towards synthetic rope) but if the additional weight is an issue and thus requiring a lot of additional upgrades (suspension), I'd be fine without the winch, and just get the bumper installed (weighs 140 lbs). Dont plan on doing any rock crawling or anything, was just going to use the winch to get unstuck from some serious mud, and occasionally use it to hoist up large game while skinning it.

    Do you think there would there be a significant improvement in the issues you mentioned above with only the bumper (140 lbs)?
     
  7. Sep 7, 2016 at 12:49 AM
    #7
    johnwhips

    johnwhips [OP] Active Member

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    After doing a little research, it sounds like if I had the extra 200lbs up front, all I'd have to do (if unhappy with the ride), is replace the front springs with 700's... Am I understanding this correctly?
     
  8. Sep 7, 2016 at 9:05 AM
    #8
    crashnburn80

    crashnburn80 Vehicle Design Engineer

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    That bumper with the guard is listed as 185lbs on Fab Fours site, with no winch. Adding the ENGO winch with synthetic line and you are about 250lbs. While it won't be as strong as steel, you could go with an aluminum bumper like Pelfreybilt, which will all the hoops and grill guard weighs 70lbs and is a significant protection upgrade over stock.
    http://www.pelfreybilt.com/16-tacoma-front-plate-bumper

    With the Warn winch and the aluminum bumper with the extra grill guard, you'd be looking at 125lbs.

    Correct, you would want to upgrade the spring rate to compensate for the weight. With 200+ lbs on the front 700 would likely be a good rate. With upgraded springs you would really want upgraded dampening as well (shocks), so you would probably be looking at new front suspension to do it right, and might as well replace the rear shocks to match at that point. Of course you could do the bumper/winch first and see if you feel doing the suspension is necessary.
     
  9. Sep 7, 2016 at 9:33 AM
    #9
    johnwhips

    johnwhips [OP] Active Member

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    Right on great info, really appreciate it
     
  10. Sep 7, 2016 at 10:39 AM
    #10
    Box Rocket

    Box Rocket Well-Known Member

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    I'd definitely go electric over hydraulic. From my experience, hydraulic winches have not been reliable. Also I suggest synthetic rope over wire rope. Synthetic is lighter and MUCH safer and will be plenty strong for almost any scenario. In my mind there is really no reason to not go with synthetic rope. Yeah it may not last as long as wire rope, but the other benefits far outweigh that.

    Most important thing is to get a winch that is reliable. A winch needs to work 100% of the time. You don't want to be stuck somewhere and have your winch not work. So stay away from budget winches for the most part. With very few exceptions they just don't have the level of quality to give total reliability. they may work for a while, but you'll always wonder when it might not work. Go with a winch with proven reliability. Also a company that you can be confident will be around for a while and will offer support and parts if you need them down the road.

    IMO the two brands to choose from are ComeUp and Warn. In that order. :)
     
  11. Sep 7, 2016 at 1:23 PM
    #11
    johnwhips

    johnwhips [OP] Active Member

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    Thanks for the advice, I'm with you on the winch specs, now just have to figure out the rest :)
     
  12. Oct 9, 2016 at 4:01 PM
    #12
    FFBlack

    FFBlack Well-Known Member

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    You can rent a winch at my local Renaissance fest some have some really nice specs and they will carry your beer and tie your shoe , get you a turkey leg. Nice to try em before you buy em.:stirthepot:
     

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