1. Welcome to Tacoma World!

    You are currently viewing as a guest! To get full-access, you need to register for a FREE account.

    As a registered member, you’ll be able to:
    • Participate in all Tacoma discussion topics
    • Communicate privately with other Tacoma owners from around the world
    • Post your own photos in our Members Gallery
    • Access all special features of the site

New install of woofers and it sounds terrible.....help

Discussion in 'Audio & Video' started by GoBucks!, Oct 7, 2015.

  1. Oct 7, 2015 at 2:57 PM
    #1
    GoBucks!

    GoBucks! [OP] Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Member:
    #160094
    Messages:
    14
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2013 Magnetic Gray
    Just finished a budget SQ install in my 2013 Taco double cab. The goal was SQ with a little SPL with respects to the following components:

    H/U: Pioneer AVH-x4700BS
    Subs: 2 RF P2D2-8's wired at 2 ohms, sealed enclosure with total of 0.7 ft^3 air space
    Amp: RF Prime R500x1D

    The woofer box is a wedge located behind the rear seats and the woofers have only about 1" of room to the seatback. I have internal supports to reduce flex and added a layer of polyfill to the internal surfaces.

    The sound is loud at best. Subs are not dropping to the lower range of Hz and cannot really feel the bass. Also, the bass sounds kinda hollow, not strong or accurate. I am playing songs that I have listened to 1,000 times, so I can anticipate how the bass should sound.

    I previously had one Image Dynamics ID8 in a ported enclosure with 350w in an extended cab S10 that totally ripped for a single 8" woofer. So my current setup is very disappointing.

    Any ideas on how to extract more accurate bass that can be actual felt with these components?
    [​IMG]
     
  2. Oct 7, 2015 at 5:16 PM
    #2
    manethon

    manethon TTAS

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2013
    Member:
    #114161
    Messages:
    3,580
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    John
    Toronto
    Many
    imo prob a power issue and tad to small of a box.
     
  3. Oct 7, 2015 at 5:18 PM
    #3
    WildLand

    WildLand Does Ursus arctos defecate in deciduous forest?

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2012
    Member:
    #93212
    Messages:
    10,482
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Fish
    AZ
    Vehicle:
    13T4RTRAILKDSS
    Patches on headliner
  4. Oct 7, 2015 at 8:13 PM
    #4
    GoBucks!

    GoBucks! [OP] Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Member:
    #160094
    Messages:
    14
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2013 Magnetic Gray
    Was goofing around again with the settings on the H/U and out of frustration to the terrible sub performance, I turned off the EQ adjustments on the Pioneer to the subs. All of a sudden the Rockfords came alive and instantly sounded better! They started hitting the low notes, the hollow/ canned sound was gone.

    Do you think the Pioneer and the amp were doubling up control over the subs and both sources of adjustment were fighting each other?

    So as of right now, only the amp is adjusting the parameters for the subs. I still need to tweak the setup, but maybe this was the issue!
     
  5. Oct 8, 2015 at 6:39 AM
    #5
    ranger098

    ranger098 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2014
    Member:
    #130377
    Messages:
    754
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Brian
    Minnesota
    Tuning is critical, but also remember that a ported setup will go alot lower than your new sealed setup. Youll get clearer tighter bass hits but wont "feel" the bass as much.... Glad you're working it out though! looks nice back there
     
  6. Oct 8, 2015 at 7:34 AM
    #6
    ike3000

    ike3000 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2013
    Member:
    #103001
    Messages:
    307
    Gender:
    Male
    Did you have any crossover settings on your HU?
     
  7. Oct 8, 2015 at 9:56 AM
    #7
    GoBucks!

    GoBucks! [OP] Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Member:
    #160094
    Messages:
    14
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2013 Magnetic Gray
    Currently the H/U settings are off. I thought about turning the amp filters off and trying to tweak with the H/U.
     
  8. Oct 8, 2015 at 10:13 AM
    #8
    ike3000

    ike3000 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2013
    Member:
    #103001
    Messages:
    307
    Gender:
    Male
    So if you had filters set on both your HU and amp, then you probably had a phase shift that put the subs out of phase (and subsequently on a much more steep slope). I would set a low pass crossover on your HU or amp, but definitely not both. I prefer the HU for ease of adjustment.
     
    Ugly Betty likes this.
  9. Oct 9, 2015 at 9:10 AM
    #9
    GoBucks!

    GoBucks! [OP] Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Member:
    #160094
    Messages:
    14
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2013 Magnetic Gray
    Update: I took the rear seat out so no air restrictions on the subs. Also adjusted the settings on the amp only, the H/U low pass is still off. Finally the subs are producing bass notes that sound correct. But, this is a big but, the volume of the subs is not loud. You can basically talk to a passenger without yelling.

    I am totally confused at this point. Out of desperation, I thought about throwing the single Image Dynamics ID8 with ported box and/ or wiring up the Precision Power S850.1D and see if that combo will rock my Tacoma like it did in the old S10 extended cab.

    This has been the most frustrating sub and amp setup I have experienced. It is a shame because this is my first experience with Rockford. I hope to find a solution.
     
  10. Oct 9, 2015 at 11:09 AM
    #10
    JaysTOY

    JaysTOY Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2011
    Member:
    #53334
    Messages:
    60
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    J
    Cincy, OH
    Vehicle:
    4x4 debadged sport
    I know you stated you wired the subs to a 2 ohm load, those are dual voice coil 2 ohm subs correct?

    How exactly did you wire them?

    If you wired them incorrectly then your ohms would be much higher and your amp produces much less rms wattage, so the sound would sound much lower.

    J
     
  11. Oct 9, 2015 at 11:13 AM
    #11
    JaysTOY

    JaysTOY Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2011
    Member:
    #53334
    Messages:
    60
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    J
    Cincy, OH
    Vehicle:
    4x4 debadged sport
    image.jpg

    This is how it should be wired for a two ohm load.
     
  12. Oct 9, 2015 at 11:13 AM
    #12
    VandalTaco

    VandalTaco Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2014
    Member:
    #145129
    Messages:
    1,045
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Will
    Moscow/Idaho falls, Idaho
    Vehicle:
    07 DCSB TRD SPORT
    OME 887 lift, 16" XD addicts, 285 duratracs, leather seats, badass JL/Focal stereo
    You went from a ported setup to a sealed setup. The two will sound very different. The ported setup will sound lower and will be a lot louder. I'd look for a ported box...
     
    EasyLivin likes this.
  13. Oct 9, 2015 at 11:25 AM
    #13
    JaysTOY

    JaysTOY Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2011
    Member:
    #53334
    Messages:
    60
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    J
    Cincy, OH
    Vehicle:
    4x4 debadged sport
    According to the specs the ppi is rated at 600 watts at 2ohm so it is slightly more powerful than the rf rating of 500 watts at 2 ohm.

    First I would make sure you have a 2 ohm load and verify your gain is adjusted properly to the output of your head unit.

    Jay
     
    Aw9d likes this.
  14. Oct 9, 2015 at 12:39 PM
    #14
    GoBucks!

    GoBucks! [OP] Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Member:
    #160094
    Messages:
    14
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2013 Magnetic Gray
    After wiring and mounting the subs in the box, I used a multimeter to double check the ohm load at the terminal connection, which read 1.8.

    A Rockford Fosgate technician suggested that I disconnect the subs from the amp and hook up a 9V battery to make sure the subs are in phase. I will try that later tonight.
     
  15. Oct 9, 2015 at 12:47 PM
    #15
    EasyLivin

    EasyLivin Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2014
    Member:
    #133024
    Messages:
    382
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Jeff
    Euless, TX
    Vehicle:
    2014 White TRD OffRoad Double Cab
    Focal PS165AC / Focal PS165V / Alpine PDR V75 / Kenwood Excelon KFC-XW1000F / Leer 100XR shell / Bilstein 5100 lift
    I would see about porting the box. Any port will do if you are looking for sustained bass (i.e. hip-hop, etc.) rather than punched bass (rock, metal, drums). To truly maximize the sound, you need to tune the box to the resonate frequency of the subs, but that is a whole other animal. Did you back fill with batting in the sealed box?
     
  16. Oct 9, 2015 at 12:55 PM
    #16
    GoBucks!

    GoBucks! [OP] Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Member:
    #160094
    Messages:
    14
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2013 Magnetic Gray
    About 1/2" of polyfill lines the interior of the box.
     
  17. Oct 9, 2015 at 1:06 PM
    #17
    Aw9d

    Aw9d That one guy

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2011
    Member:
    #66635
    Messages:
    18,587
    Gender:
    Male
    Ported vs sealed won't matter too much if the box is built right for the sub. A sub is only as good as the box you put it in. Pre-made boxes from online stores are typically crap.

    I'd try this.
    1. Make sure they are in phase and at 2ohms as other have stated.
    2. Turn off all the bullshit filters on the amp. 99% of them are useless.
    3. Set your sub crossover to LP and set it low as possible.
    4. Set gain all the way down.
    5. Play a song and begin to turn the gain up slowly. You should start getting decent low frequencies.
    6. From here you'll need to mess with gain and crossover until it sounds right. I can't tell you what to set it too because subs sound different per boxes. I haven't looked at your amp to see what settings it has for crossover. You'll find a sweetspot during tuning.

    Other things to check for:
    Make sure the air space is proper for the subs you have.
    Make sure the back of the sub isn't touching the wall of the box and has enough room to breath.
    Double check wiring
    Don't use the fancy features on the HU or amp unless you 100% know what they do and how to use them. Typically these are useless and just create distortion.

    Happy hunting.
     
    EasyLivin likes this.
  18. Oct 9, 2015 at 2:51 PM
    #18
    GoBucks!

    GoBucks! [OP] Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Member:
    #160094
    Messages:
    14
    Gender:
    Male
    Vehicle:
    2013 Magnetic Gray
    The subs call for .26 ft^3 each for minimum airspace. I am .35 ft^3 each, total box of .7 ft^3 after woofer displacement and minus internal braces.

    The Rockford Prime R500x.1D adjustments/ settings don't turn off. Should I adjust the frequency to 250 Hz and adjust bass boost to 0 to basically "bypass" the amp filters?
     
  19. Oct 9, 2015 at 6:26 PM
    #19
    6spd

    6spd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2012
    Member:
    #72162
    Messages:
    874
    Gender:
    Male
    san diego
    Vehicle:
    2012 4x4
    leave bass boost to zero on everything(head unit, amp)
    set crossover to 100hz or lower. setting the crossover point at its lowest could go to the subsonic range, and you want get any output at all(below 20hz).
    set your gains on your amp as you would normally(play stere volume to 75%, or your maximum listening level, and adjust the level on your amp).

    if you are still not getting decent sound with these steps, something is wired wrong, the box is not made for the subs, or you still need a bit of dsp tuning to get them sounding awesome.
     
    Arkansas30 likes this.
  20. Oct 13, 2015 at 1:19 PM
    #20
    mbrogz3000

    mbrogz3000 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2011
    Member:
    #65009
    Messages:
    1,087
    Gender:
    Male
    First Name:
    Matt
    Northern NJ
    Vehicle:
    2020 Toyota 4Runner Limited
    Perhaps its the gain on the amp not set high enough?

    For my Alpine sub amp, which I set with an oscope, I actually was able to turn the gain up to about 75% without clipping. Thats with my HU unit putting out a true 5 Volts (its only rated for 4 Volts) at 32 of 35 volume level. I set it a month ago, but I believe I used -7.5 dB, so there is lots of headway for bass boosted tracks. I used a Steve Meade 40 Hz track and his process.

    On the first attemp, I had it set very low because I couldn't believe I was able to turn the gain up so high, so the bass was quiet for my case. I set it about 5 times on different days before I felt comfortable turning the gain up that high...ultimately, I ended with a nice fat sine wave with no noise. Slightly above that that 75% level, and my sine wave peaks started getting the noise riding the sine wave. And further from there, it was flattening out (clipping).

    Its either gain, wiring (maybe gauge size is too small), or a box volume (maybe an unsealed hole?) problem. Try recalculating your internal box volume...the notch, sub volume and bracing should be accounted for in the design (box dimensions need to grow a bit to make up the difference) to be accurate.
     

Products Discussed in

To Top