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Ow/20 Oil Weight

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016+)' started by Dblcabber, Mar 31, 2016.

  1. Apr 4, 2016 at 1:15 AM
    #41
    imom

    imom Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like you're pretty fixated on using heavier weight oils. I live in a warm climate as well, but I still use 0W-20. I also try to find gear oil that's thin enough to lube the tranny well so the shifting is smooth.

    If you did some research and look at the different oil companies marketing information you'll see most of the damage is within the first 20 minutes of start up. If you do a lot of short distance driving or don't let the engine warm up a bit... the motor will not get the lubrication it needs... now if you go with heavier weight oil...it'll take even longer.

    Toyota 0w-20
    100C vis .... 8.8 cSt
    40C vis .....39.3 cSt
    VI .......... 214

    Mobil 1 5W-30
    Viscosity @ 100ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 11.0
    Viscosity, @ 40ºC, cSt (ASTM D445) 61.7
    Viscosity Index 172

    So going by 5W-30...you'll get more protection at higher temps like you would if you were to race the truck at a track or off road racing. But would you feel good that the thicker oil is taking longer to lubricate in the first 10 to 20 minutes when the engine is cold and doesn't have a lot of oil? The other issue is not a lot of conventional oils have a high viscosity index.

    Manufacturers do a lot of running changes. I bought a header and said it was designed for 2014, but it didn't fit. The vendor that made the header didn't realize Toyota changed the design of the air injection unit...I had to get a modified one and it'll be that way for all their future. I buy parts from Toyota and their part numbers changed... they change quite often actually the parts I've been looking at. There are many reasons for that, but the public doesn't know why.

    So if Toyota specs out 0w-20 and then tell you to only use 5K OCI instead of 10K, there's a reason for it.

    The world won't end if you use 5w-30 etc... these engines are not high tech high output engines...sadly this is the weakest engine I had in close to a decade. It's made to be reliable not high torque high HP. So I recommend you make decisions based on measured facts and then decide what's best for your vehicle. Just my advice.
     
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  2. Apr 4, 2016 at 1:34 AM
    #42
    evilfij

    evilfij Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the thoughts. I do appreciate it and knowing that Toyota 0w20 is actually really good oil makes me feel a little better about it. Ordered a case off Amazon. But yes, I probably will run 5w30 or 0w30 or 0w40 once I get out of warranty. Deciding how OCD to be about oil changes with this truck. 5k sounds fine to me if I am honest, but I may do every 3k. My VW gets 10k services, but it is diesel and does nearly exclusively highway miles and longish trips.

    Have you switched your transmission to Redline MT90 or similar yet? It made a huge difference on both my lotus with cold shifting. My land rovers seem to love MTL. That is on my list to do soon -->MT90 in the taco.
     
  3. Apr 4, 2016 at 1:52 AM
    #43
    imom

    imom Well-Known Member

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    With todays oil...I can't see why you would go with 3K OCI. I still don't understand why you would go with xw30 or xw40 oils... I can only suggest you save the money on 3K OCI and send an oil sample for analysis. It'll tell you exactly what your motor is doing and what they would recommend.

    I have not yet switched to MT90...I deciding still MTL or MT90 or a blend. I had a BRZ before and it's known for tranny issues...I tried everything. I had used royal purple and it helped from the 2nd gear shift... compare to the BRZ, the taco is night and day difference better, but it's not like some german cars I have had or driven. I'm not a fan of the AISIN trannys...It was also in the BRZ...but the Taco is okay. I just like it when a tranny shifts like butter...kind hard to ask for when it has a lot of slop and not a race car transmission.

    I noticed you have a brand new truck...but you bought oil... I used not not let the dealer touch my truck, but recently I found my local dealer still far Bob Smith Toyota doing decent work. I have not had any complaints from their work, so I didn't mind they did the oil change. But now that my free oil change is out...I was going to buy Toyota oil, but I ended up with another brand...gonna try it out...I bought a case and see if it's any good... I bought Sustina 0w-20 before, that stuff is super thin for the BRZ.

    Good luck with the new truck, unless you a driving the super hot climate or tracking a race car, I wouldn't go with higher than factory recommended weighted oils. But it's your truck... enjoy it. I wish they make a regular cab, but that'll never happen again in the near future.
     
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  4. Apr 4, 2016 at 2:52 AM
    #44
    Sep1911

    Sep1911 Well-Known Member

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    Heavier oils would be good for city driving and offroading where you have a low speed situation causing the oil temp to rise. The 0w20 mandate is a CAFE thing. They test the cars with 0w20 so they have to tell user to run the same oil. A lot of people want to talk about fuel economy, but it's a 2% difference at best. toyota or whatever company will take everything they can get in terms of helping MPG, but 2% from engine oil is nothing. The tires they are using and design of the body make the most difference. My MPG dropped after I removed the front lip under my bumper.

    I'm personally not convinced 0w20 is because of tighter clearances. Granted these are not high performance engines so they don't rev too much but there are formulas to bearing clearances for crank/rod journals because they warp under load and if the clearance is too tight there are all sorts of issues you can run into such as spinning the bearings. I've found 2TR-FE bearing clearance specs and they were the same from the 5w30 to the 0w20 era. Unless the data sheets were incorrect.

    One of the things I've read online that I've never been able to prove is that newer engines designed for 0w20 have wider bearings. I guess they are worried about film strength? '

    Either way 5w30 isn't that much different than 0w20. I would run either without a second thought. 20w60 is another issue. Even if 0w20 does provide less protection or whatever, the truck will rot out before the engine has wear issues since toyota doesn't take rust seriously.
     
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  5. Apr 4, 2016 at 3:46 AM
    #45
    ARB1977

    ARB1977 It’s a beaut Clark

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    I remember when 5W30 was debated to be too thin. Now that 0W20 is out the debate still continues. Use 0W20 and move on.
     
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  6. Apr 4, 2016 at 5:52 AM
    #46
    CVOTRDSPORT

    CVOTRDSPORT Well-Known Member

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    I have always heard growing up that oil is a religion not a science, after spending 40 years in the commercial truck/bus maintenance and doing extensive oil testing, including extended oil change intervals and oil analysis, following trends for a few hundred million miles, I will say it IS a science and not a religion. But there is sure a lot of believers going on here.
     
  7. Apr 4, 2016 at 6:02 AM
    #47
    ecoterragaia

    ecoterragaia Everyone lives downstream.

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    I use 5w-30 in my 2TR-FE 4-banger because that's what the owner's manual calls for, and what's printed on the oil cap. OCI is every 3500-4000 miles.

    On another note, my work truck, a 2005 Ford Expedition with 5.4L V8, was just surplused (fleet vehicle) last week with ~120,000 miles. It got 5w-20 dino oil changed every 6,000 miles for its whole life. No issues with the engine, still runs great.
     
  8. Apr 4, 2016 at 6:06 AM
    #48
    SJC3081

    SJC3081 Well-Known Member

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  9. Apr 4, 2016 at 6:16 AM
    #49
    Sep1911

    Sep1911 Well-Known Member

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  10. Apr 4, 2016 at 6:30 AM
    #50
    tyme2par4

    tyme2par4 Well-Known Member

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    That's very general and very false statement. That's like saying summer tires should be illegal because they're bad in the snow...
    If you want good snow performance, get snow tires.
    I've had LRR tires on my current car for 4 years. The OEM Goodyears were pretty crappy in the snow, but the new Continentals I put on last year were great this winter.
    Not all tires are created equally. There are plenty of LRR tires that are just as good as non LRR tires in adverse weather.
     
  11. Apr 4, 2016 at 8:14 AM
    #51
    Jeff Lange

    Jeff Lange Well-Known Member

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    The spec for the 2TR-FE did not change when the oil changed to 0W20. Toyota has revised their recommended oil specifications a few times over the years and it's not always clear exactly why. For example, the 4GR-FSE in the Lexus IS250 changed from 5W30 to 0W20 in 2011, however the 2GR-FSE in the Lexus IS350 continued using 5W30 until they changed to 0W20 in 2014. The engines did not change mechanically for either when the spec changed. The 2GR-FE changed to 0W20 in at various times (2010 for RX350, 2011 for Sienna and Highlander, 2012 for Camry, 2013 for Venza).

    Toyota seems to be using 0W20 in whatever can use it, most likely for multiple reasons including fuel economy standards. They did the same when the switch to 5W20 happened about 5-6 years earlier. Certain engines (like the single VVT-i 1GR-FE) are not appropriate for 0W20 use.

    What's confusing sometimes though is that Toyota will often state that older versions of the same engine can use the 0W20 (2GR-FE in the 2006-2012 RAV4 for example), however other engines they do not do that for (2006-2010 IS250 should still be using 5W30, 2006-2013 IS350 should still be using 5W30). Why? Who's to say.

    Jeff
     
  12. Apr 4, 2016 at 8:53 AM
    #52
    Sep1911

    Sep1911 Well-Known Member

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    Are the Lexus models tuned more aggressively making more power?
     
  13. Apr 4, 2016 at 9:09 AM
    #53
    Jeff Lange

    Jeff Lange Well-Known Member

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    They're not, no.

    Jeff
     
  14. Apr 4, 2016 at 9:14 AM
    #54
    Clearwater Bill

    Clearwater Bill Sometimes when I close my eyes, I can't see.

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    This. ^

    My anecdotal evidence was running it in a 7200 RPM race car, hit the limiter often. Only 130k on it, so time will tell.

    My scientific evidence however is based on oil sample lab testing. Both mine, and dozens done by a tribologist buddy.
     
  15. Apr 4, 2016 at 9:16 AM
    #55
    Clearwater Bill

    Clearwater Bill Sometimes when I close my eyes, I can't see.

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    It's the same crowd that looks at it and tells you it's too dirty.

    Or changes at 3k intervals because that's what Jiffy Lube told them to do.
     
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  16. Apr 4, 2016 at 9:44 AM
    #56
    splitbolt

    splitbolt Well-Endowed Member

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  17. Apr 4, 2016 at 11:16 AM
    #57
    evilfij

    evilfij Well-Known Member

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    LRR tires in the rain, forget about snow, are absolute crap. There is lots of testing data showing that they do not perform as well as even inexpensive non-LRR tires. Maybe there is some miracle tire out there that is LRR but still has as good grip as non-LRR but I have yet to see it. I mean it is simply physics. You need resistance to stop and turn. Of course, I am a tire snob. And yes, summer tires are a bad idea unless you don't drive your vehicle in winter. Around here the dealers have gotten wise and most BMW/Audi/Merc dealers do not order vehicles without all seasons. I run snows year round on two of my cars. For the marginal cost, I am much happier to have great wet weather grip year round.
     
  18. Apr 4, 2016 at 11:40 AM
    #58
    tyme2par4

    tyme2par4 Well-Known Member

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    Believe what you want, but the Continental TrueContacts I have on now are far better than the Yokohamas I had on my previous car. I've never had a problem doing 70mph+ in the rain, and they handled the snow like a champ this winter.
    Check the ratings on tirerack. The TrueContacts got a 9.3 in wet traction and a 9.0 in light snow. That's a lot better than a lot of all season tires out there. Yes, there are bad ones, but there are bad non LRR tires too.
     
  19. Apr 4, 2016 at 11:50 AM
    #59
    SJC3081

    SJC3081 Well-Known Member

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    Why are you butt heads having a tire dick measuring match in a oil thread.
     
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  20. Apr 4, 2016 at 11:55 AM
    #60
    DrVonEvilSatan

    DrVonEvilSatan Well-Known Member

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    This is the correct answer. Thinner oil leads to better fuel economy. It's marginal but when these manufactures are trying to eek out anything it makes sense.

    Either way a good take home idea is do what the manufacture states. If you want to go it on your own, then make sure you have your oil analyzed after each change and keep an eye on pressures. More critically make sure that the oil you're running has the proper additives package recommend by the manufacture. Some engines are very picky about the wear additives and running substandard oils will lead to premature engine failure, looking at you VW PD diesels. The weight of the oil has far less to do with engine wear compared to the additives.
     

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