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Snow and Lockers!!!!!! READ NOW

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by DdayIsNear, Oct 24, 2009.

  1. Oct 24, 2009 at 9:41 PM
    #1
    DdayIsNear

    DdayIsNear [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Dont mix the 2 together if you plan on driving on a road with turns...Lockers and asphalt on snow is a bad combo... Be Safe!
     
  2. Oct 24, 2009 at 11:07 PM
    #2
    Jmartin89

    Jmartin89 Well-Known Member

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    sounds like a funny story behind that what did you do, does anyone have any tips for driving in snow when i get home im making a weekend trip to Missiouri to go ice fishing with my friend he says for sure its gonna be snowing around the end of Dec. and i just wanted some tips i live in East Texas and ive never seen snow before in my life so any info will be helpful
     
  3. Oct 24, 2009 at 11:18 PM
    #3
    Janster

    Janster Old & Forgetful

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    Why were you using the locker to begin with?

    Lockers are for extreme situations - like, when you're STUCK. And definately not for regular daily driving usage.
     
  4. Oct 24, 2009 at 11:27 PM
    #4
    carmellocafe

    carmellocafe Begin With The End In Mind.

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    Just go slow... Don't jam on the brakes either. In many cases driving on snow/ice the last thing you want to do is hit the brakes. Use downshifting to slow down. :)
     
  5. Oct 24, 2009 at 11:39 PM
    #5
    Janster

    Janster Old & Forgetful

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    X2

    Also
    Leave plenty of room between vehicles.
    Never make abrupt manuevers
    Make your decisions (like turns) LONG before you normally would and take the turns SLOW (or else, you won't make the turn).

    Momentum is your friend..... and that's a hard one to explain. Slow is key but if you go TOO slow, you might end up getting stuck. Going uphills....it's a good idea to gain a little momentum.

    If you get a chance, find a large & empty parking lot and play around a bit. Learn what the snow feels like when you're driving.....force yourself into some fishtails....

    Good Luck!
     
  6. Oct 25, 2009 at 1:50 AM
    #6
    borderbrat

    borderbrat Watching Chris4x4 o.O

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    i disagree with the downshifting comment if you go too low the ass will kick out causeing you to start to spin if you aren't paying attention you will at the very least its going to put the back of your truck in another lane. Just be gentle driving on slippery surfaces and give yourself plenty of room.
     
  7. Oct 25, 2009 at 7:02 AM
    #7
    Janster

    Janster Old & Forgetful

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    Agreed.

    But it still works GREAT if you do it properly. I like downshifting better than using the brakes.
     
  8. Oct 25, 2009 at 7:13 AM
    #8
    Brunes

    Brunes abides.

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    This^

    The post about kicking the rear end out had a caveat- You said "if you aren't paying attention" Anything can happen if you aren't paying attention.

    You are far more likely to have an issue by applying the brakes than by downshifting.
     
  9. Oct 25, 2009 at 7:49 AM
    #9
    Phillyguy

    Phillyguy Member

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    Agreed. Especially on a hill.

    The biggest thing is not to accelerate or brake while turning. If you have to make a turn, coast through.

    If you are approaching a light, slow gradually so your car maintains traction. You will slide if you brake as you do normally and if you are sliding, you have very little control of where the truck goes.

    Also, pack some weight in the bed. The more weight, the more traction.
     
  10. Oct 25, 2009 at 8:28 AM
    #10
    george3

    george3 Well-Known Member

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    This is all great stuff for the inexperienced driver. If you are an inexperienced driver I think the M T parking lot practice is the best idea so you know how the truck will react. I test the road when there is no traffic but if you do and get into trouble it's not my problem, it's just what I do.
     
  11. Oct 25, 2009 at 8:31 AM
    #11
    Afwrestler1986

    Afwrestler1986 Well-Known Member

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    the down shifting is the best way. If you have a manual that is. you can use the clutch as a brake. you don't just down shift and then drop the clutch. everything on snow and ice is slow and easy.
     
  12. Oct 25, 2009 at 8:50 AM
    #12
    ImpulseRed008

    ImpulseRed008 Gone But Not Forgotten

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    When you get to where you are going or first get into an area with snow, find an open parking lot and "play". It will help you learn to drive and stop in the snow.
     
  13. Oct 25, 2009 at 10:01 AM
    #13
    HankB

    HankB Well-Known Member

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    Lot of generalizations here. Most of the information is true, but with some qualifications. I'd like to add some detail so you can think it through and better understand what is going on.

    Think traction budget. On a given surface and with a given downward force on the tire, you will only get a certain amount of sideways force. By sideways, I mean parallel to the ground. Direction - sideways to the truck or in the direction of travel - does not matter. Once you exceed this traction budget, the tire will start sliding in the direction in which it is being pushed.

    Driving along in a straight line, you use very little traction and on a clean dry surface, you have a lot "in the bank." As road surface becomes compromised, you have very little budget and normal driving can exceed what is available. This is what happens when you're on level ground and hit some black ice. The traction required to keep the truck moving can exceed what is available and result in drive wheels spinning.

    Weight increases traction. There are two situations you need to think about regarding this. Put weight in the bed and you increase rear wheel traction. You also increase the mass that you need to accelerate or stop, so this technique has its cost. The second situation is during braking, acceleration or cornering. The forces on the tires cause weight to shift away from some tires and toward others. For example, when you brake, the front of the car dips lower as the front suspension loads due to weight shift. At the same time the rear end lifts as it unloads. This causes the front tires to have more traction and the rear tires less. This also happens during engine braking.

    An interesting :)eek:) scenario where this happens all too frequently is the combination of less experienced/trained drivers and big sweepers. If the driver goes too fast, nearing their traction budget, the normal tendency for most vehicles is to understeer. This causes them to go wide on the turn. Their first response is to turn the wheel further, but that won't help. Their next response is to panic and lift their foot off the throttle. This causes an immediate transfer of weight to the front tires and reduction of traction to the rear. The front tires regain traction and move the vehicle on a much tighter turn which causes the rear tires to lose traction. The result is that the vehicle spins out of control on the inside of the curve. Pretty neat, huh? :rolleyes: The term for this is snap oversteer and once it starts, there is no recovery. Look for skid marks on sweepers and you will see this pattern - skid marks going from the outside to the inside of the turn. Now you know why.

    So yes, make all inputs as smooth and gradual as possible when the traction budget is reduced by bad conditions. (And always good to leave extra space in case you or another driver underestimates the traction available.)

    And you also might guess that I am not a fan of downshifting to slow the vehicle for a number of reasons (some of which are only relevant for a rear wheel drive vehicle.)

    • Downshifting transfers weight away from the wheels being used to decelerate.
    • Downshifting uses two wheels while braking uses all four.
    • Synchros are more $$$ than brake linings and beyond my personal capability to replace.
    • Brakes are easier to modulate than engine RPM when traction is minimal.
    • More vehicles have ABS to assist brake modulation than traction control. (For that matter, I don't know if traction or stability control would work during a downshift.)
    And FWIW, our Taco has a locker and following the directions in the manual, I'll probably only use it when absolutely necessary - as in get unstuck and then kick it out.

    And your truck - drive it how you like. But hopefully a better understanding of the forces at work will help you to be a better driver. That along with practice in slippery parking lots. :D

    best,
    hank
     
  14. Oct 25, 2009 at 10:31 AM
    #14
    Coreyjon

    Coreyjon Northern Alliance: Airlift Div

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    dude, right on. I've been driving in the snow since, well, I've been driving. I have also had the pleasure of driving in some very austere places (like Antarctica). Understanding the forces associated with normal daily driving is key. Once you understand the basics, then you can begin to see how these forces will affect our ability to maintain control in less than ideal road conditions. Now this information can be used as much for safety as it can be for fun (IE empty parking lot covered in snow, muddy field, and even on dry pavement). But the goal should always be to become a safer driver.

    The locker should never be used for anything other than absolutely stuck, because I have seen people get themselves in worse situations using a locker. Also, good remark on never using cruise control in anything but dry roads.

    A big reason why I went with the sport was the lsd, something that I'me sure I put to more work than I ever would the rear locker. I also opted for the 4x4 because of where I live, and trust me its come in handy.

    Every one be safe this winter, add a little extra driving time, and like others have said, keep your distance, and your guard up.

    ..and now you know (and knowing is half the battle....G.I. Joeeee).:D

    -Fox
     
  15. Oct 25, 2009 at 12:16 PM
    #15
    george3

    george3 Well-Known Member

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    I'm sure there is no answer to this one but here goes. I was taught to leave 1 car length for every 10mph, so lets say we obey the 55 limit which no one does, that is 5.5 car lengths. Now I don't know how it is where you live but here in NJ 4 cars would pull in front of you and another would risk his life trying to get into the 1.5 car lengths left.
     
  16. Oct 25, 2009 at 12:33 PM
    #16
    DdayIsNear

    DdayIsNear [OP] Well-Known Member

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    yeah, that is very true man, but in bad weather , you cant control who gets in front of you, but you can control the distance, in the snow, when someone gets in font of me, i slow down and increase the distance, i would rather be rear ended than do the rear ending....because when you slow down, the guy behind you hopefully will
     
  17. Oct 25, 2009 at 12:58 PM
    #17
    Tacoyota

    Tacoyota senile member

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    [​IMG] hey lets try that locker. Does it work while criuse is on? Ya what can go wrong? ok ..... AAAAAAAAHHHH!
     
  18. Oct 25, 2009 at 1:01 PM
    #18
    TRDKenE

    TRDKenE DAMN GOOD DEAL!!

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    I used my locker in the snow last year..had no problems at all...worked very well infact...I will keep using it if need be...why have a locker if you cant use it...whats the difference with using a locker while wheeling? Doesnt make sense to me...
     
  19. Oct 25, 2009 at 1:02 PM
    #19
    Janster

    Janster Old & Forgetful

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    Why would you say that downshifting uses only two wheels ? Sure - if you're NOT in 4WD. In 4WD, you're getting engine braking at all 4 wheels and probably more consistantly than brakes (more braking power goes to the front discs).

    You are correct in saying its cheaper & easier to change the brakes. However - I see it as......the transmission should be built to handle all that kinda work load. To me - I feel safer downshifting.

    When actually..... depending on conditions and the speed I feel safe going - I won't put the truck in Drive but keep it on the lower gears and run the rpm's slightly higher. When I need to, I just let off the gas...and there's my engine braking.

    Perhaps downshifting is the improper term to use.... I like to utilize ENGINE BRAKING far better than using my brakes. Why? Because engine braking is less abrupt (and more consistant - as I mentioned above)

    Not everyone can understand or relate to the physics of how things work. I personally can relate to it...but your average 'joe' doesn't. It's over their heads (if you know what I mean). That's why driving experience is BEST. Not many people can READ about the physics and be able to apply it in real-life experiences.
     
  20. Oct 25, 2009 at 1:03 PM
    #20
    Tacoyota

    Tacoyota senile member

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    you dont use the locker on road , only off roads as such. Offroad isn't the issue here.
     
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