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Street Suspensions

Discussion in 'Suspension' started by GTiVR6r, Oct 17, 2007.

  1. Oct 17, 2007 at 6:03 AM
    #1
    GTiVR6r

    GTiVR6r [OP] Big Cat Chew Toy

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    Anyone have any experiance or links to someone who makes a good street suspension? Not looking to lower it, but want to remove the nose dive under hard breaking, body roll in corners, and the general overal all "floatyness".

    Idealy I'd want something adjustable for times when I want a sproty ride, long distance touring ride and haulin stuff. Not interested in a lift, just maintain the ride height now or slightly more, but more firmness when needed.

    Or would the current TBS for the Tacoma suspensions cover all this?


    Thanks in advance,

    - Mike
     
  2. Oct 17, 2007 at 6:22 AM
    #2
    lsocoee

    lsocoee My hair is all natural Staff Member

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    I think the TSB will probably help a little. But it is not going to get you what you want.

    I have a PreRunner that I don't plan on taking off road and I'd like to get something that handles on the road a little better. And before anyone asks, I needed a double cab, so I could not get the XRunner.

    Robert
     
  3. Oct 17, 2007 at 6:40 AM
    #3
    GTiVR6r

    GTiVR6r [OP] Big Cat Chew Toy

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    Anyone know how the X-Runner suspension is different?

    What that "X-Brace" they talk about?
     
  4. Oct 21, 2007 at 10:32 PM
    #4
    LRH

    LRH Well-Known Member

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    First get the TSB done, as the bilsteins's will add some firmness for the float and nose dive, and give a little delay on roll stiffness. Someone posted that the higher pressure gas charged Bilsteins gave a little lift to the front suspension on the lighter 4cyl's (my guess would be approx 3/16") The rear springs will add both load carrying ability and roll stiffness. Now for the add-ons; get the front anti-sway bar for the TRD on road version, as it is a few mm's larger diameter, and get an aftermarket bar for the rear. this will get handling much better for most everything but rock crawling/ditch crossing due to the added roll stifnes, but not X-Runner territory. Another low cost add-on would be to get a pair of Rancho 9000/90000 series for the rear only, so you can set them very firm when needed and set them on 1 or 2 during long interstate trips where it will almost get floaty and ride smooth. Another thing with the Rancho's, they are not gas charged, so the rear end when unloaded will prob set 3/16-1/4" lower, but still be higher in the rear than before the TSB. Play around with tire PSI a bit, prob a good starting point would be 32-33 front and 27-30 rear when unloaded, and 29-35 when loaded heavy. I always set PSI in spare at sidewall max, and decrease as needed, if needed since they tend to not be checked as often. These mods will give better handling for a decent cost and not chance the look or serviceability of the vehicle, as well as not scaring off and prospective purchaser during resell time due to the vehicle being heavily modified.
     
  5. Oct 21, 2007 at 10:50 PM
    #5
    LRH

    LRH Well-Known Member

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    The X-Runner has a slightly lowered suspension, wider low profile tires, larger front anti-sway bar, and added bar for the rear where one does not exist on the other models, firm shock damping, and since it is based on the 5 lug "spring under R axle" chassis, many parts do not interchange. I have never seen the "X" brace, but I believe it is just an X shaped brace that ties the 2 frame rails together to lessen flex due to the high roll stiffness of the suspension. The Tacoma, unlike the Hi-Lux sold in other world markets has an open "C" channel frame at the rearmost part of the truck versus fully boxed frame rails. The frame probably twists during extreme hard cornering, and this was the method used to remedy it.
     
  6. Oct 21, 2007 at 11:27 PM
    #6
    LRH

    LRH Well-Known Member

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    I just noticed that you have the 5 lug chassis, that what I get for taking it for granted you have a PreRunner or 4WD. So, disregard most of what I said, and forget about the TSB. Get some HD valved aftermarket bilsteins for F and R, or if you want the digestibility, get the Rancho 9000 series for the rear. get the X-Runner front swat bar and an aftermarket rear, as I have heard the mounting tabs for the rear bar are welded to the axle housing. Ihave had in the past a few 5 lug Toyota trucks and a few Nissans, and have found an add a leaf helps on the rear, even if you don't want to lift the truck. I had a neighbor of mine give me several old leaf packs off of Isuzu and Toyota pickups, and on one Toyota I took the longest, flattest leaf (the main leaf) and cut it longer than the overload on the Toyota, but shorter than the bottommost regular leaf. This spring leaf was just barely making contact at ride height, so only lifted the truck about 1/2", but this half inch was giving a better ride since the overload was hitting less while on smooth roads, but was progressively firmer as the suspension used more travel. A quick note: firmer shocks will do away with the wallow, and delay some cornering induced lean. Too stiff a shock in the rear can make the rear end/tires chatter on some low speed 90º turns; almost like a limited slip that need more friction modifier, and more so if gravel and ripples in pavement are present. This may make the adjustable Rancho's a preferred choice for the rear. I have found it is almost impossible to find too stiff a shock for the front. F and R anti-sway bars will do wonders for the body roll/lean in the corners, and will make the single largest improvement in cornering.
     
  7. Oct 22, 2007 at 9:08 AM
    #7
    GTiVR6r

    GTiVR6r [OP] Big Cat Chew Toy

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    Drove 305.2 miles ( 1 way) to Michigan this weekend, got almost 30 mpg, its great!
    Got 519 miles range out of 1 tank! However, the suspension float MUST DIE!

    Turns out (to my surprise) the front of the Tacos are actually struts, when my old Ranger was a huge coil spring and a shock. The Taco will be a chalenge to change. I think your right some better valved shocks should and probably will do the trick, however I hate Bilsteins, because of past VW experiances.

    I put Koni adjustables on all my past VWs and Ranger and they abosultely ROCK! Unfortuneatly Koni doesn't make them for Tacos.... yet.:rolleyes:

    Cotacted them and they want to do some R&D on my Taco and develope some for me and when itas all done, I get to keep them for FREE. :cool:

    I'll keep everyone posted on how it goes.

    - Mike

    P.S. Already found the rear antisway online, I'll pick on up after the shocks are done.
     
  8. Oct 22, 2007 at 10:18 AM
    #8
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    GRiVR6r: You hate Bilsteins!? You and i may have a problem then. It looks like i'm gonna have to beat your ass after all....

    LRH: You mentioned the C-frame instead of fully boxed. I was under the impression that the Taco was fully boxed. I know at least part of it is, what section of the frame is not boxed? Just the rear?
     
  9. Oct 22, 2007 at 6:34 PM
    #9
    LRH

    LRH Well-Known Member

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    ************************************************


    I was thinkling it was from the FRONT MOST REAR spring hanger, but on my RC PreRunner, it is from the transmission crossmember back. Other cabs/beds may vary, but all are C channel at least the last 4 of 5' of the frame, well in front of the spare tire carrier assy.
     
  10. Oct 22, 2007 at 6:42 PM
    #10
    jhodge83

    jhodge83 Any dog under 50# is a cat and cats are useless... Staff Member

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    wat?
    its C'd all through the cab area of the DC. i was under there yesterday running wire.
     
  11. Oct 22, 2007 at 6:44 PM
    #11
    LRH

    LRH Well-Known Member

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    Koni are the true top of the heap in shocks, I have always felt that way, with Bilstein holding 2nd. The Bilstein aftermarket valved shocks for the Tacoma/Tundra are valved much firmer than the factory versions, which are valved to Toyota's specs. What kind of problems did you have on your VW?
    Another good shock is believe it or not; KYB, they make good aftermarket products, I think there name gets diluted by all the cheap "made to OEM specs" shocks people remove and toss in the trash. They do offer a good aftermarket line.
    How long is the R&D from Koni going to take? What kind of rear bar did you find, and are you going to address the front bar's small diameter?
     
  12. Oct 22, 2007 at 7:42 PM
    #12
    lsocoee

    lsocoee My hair is all natural Staff Member

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  13. Oct 22, 2007 at 7:55 PM
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    jhodge83

    jhodge83 Any dog under 50# is a cat and cats are useless... Staff Member

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    wat?
    c2c

    these guys have a 1.75" drop for the front for $119
     
  14. Oct 22, 2007 at 8:08 PM
    #14
    lsocoee

    lsocoee My hair is all natural Staff Member

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    I saw the kit for that C2C sells, but I was a bit wary about that because it says it's for the x-runner.

    I know very little about suspension lowering. It seems like these kits don't use a shorter, stiffer spring which makes me worry. Wouldn't this be the only way to maintain the load carrying capacity of the truck.

    I need a truck and I do push it to it's payload, but I want a truck that handles better. I think dropping it is the only way to make it handle more like a car.
     
  15. Oct 22, 2007 at 8:10 PM
    #15
    jhodge83

    jhodge83 Any dog under 50# is a cat and cats are useless... Staff Member

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    wat?
    direct from c2c lowering kit page......."The 1.75" Drop kit (shown) was designed for the X-Runner, but will work on ANY 2005+ Tacoma (depending on wheel size)."
     
  16. Oct 22, 2007 at 9:30 PM
    #16
    lsocoee

    lsocoee My hair is all natural Staff Member

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    yeah yeah...I know, but it still makes me nervous.
     
  17. Oct 23, 2007 at 5:12 AM
    #17
    GTiVR6r

    GTiVR6r [OP] Big Cat Chew Toy

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    Both my '90 Jetta Coupe and my '96 GTi Vr6 had very soft suspensions from the factory and would wallow badly in corners and while heavy breaking.

    The Jetta I just replaced the shocks and struts with Koni top mount adjustable units.

    The GTi in installed a 1" thick front sway from neuspeed, a 1" thick rear Shine Racing sway (blots inside the hollow "C" shaped rear axel), Spax Linear rate springs and Koni top mount adjustable shocks and Struts.

    Both VWs benefitted from the ability to dial out the nose dive and the plowing of the front end being soley front wheel drives, they were prone to that. The Konis balanced it out well and gave me the choice of a touring soft ride, or hardeneed it up for autocross and road track racing.

    I'm not looking to go thats nuts with the Taco, but the float, wallow, body roll and nose dive need to go.

    I have been thinking may some coil overs for the rear would help with extra
    load and spring rate. Have not inquired about the TSB yet, seems to be only for the 4x4s though.

    - M
     
  18. Oct 23, 2007 at 10:15 AM
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    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    So what part of the frame is fully boxed? Just the rear? Thats pretty lame, even my dads exterra has a fully boxed frame and so do the frontiers i believe. I have some friends that work at a metal fab shop, do you think its possible to have the frame fully boxed?
     
  19. Oct 23, 2007 at 11:53 AM
    #19
    sawdust

    sawdust Unapologetic Texan

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    Homelink mirror, tailgate lock, 2ndary air filter removal, Access LE tonneau, Bugflector II, hitch-based bed extender, vent visors, suspension TSB, stall mat
    I just experienced a weird sense of deja vu.

    This should not be confused with vuja de, which means the feeling that nothing like this has ever happened to anyone ever before.
     
  20. Oct 23, 2007 at 1:23 PM
    #20
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    oops, i thought i canceled the first post. i'll take care of that now
     
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