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What is the limiting factor on the payload?

Discussion in '2nd Gen. Tacomas (2005-2015)' started by lsocoee, Mar 25, 2007.

  1. Mar 25, 2007 at 7:17 PM
    #1
    lsocoee

    lsocoee [OP] My hair is all natural Moderator

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    So, I love my new Tacoma but I'm starting to wonder if I got the right size truck. I have an 07 Double Cab SR5 with the long bed. I have been hauling concrete, dirt, wood, and almost sod. I had too much dirt in my yard and my wife convinced me to load up the truck. Before I could realize what I was doing, I had put in about 20 cubic feet. Estimating that weight to be anywhere between 1300 and 1700 lbs. The payload is 1450 lbs minus my 250 bringing it down to 1200 lbs. I drove as nicely as I could but I think that I came very close to bottoming out. Acceleration and braking was OK.

    Here's the question, if I were to put in some stiffer springs or air bags inside the springs, would I increase the capacity? Or is the limiting factor the bed? Braking? Frame?

    Question 2: Assuming I didn't bottom out, what permanent damage have I done? Am I going to need to replace the shocks any earlier?
     
  2. Mar 25, 2007 at 7:43 PM
    #2
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

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    I'm interested in responses here too. Early on I did bottom out my 2006 (TRD offroad, tow package) several times hauling porcelain tile. These days I'm around 50,000 miles without any noticeable lingering ill effects.

    New rear springs and shocks are in the plans for unrelated reasons, but I'm curious to see what else might have been effected. My guess is that the bump stops did what they were built to do and no harm was done, but being wrong isn't something I'm unfamiliar with. :)
     
  3. Mar 25, 2007 at 7:47 PM
    #3
    lsocoee

    lsocoee [OP] My hair is all natural Moderator

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    From what I have heard, you could bend your frame if you bottom out too hard.

    You reminded me, I also have the tow package.

    Do you take your Tacoma off road?
     
  4. Mar 26, 2007 at 7:39 AM
    #4
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    I have the tow package and yes, i have taken mine off road and i plan on taking off roading much more. I didn't pay for the 4 wheel drive and the TRD offroad for nothing...
     
  5. Mar 26, 2007 at 8:04 AM
    #5
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

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    Same here with the offroad activities. Currently it's mostly time on the beach for fishing and in the woods for climbing, but I'm getting it prepped as a race rig for an event in late 2008.

    I'll thoroughly check the frame for damage when I pull the bed later this year. If there's any signs of damage from that day I'll be a little concerned, but mostly it'll underscore the need to fully box the frame behind the cab. I'd rather not have to take that route.

    Have you noticed any damage or signs of wear under your truck at the point of contact?
     
  6. Mar 26, 2007 at 8:44 AM
    #6
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    I have not noticed any damage, but i have had the truck for less than a month so i havn't beat it up too much. The only damage so far was from having to pull it out of the mud. I attached the chain hook to the flat piece of metal on the tow bar right next to the hitch. Bad idea, it didn't bend it bad so it's no big deal. So if i understand correctly, the tacoma does not have a fully boxed frame right? It sounds like it is not boxed behind the cab? I don't think it's a huge deal but i would expect more from tacoma, i know nissans use a fullly boxed frame. Btw mjp2, you have alot of balls taking a $30,000 truck and entering it in a race. I wish i could be that nonchallant (sp) about putting my truck through that kind of abuse.
     
  7. Mar 26, 2007 at 9:13 AM
    #7
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

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    You hooked up to the attachment point for the safety chains on the tow hitch. I've made the exact same mistake. I learned a lot about vehicle recovery over the years. I've gotten stuck a lot. :p Never got stuck in this truck though, and I know my driving skills haven't improved that much. These things are amazingly capable.

    Ballsy is a cool compliment, although stupid is probably more accurate. We'll see which it is come November of next year. I realize that I'll probably have to buy a new ride when I'm done, but my take on it is this: If I'm gonna dump tons of cash into a truck to make it capable of doing what I need it to do, I'm going to start with a solid platform. I'd hate to go through the trouble and expense of all the mods only to have the truck stall out on me in the middle of the desert. Reliability is what I need more than anything, and I haven't seen a vehicle more reliable than these Tacomas.

    Still, it does admittedly hurt to hack into such a nice vehicle. The first bent sheet metal is gonna hurt more, but I try not to think about that.
     
  8. Mar 26, 2007 at 9:25 AM
    #8
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    All i know is there better be some serious prize money for this race, or else you have more money than you know what to do with. If thats the case how about betting me a bull bar and a wench :) And yeah, you're right, i did hook up the chain to the safety chain points. I have a tow hook on the front, but where are you suppose to hook up a chain in the back? Also, what is the recomended top speed for 4wheel low?
     
  9. Mar 26, 2007 at 10:16 AM
    #9
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

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    You put the bull bar ahead of the wench? Your priorities make me sad. ;) There's essentially no prize money -- just bragging rights. Everybody's got to have a story to tell, and even I'm tired of listening to the ones I already have.

    Towing in 4 wheel low is not something I've tried. Thanks to the wonderfully low gearing the engine RPMs will limit your speed. I would think that if you can drive at a given speed in 4 wheel low, and your trailer isn't exceeding the tow rating of the truck, you should be fine. At the same time if you're on terrain that requires low range and you're towing you should probably slow the heck down anyway. :p

    I always keep a collection of recovery stuff in my truck. You might want to look into something like this:
    http://www.ok4wd.com/index.php/catalog/product/warn_receiver_shackle_bracket/ to provide you with a solid attachment point. Alternatively, since you already tow and have a tongue with a ball attached (not meant to be as suggestive as it sounds...) you can pick up some recovery straps that have hoops at the ends rather than hooks. Just place the hoop around the tow ball and you're good. Just make sure your tow equipment is in good shape!

    Just out of curiosity, what did you get stuck in/on?
     
  10. Mar 26, 2007 at 12:12 PM
    #10
    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    I didn't put the bull bar before the wench, but as long as you're paying i want them both at the same time. When i was talking about 4wheel low i didn't mean towing, i just meant how fast can i plow through mud in 4low. To answer your question i got stuck in a muddy ditch with a log blocking me in. The truck was doing a great job on some old soggy logging trails on a friends track of land. We were camping and i had owned the truck for about 36 hours. It was about midnight and i was pretty drunk. Anyway, i made it over the log (with some minor rubbing on the skid plates) and through the ditch, but when i got to the other side i saw that the logging trail stopped and it was thick brush and limbs and everything else. I didn't mind getting my new truck muddy or stuck but i didn't want to scratch it to hell. So i was forced to stop, which meant i lost momentum with my back wheels still in the ditch. When i tried to back up, i couldn't get over the log at the top of the ditch so all i managed to do was dig some ruts and sink in the mud. Coming to a dead stop in mud is never a good idea, especially in a ditch, especially with a log behind you. But thats still better than scratching the hell out of a brand new truck. So thats how i got it stuck. But she did make it through alot of nasty mud holes that night. And she looked great the next day with mud kicked up all over her.
     
  11. Mar 26, 2007 at 12:43 PM
    #11
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

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    That's a great story! It's one of those times that sucks when it's happening but is a hell of a lot of fun when you talk about it 2 weeks later. :)

    Do a google search for "2005 tacoma locker mod" and find the PDF that's floating around out there. Mudding in 4 wheel low usually won't give you enough momentum to get through the bog (stumps/logs/ditches don't help either) but getting that rear locked is worth the lost speed. The mod allows you to lock to rear diff in 4 wheel high (and 2wd if you're into drifting). You're clearly into using your truck so this might be of use to you at some point.

    Unfortunately it does nothing for scratches so in this case you would have been S.O.L. anyway.

    I'll be performing the mod on my truck in the next month and will post how it goes.

    As for the wench, the ideal would be one that comes with her own custom fabrication shop. Hey, if I'm gonna dream, I'm gonna dream BIG! :D
     
  12. Mar 26, 2007 at 1:54 PM
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    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    I'm a little confused, i was under the impression you could lock the rear diff even if you were in 4 high, as long as you were at a dead stop when you actually locked them, am i way wrong? Also, why is the top recomended speed with the rear locked only 5mph?
     
  13. Mar 26, 2007 at 2:25 PM
    #13
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

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    Toyota might have updated the design for 2007, but my 2006 will only lock in low range.

    The 5mph thing is just their recommendation. I imagine it keeps them out of trouble in terms of warranty-fixing snapped axle shafts when people really push their trucks. It would also help them in court in the event a lawsuit was brought up saying that the stock truck behaved unexpectedly and caused an accident.

    Taking turns on a hard surface with the diff locked will put a torsional load on the axle shafts. Most times that load is relieved with one of the wheels spinning (chirping tires around corners is common with locked rears) as the axles untwist, but it is possible for the load to be enough to actually snap the axle. I would be amazed if that happened on a truck with stock-size tires, but anything is possible. (Larger tires allow the road to gain leverage on the drivetrain components and increases the chance for breakage.)

    When the axle does unload, the rear of the truck could shift and catch a driver off-guard if he/she isn't expecting it.

    Despite their recommendation, I'll be running much higher speeds on sand with the rear locked. I can't recommend it, but I don't see it causing much harm beyond what would happen to the to truck with an open diff as long as the speeds and terrain are within reason.

    Oh yeah, the "grey-wire" mod will disable your ABS while the rear is locked. I see that as something desirable, but it might not be for everyone.

    I'm really interested to know if the '07s can lock the rear in 4 wheel high. That would be a HUGE benefit for the new models!
     
  14. Mar 26, 2007 at 2:26 PM
    #14
    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

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    lsocoee, are you still out there? This thread kinda took on a life of its own in your absence. :)
     
  15. Mar 26, 2007 at 3:03 PM
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    nd

    nd Radical Town. It's a hell of a place!

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    I'll have to go toy around with my truck and see if i can lock the rear in 4 high or 2high. Is there a way i can tell if its actually locked other than the dash light?
     
  16. Mar 26, 2007 at 3:30 PM
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    mjp2

    mjp2 Living vicariously though myself Moderator

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    The dash light is a good indicator, but you'll also be able to hear it engage when the solenoid gets juice.
     
  17. Mar 26, 2007 at 7:15 PM
    #17
    lsocoee

    lsocoee [OP] My hair is all natural Moderator

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    Yeah, I'm still here. I've been enjoying the action in the background. I "use" my truck too, but I use mine for hauling.

    I don't have 4 wheel drive but I did go for a limited slip differential and I've decided that it was worth the money...Yesterday I was going to a crawfish boil and it was off of a dirt road. I went to turn around and backed up a little too far and ended up in some pretty deep mud. I kept on the gas lightly, with one tire spinning the other tire grabbed and kept me from getting stuck in the ditch. That would have been sooo embarassing; my friends would never let me live that one down.
     
  18. Mar 26, 2007 at 7:23 PM
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    MAXTacoma

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    I have a 2006 D-Cab 4x4 long bed trd sport with the towing package and i have had the same prolemes as you have. When I put my quad in the bed about 800Lbs and put the trailer on with 2 quads I think that the frame is on the axel. So I thought that it was to much weight but then I found out that my quad by itself will cause the suspension to bottom out. I have looked into the air-ride rear suspension and think that will take care of the problem but there are 2 different set-ups. The first being the air bag that have an nosel the hooks up to an air pump at a gas station or a compressor. The second is the air bags that have the compressor and automatically adjust the air pressor to raise or lower the rear. But both of these are faily expensive. The first starting at about 280 without being installed and the second is over 450. I just am convinced that the rear is just to weak and should have been made stiffer, but there the ride is good and I drive it more unloaded that I do loaded so hopefully Toyota will live up to its reputation of being unbreakable and be able to handle the occasional stress of having the frame on the rear axel..
     
  19. Apr 19, 2008 at 3:39 PM
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    Clelsdah

    Clelsdah Western Alliance: Yeehaw Division

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    I just installed Firestone Ride-Rite air helper springs on the rear of my 08 4x4 Access cab with 5000Lb load rating for the springs. They bolted on without modification except cutting the rubber bumper off the frame where it would meet the axle. My decision for this came after a friend with a 03 tacoma had his bed loaded and the ski boat behind and showed the ride difference between 5lbs in the bags with the truck almost bottomed out and then with 40Lbs and the bed level. You could feel the weight but the ride and handling felt normal. I have not put a big load yet but will report how it handles when I do. As far as payload capacity the manufacturers always under rate the capacity for safety and legal reasons. Common sense is always required when loading and check your tire pressure/weight capacities as they will ultimately be carrying the load. I tend to abuse my trucks but if this one stands up to half the abuse the 91 2wd Toyota PU did I will be happy.
     
  20. Apr 19, 2008 at 6:28 PM
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    concrete jedi

    concrete jedi Well-Known Member

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    I did about the same thing, and found no damage, as a matter of fact I will be loading the HELL out of it this summer, my limit factor is when the tires go pop ! :D
     
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