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3rd Gen Traction Control Modes Explained

Discussion in '3rd Gen. Tacomas (2016-2023)' started by Doggman, Jan 25, 2018.

  1. Jan 28, 2018 at 7:54 AM
    #81
    Randomg1234

    Randomg1234 Active Member

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    This is awesome. Thanks for creating this thread. Subb'd
     
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  2. Jan 28, 2018 at 8:18 AM
    #82
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Wow. Very interesting. This is what @David K has been saying all along. It's odd and not documented but perhaps it is what it is. Probably all non-ORs have this mode but guys with the other models may want to test this. Might be worth testing an OR in more scenarios as well in case the jack test tricked it for some reason.

    I'll update the OP when I get back to my PC. Did you make any other findings that contradict what we think we know? Hard to compare on mobile.

    I think @PB FAB brought conflicting testing results to the table for this. I believe he never got any LSD action in 4Hi TRAC OFF in his testing. He is in an SR and you are in a TRD Sport though.
     
  3. Jan 28, 2018 at 8:43 AM
    #83
    Topanga Taco

    Topanga Taco BUZZING NITRO

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    The Magic of ALSD RCI-skid RAS-Sumos Bilstein 6112/5100
    A vital variable of the equation is missing.

    I’m curious to hear more imput from @Thechief86 . It was great to hear from someone with a rich history in 4x4. The videos he posted on the other thread yesterday showed smooth traction in that short climb. That “Cadillac” “legs” part. Pb’s video shows it also before he backs up to purposely loose traction. Crackin’ the code been tough.
     
  4. Jan 28, 2018 at 9:18 AM
    #84
    PB FAB

    PB FAB Well-Known Member

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    That is correct. The short video I did in 4high show track on and working. When I tried track off in 4high the two opposing corners right front, left rear spun freely.

    https://youtu.be/aX4JQW2uAQo

    I can video it next week with trac off.
     
  5. Jan 28, 2018 at 11:45 AM
    #85
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    We talked about it being this way for the SR / SR5 / Sports in the other thread. It can also be seen in the dash light configurations in my crappy pics. I will update those.

    I am thinking about making an in cab versus outside video. I'll need a bit of help with that.
     
  6. Jan 28, 2018 at 11:56 AM
    #86
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Yeah there was a lot of debate about mode #5 in the other thread. @David K debated that this mode was different in that you still got TRAC just no engine regulation. The very thing you claim to have experienced in your test. Odd to still have TRAC while the dash says TRAC OFF. All the testing done, most notably by @PB FAB (SR) and @BigWhiteTRD (TRD OR) indicated that such a mode did not exist and that mode #5 was indeed TRAC completely off as the dash indicates. No LSD braking and no engine regulation. Your testing throws a wrench into this. You are the first person to have tested this and report LSD functionality in 4Hi TRAC OFF.

    As for the lights I think those are ironed out at this point. Every model shows the same dash lights in mode #5 but it appears your TRD Sport behaves differently than @PB FAB s SR and @BigWhiteTRD s TRD OR in this mode.
     
  7. Jan 28, 2018 at 11:58 AM
    #87
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    I will post up the v107 spreadsheet tomorrow. I'm messing it up trying to do it on my phone.
     
  8. Jan 28, 2018 at 12:03 PM
    #88
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    Again, sorry for the confusion. I should have seen the changes earlier.

    Here are my bad pics:
    https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads...-non-trd-offroad.437814/page-21#post-16988350

    4Hi start up has no lights other than the 4wd indicator. When I get wheel in the air slip, the Slip Indicator flashes and I move forward.
     
  9. Jan 28, 2018 at 12:08 PM
    #89
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    No prob. Your experience with 4Hi start up as described above is what we expected and same as everyone else. What about in 4Hi TRAC OFF though? As in the "4Hi Quick Press" labeled image in your dash light post. Did you get slip indicator flashes and move forward in that mode when lifting a wheel?
     
  10. Jan 28, 2018 at 12:28 PM
    #90
    tonered

    tonered bartheloni

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    No. 4Hi short and long pressed did not get a Slip Light, I had wheel spin, an no motion. Short press is TRAC Off and Long press is TRAC Off and VSC Off.

    Dammit! That is an error in my post yesterday in the last two columns for 4Hi long press.

    I miss my laptop!
     
  11. Jan 28, 2018 at 12:47 PM
    #91
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Excellent. That's what I wanted to hear. This matches what I think I know and the text summary in the OP. I'll review the excel sheet tomorrow to make sure everything is correct and add in your test notes.

    I believe its actually the 4Hi Short Press row that needs to be corrected. 4Hi Long Press looks correct in your updated sheet.
     
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  12. Jan 29, 2018 at 7:36 AM
    #92
    tonered

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    Alright. Here's V107 of the spreadsheet.

    I believe Row 12 of the Summary sheet needs to be looked at? There are conflicts between Columns I, J, and K. I edited Column L to agree with what I am seeing.

    As noted earlier, I will try to get back there and make a video for the fun of it.
     

    Attached Files:

  13. Jan 29, 2018 at 8:52 AM
    #93
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Ah took me a minute to figure out what was different. I see how it's confusing but there is no "Trac-Off" button. You use the "VSC-Off" button to get to both modes. Short press to get to TRAC OFF and long press to get to TRAC OFF VSC OFF.

    Copying the test data over now.
     
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  14. Jan 29, 2018 at 8:59 AM
    #94
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    @BigWhiteTRD what does "Yes & No" mean in the VSC Off Switch column of the Controls/Dash Light table?

    Edit: Also, MTS is always on when you have crawl control on, yeah? You can't have crawl on and MTS off correct?
     
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2018
  15. Jan 29, 2018 at 10:27 AM
    #95
    David K

    David K Well-Known Member

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    @Doggman You were wondering about why I thought for 2012+, with the added TRAC OFF light/quick push feature (not on 2009-2011) was now the stronger 4WD TRAC, and no engine output regulation?

    Because in 2WD, "TRAC OFF" (called AUTO LSD, per Toyota) is a quick push of the VSC button and provides stronger TRAC without the engine regulation. OFF in the name (to my thinking) means engine regulation is off, not traction control is turned off. So, why would TRAC OFF in 4WD be the opposite of TRAC OFF in 2WD (AUTO LSD)? Owners of 2012-2015 have not disputed this finding, but I have not been in a 2012+ Tacoma off the road to play with it!

    In VCS OFF MODE (long push) you have neither traction controls or engine regulation. This is true for 3rd Gens too. VSC OFF is the true all off mode... takes more effort to get to... you must stop the truck and then hold in the button until the VSC OFF symbol comes on.

    TRAC OFF (and AUTO LSD) comes on easily with a quick push, moving or stopped... for when you need to get the added traction fast to move you when one tire spins per axle.

    For the 2012 model year (and perhaps late 2011 models), they added the need for a quick push of the button and a TRAC OFF light, in H4, it was only logical that they wanted to be consistent. TRAC in both 2WD and 4WD-HI (2012+) was/is a light traction control and the engine output is regulated. TRAC OFF in both 2WD and 4WD (stronger traction control) should be the same... key words "should be" LOL!
     
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  16. Jan 29, 2018 at 10:30 AM
    #96
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    And yet in this mode the "TRAC OFF" light is not lit. ALSD is not "TRAC OFF". That triangle chart has you so twisted on that. The TRAC OFF light means no traction control. There has been no tested exception to this and it makes perfect sense.
     
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  17. Jan 29, 2018 at 10:54 AM
    #97
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    Updated the spreadsheets. The far right notes column on the controls/dash lights chart gets cutoff when I convert it to a PDF/image but that's okay I think. I made some more updates to hopefully make things a little clearer. Let me know if you guys don't like it and we can go back to the older versions. Someone with an Auto OR needs to double check my changes...particularly with the MTS and Crawl. I can't go test this for myself and no one has posted shots of the dash in every mode in that configuration. I'm pretty sure you can't have Crawl on without MTS on as well so there were some changes that needed to be made. Let me know if that's wrong and I'll correct it.
     

    Attached Files:

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  18. Jan 29, 2018 at 10:58 AM
    #98
    David K

    David K Well-Known Member

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    Not saying you are finding TRAC OFF different, just responding why I thought what I did about it.
    Not just the triangle chart, AUTO LSD is TRAC OFF also in this DRIVE MODE chart from Toyota (see note #2):

    [​IMG]
     
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  19. Jan 29, 2018 at 11:04 AM
    #99
    Tacowin1013

    Tacowin1013 Well-Known Member

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    I saw the same and my interpretation is *4 Engine output is not regulated but by them saying that infers that ABS is still functional
     
  20. Jan 29, 2018 at 11:06 AM
    #100
    Doggman

    Doggman [OP] Well-Known Member

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    That chart is just referencing the "TRAC OFF MODE" as defined in the triangle figure above. I've already mentioned this but whoever decided to call ALSD in 2WD "TRAC OFF MODE" chose very very poor terminology. I get why you came to the conclusion you did, I just think it's wrong.

    You have a mode and you need to come up with a name for it. It has three settings.
    ALSD On
    TRAC Off
    VSC Off
    IMO this should have been called ALSD Mode. Sure the TRAC system is off but this creates confusion with the "TRAC OFF" light on the dash. This I think is the source of your confusion. TRAC OFF MODE != TRAC OFF light on dash. And the proof is that in this defined "TRAC OFF MODE" the TRAC OFF light isn't even lit.

    Your assumption is that because a stronger traction system (ALSD) replaces TRAC when it is turned off in 2wd you get the same thing in 4Hi. This is not true and it never has been. ALSD is 2wd only. TRAC OFF in 4Hi means no traction control. That table even indicates that "TRAC OFF MODE" with ALSD is only operational in 2WD.
     

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