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Clutch Issue?

Discussion in '1st Gen. Tacomas (1995-2004)' started by Madjik_Man, May 15, 2013.

  1. May 15, 2013 at 3:14 PM
    #1
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    I've checked my bookmarks and did a quick search and don't see anything that speaks to the issue I'm having

    1998 3.4L 5-speed manual. 166,000 miles

    This just started on my drive back from picking my daughter up from school.

    When I push the clutch pedal in and engage it in gear, the catch point basically just plummeted to being really low on the release of the pedal. Then the pedal feels super mushy, as if there is no hydraulics (?) pushing it back up. To me it felt as if I was trying to work the clutch with my seat being 12" or so too far back.

    It is extremely noticeable when engaging 1st gear.
    Very noticeable when engaging 2nd gear
    And somewhat noticeable when engaging 3rd, 4th and 5th.

    When the truck is in gear, there is no slipping or issues. Seems to drive normally.

    If I'm in 5th gear and put it into neutral to coast to a stop, the clutch pedal feels much closer to "normal" when I release it than the described issue above.

    Things of note:

    There is no leak underneath the truck

    I just flushed my brake fluid 1,000 miles ago and it's been driving great since with no issues until the drive home.

    I checked the brake fluid level and it is exactly where it was when I topped off after flushing.

    Just so I can sound cool (and as if I have a clue what I'm talking about)... does this sound like a slave cylinder issue?

    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. May 15, 2013 at 3:32 PM
    #2
    maineah

    maineah Well-Known Member

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    More likely the clutch master cylinder.
     
  3. May 15, 2013 at 3:40 PM
    #3
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    Yeah, hoping not.

    Also forgot to note that the reservoir for the clutch is full (dirty as hell, but full)

    I'm going to try and get under the truck and see if there's any fluid in the slave boot.

    There's no fluid building up on the rod that goes through the firewall from the clutch pedal. My mechanic friend said if there was that one tell tale sign the master is fubar'd.

    I'm going to bring it into his shop tomorrow and they'll diagnose it for free.

    If it's the master cylinder, how hard is that to replace?
     
  4. May 15, 2013 at 4:31 PM
    #4
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    So I just had my 6 year old daughter work the clutch pedal while I snooped around.

    When she pushes it in and releases it, there is no visible leak of any kind at/on the master cylinder or slave cylinder.

    When she pushes it in and releases it I can hear/feel the fluid moving inside the master.

    When she pushes it in and releases it I can see the slave cylinder pushing the rod (?) about a 1/2" or so (?). But I don't know how much is normal travel or how much resistance there should be.

    Edit: If I try to pull the rod (?) or whatever gets pushed out by the slave cylinder, it won't budge with just my hands pulling on it. It will only move if my daughter pushes on the clutch pedal.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2013
  5. May 15, 2013 at 4:40 PM
    #5
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    Also priced out both the slave and master cylinders. I've read here that too many aftermarkets of these crap the bed and Jace, someone I trust wholeheartedly, recommends OEM only. Others have recommended Aisin from rockauto.

    Master cylinder
    OEM: $135
    Aisin: $40 (rockauto)

    Slave cylinder:
    OEM: $71
    Aisin: $40 (rockauto)

    Clearly a substantial price difference. I'm leaning towards OEM because it's in stock and a block from my friend's shop. Wouldn't have to wait for the parts to arrive from rockauto.

    Truly though, I'm hoping it's just dirty (never changed or flushed clutch fluid) and a lot of air in the system. So hopefully a flush takes care of this.
     
  6. May 15, 2013 at 5:15 PM
    #6
    JudoJohn

    JudoJohn Well-Known Member

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    Aisin is OEM on some models
     
  7. May 15, 2013 at 8:19 PM
    #7
    skeezix

    skeezix Well-Known Member

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    I would rebuild them if they were mine (unless I couldn't obtain a rebuild kit).
     
  8. May 15, 2013 at 9:00 PM
    #8
    Blackdawg

    Blackdawg Dr. Frankenstein

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    ALL OF THEM!...Then some more.
    Last edited: May 16, 2013
  9. May 16, 2013 at 5:11 AM
    #9
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    Thanks Monte and TacoMX... that's a great write up.

    I might try that.
     
  10. May 16, 2013 at 8:13 AM
    #10
    Robertgeejr1

    Robertgeejr1 Well-Known Member

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    I have done all the hi-pro mods for a life time, since I got this truck at a great price, I will be happy with showroom new.
    I followed his write-up and its right on, no surprises. with the age on mine I just went ahead and replaced the master and rebuilt the slave, I figured since i had to bleed the system out for one, and was under there, might as well make it like new, the master will wear out also, seals and stuff, and flush the system out good, after i did mine it really worked like new, it was a major improvement. mine's now hit 190,001.
     
  11. May 16, 2013 at 9:10 AM
    #11
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    Well I brought it into my friend's shop.

    Before I did though new symptoms arose. This morning, after the truck sat all night, I pushed the clutch pedal in to start the truck and noticed it went all the way to the floor and wouldn't come back up at all. I futzed with it until I could get it come back up. Pushed it in and shifted into reverse. Without releasing the pedal the transmission engaged and accelerated. With the clutch pedal still on the floor, I had to stay on the brakes hard until it stalled (or else I would have ended up in my neighbor's yard).

    Once I started the truck back up, I pushed the clutch pedal back down and was unable to put it into any gear. Including reverse. So I pumped the shit out of the pedal and was able to drive it with the same symptoms as in the OP.


    Got to my friend's shop and was going over it with one of his mechanics. We bled it a little to see if there was air in it. He said there was a tiny bit. Topped it off, felt better for a little bit as I drove it around the block, but when I came to a complete stop and put it in reverse, the same thing happened as above.

    So we're going to put a new slave cylinder in it Saturday morning. I got his discount and out the door from Toyota it was $55. We're leaning towards it being a hydraulic issue only because I can pump the pedal and get it to work decently once it feels like it shat the bed.

    If it's a mechanical issue I'm looking at $1000 to replace the clutch, etc

    FML
     
  12. May 16, 2013 at 11:36 AM
    #12
    JudoJohn

    JudoJohn Well-Known Member

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    I have to agree with Robert. There are a lot of years and miles on both components. Rubber deteriorates. replace them both and only 1 time to bleed.
     
  13. May 16, 2013 at 12:54 PM
    #13
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    Already bought the slave cylinder.

    For $55, if it fixes the problem and I get another 166,000 miles out of it, I'd be a very happy man.
     
  14. May 16, 2013 at 4:40 PM
    #14
    Robertgeejr1

    Robertgeejr1 Well-Known Member

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    I have done all the hi-pro mods for a life time, since I got this truck at a great price, I will be happy with showroom new.
    I feel for you, and hope it fixes the problem, now don't take this wrong, but was that a Toyota quote on the clutch? I know its expensive, but that seems a bit high, instead of the dealership any good transmission man should be able to do it less.
     
  15. May 16, 2013 at 4:48 PM
    #15
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    That's my friend's shop with my 10% discount on labor.

    I'd be horrified to see what Toyota would charge.

    Broken down:

    (1) clutch kit: $350

    Transmission assembly, remove & replace
    Clutch pressure plate, remove & replace
    Clutch release bearing, remove & replace
    Flywheel, remove & replace
    Flywheel, resurface

    Total labor: $625

    In their system when it says "remove and replace" a lot of the times it's just referring to book times on how long it will take to remove and put back said parts.
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2013
  16. May 16, 2013 at 4:58 PM
    #16
    tacoma04

    tacoma04 Laissez les bons temps rouler

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    I had to have a clutch and rebuild the gearbox. A local shop did it that I know and just to do the clutch was going to be about $1200 with all Toyota parts. Of course it was lots more with the gearbox rebuild.

    I hope Madjik Man's price is with Toyota parts.
     
  17. May 16, 2013 at 5:03 PM
    #17
    tacoma04

    tacoma04 Laissez les bons temps rouler

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    I was charged 12 hours labor for the gearbox rebuild and clutch $780 or $65 per hour. That is some more info for you Madjik Man.
     
  18. May 16, 2013 at 5:05 PM
    #18
    newertoy

    newertoy Well-Known Member

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    2" lift AAL and Bilstiens-front-rear,front diff drop. main drive drop
    Clutch master and slave actuator--REPLACE BOTH-If one is failing, just a matter of time before the other one goes.Pretty simple repair.
    there may be a REBUILD kit w/all the necessary components.
    The rubber washers wear out.
    If you do not get TOYOTA parts(I would) get the BEST WARRANTY product.
     
  19. May 16, 2013 at 5:05 PM
    #19
    Madjik_Man

    Madjik_Man [OP] The Rembrandt of Rattle Can

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    It is. When I ask for OEM parts they get them from the dealership with an applied shop discount which is passed on to me.
     
  20. May 16, 2013 at 5:06 PM
    #20
    tacoma04

    tacoma04 Laissez les bons temps rouler

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    The clutch parts totaled $361. I also had a rear main put in while he was in there. With over 165,000 miles I wanted that done.
     

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